New saw vise at TFWW *LINK*

Yeah, some people seem excited...

Alan DuBoff

>Wilbur,

Yeah, some folks seem excited about it, but I kinda scratch my head on this one...

This is merely a copy of an old design. While it is certainly improved from a materials standpoint (steel vs. cast for lack of better analogy), there is not much innovation in the way of creating a better mouse trap. My apologies to Joel for my comments, but I've been hoping that someone will come up with a better saw vise.

I have some ideas in regards to making a better saw vise, just that it would be a departure from any existing design, and be much improved.

I'm sure a bunch of people will buy them, but you can pick up a vintage one at a fraction of the price on the used market.

Again, not trying to poo-poo, just that I'm a bit disappointed to see what Joel came up with. Maybe if I tried it I wouldn't feel so disappointed, but I have a couple Disston 3D vises, in addition to a couple others, and think I'm set.

Reminds me of the ECE vise in regard to being a copy of an older design, although the ECE is more like a E.C. Stearns vise I have, point being that there was no innovation in design on it.

Cheers,

Alan

Re: Yeah, some people seem excited...

Joel

>Alan,

You are right it started out as a copy of an old design - but a really good old design one of the best - but aside from the materials innovation the 45 degree angle of the jaws right up to the clamping surface IS an innovation. It means you can clamp your saw right over the teeth with no vibration and file using slope with no clearance issues. Files also will last longer.

Come to WIA and give it a try!!

Zero vibration with this Disston 3D vise

Marv

>Here is a vise I modified to correct the flimsey bench clamp that is on all 3D vises that Joel speaks of. I replaced the factory made bench clamp with a bolt on base.

Marv

Re: Zero vibration with this Disston 3D vise

Joel

>Absolutely a step in the right direction!!! and the pivot on the 3D is actually sturdier than most.

Sure, I'd love to try it at WIA...however...

Alan DuBoff

>Being unemployed and on the opposite coast is not enticing for me to do so. If I was going back there, I'd be visiting my timber in West Virginia, rather than attending WIA, most likely...

Not that I wouldn't like to try your vise, just that my log home is a vice...*lol*

Nice improvement!

Alan DuBoff

>The bottom clamp is the most common failure on these vises, but many of them have been repaired and/or welded back together.

Very nice fix Marv, that looks like a solid solution.

Next generation vise

Marv

>Joel,

For your next generation vise design, you might give some thought to employing the Vise Grip type locking mechanism, including the adjustment screw for tighter clamping if desired. Perhaps you could incorporate it in your present design.

Marv

Re: Nice improvement!

Marv

>I'm working on even a more simple design that accomplishes the same improvement. It's an all welded design, heavy duty to match the large vise castings.

A lot of people own one or more of the Disston 3D, thinking they are the best of all vise. I sold one two weeks ago on eBay for $234. A few days ago two sold on eBay, one at $255 and the other for $264. People pay these high prices without knowing if the vise is worn out or not and many of them are. The cam is worn out on most of the really old ones. Mine was in nearly new condition, barely used.

Marv

Re: Next generation vise

Joel

>The current cam we use gives at least as much and I think a lot more pressure than a vise grip type clamp - and what's more you can sneak up on the pressure and use both hands to position the saw while you turn the cam lever with your knee.

So, what your saying is...

Alan DuBoff

>One really needs three hands to adjust a saw inside of it? (or two hands and a knee)

I have 2 of them myself...

Alan DuBoff

>Marv,

They are about the best vise I've used, even though they are heavy.

Those prices on ebay are scary...I don't think I've ever paid more than $30-$40 for a vise, and I have 2 Disston 3Ds, a clean E.C.Stearns (not a bad vise actually), and a Disston No. 2 (I think, I rarely use it, bought that for $5 at a local BAG-A-THON several years back.

Did those vises have the filing guides on them?

Those prices make Joel's vise look attractive at $120.;-)

Re: So, what your saying is...

Joel

>no - you can hold the saw in one hand and tighten the vise with your other like you do on a disston - but it's faster to get the saw set the 1/16 or so about the jaws uniformly if you use both hands - which I can't do on a disston and I'm not clever enough to balance the saw in exactly the right place with one hand.

Re: So, what your saying is...

Marv

>It is easy to position the blade in the vise with one hand by merely closing the jaws slightly while tilting the blade so the top edge presses against the back jaw. This allows small adjustments as you continue to clamp the blade. When one does a lot of filing, one learns these little simple tricks. *grin*

I do like your leg lever though. I file while standing, so it wouldn't work for me. I guess I could extend the lever down lower.

Joel, I get the sense that you are pretty much a one man brain stormer?

Marv

Re: So, what your saying is...

Joel

>Marv,

Actually know - check out my blog most of the work - nearly all of the work on the vise was done by my designer - I had very little to do with it.

On positioning a saw in a vise with the knee technique I can consistently get it in the right place in one go and it's just faster.

Re: So, what your saying is... trying again *LINK*

Joel

>it's actually no not know

and I forgot a link


Joel's Blog

However, Wentworths go for reasonable prices used!

Alan DuBoff

>I see a Wentworth on ebay now for $12.99 Buy-It-Now. Shipping is more than the vise, seller might be gouging on that...but still the price is reasonable.

Re: However, Wentworths go for reasonable prices u

Marv

>What I have noticed is, most all the vises other than the Disston 3D, go for cheap, but you are getting what you pay for. Try to file a big tooth rip saw in any one of them and it's usually a bad experience. People buy those things, not knowing much about what they are buying.

Marv

Re: Sure, I'd love to try it at WIA...however...

Pam Niedermayer, Austin, TX

>Why not add a little adjustable ledge for the side opposite the teeth to rest on? That way, you could get it close, move the ledge to fit, then adjust more precisely using the ledge. No?

The ledge could be anchored from the bench side of the mechanism.

Pam

true for every vise I've ever used!

paul womack

>

sheet steel

paul womack

>That's the thickest "sheet" I've ever seen; I tihnk that would normally be called "plate".

That's a very interesting product, given the apparent quality and low price.

BugBear

Re: New saw vise at TFWW

Todd Hughes

>Why would anyone pay this kind of money for something like this when good old saw vises are so common and cheap?

....A stamped sheet metal saw vise?...if the originals were stamped out and the new ones were cast iron the new ones adds would have half a page of copy about how the heavy cast iron dampens vibrations and is such an improvement over the stamped out ones...anyone doubt this?

Take $10 go to your local flea market and buy an old saw vise that will work just as well , or better!,as this one and on the way home buy your lunch with the change

Oh...just how big a problem is this wearing out of files from "vibrations" on older vises ?.....Todd

Re: New saw vise at TFWW

Marv

>Todd,

One could just hold the saw between their knees and get by without a vise. Why waste money on a vise, even a cheap flea bag flimsey one that rarely clamps the saw tight enough?

When you file saws every day, all day, you want and need good tools. I've seen and used a lot of your so called flea bag type vises. Most all are just worn out, under designed pieces of junk.

Marv

Nope, no filing guides on them

Marv

>

That's a scary price...I'm keepin' mine!

Alan DuBoff

>