Drying rough turned bowls quickly.

Verrry interesting!

Alan Tolchinsky

>Thanks Dave,

Very interesting method. What kind of scale did you use to weigh the bowls? How do you think this method compares to the more traditional method of turning thick, coating, then waiting a year? Thanks Alan in Md.

It works!

Mike Schwing from Md.

>Dave was nice enough to lay this info on me a few months ago, and I can report great success with it as well. I've taken wet maple blanks, platters, and hollow forms to dry enough to finish in just a week and a half or so.

I haven't yet come up with a method to soak really large bowl blanks but I'm working on it. Not sure I want that much alcohol on hand though!

Dave it was really hard to hold your secret, but I did it.

Re: It works!

Gil

>Wierd I was using some shellac last night, and denatured alcohol, I placed an apple wood blank in a bucket of it to see what would happen. Thanks for doing the research for me!

Cheers,

Gil

Large Blanks

Gil

>A 5 gallon bucket with a lid will work with most blanks. Anything larger would be maybe a canning kettle or something like that?

-Gil

For large bowls.

Dave Smith, Longview, WA

>Hi Mike,

Large bowls can be placed in a heavy plastic bag and then nested into a pile of shaving to conform to the bottom of the bowl thus limiting the amount of alcohol needed to cover the bottom. The inside of the bowl can also be filled to reduce the volume of alcohol needed to completely cover the bowl. That sentence does not say to do the filling on the outside of the bag. Just make sure the bag is a thick one. DAMHIKT

Thank you Mike for editing the final draft. Your comments were excellent.

Dave Smith

Sun is shinning and I am working in my shop in Longview, WA.

Make sure you wrap the bowl.

Dave Smith, Longview, WA

>Hi Gil,

The key to drying a bowl is to wrap the outside only. The inside drying faster than the outside will cause compressive stress which limits cracking and movement.

Dave Smith

Sun is shinning and I am working in my shop in Longview, WA.

Re: Drying rough turned bowls quickly.

Barbara Gill, Remlik Virginia

>Dave, this is very interestin. Usually I am not in a hurry however it is nice to know there is a method for speeding up the process if I am.

I am going to Richmond next week and will buy some alcohol and several containers.

Where would the least expensive large quanities of denatured alcohol be found, Lowes or something similar?

Thanks so much for sharing your technique.

Any hardware store for the alcohol

Dave Smith, Longview, WA

>Hi Barbara,

Denatured alcohol cost about $10 a gallon. I suggest plastic containers with snug fitting lids. You can expect to lose some alcohol with each bowl that is removed from the container. Because I add to the container from time to time I have not worried about the dilution of the alcohol.

Dave Smith

Sun is shinning and I am working in my shop in Longview, WA.

Re: Drying rough turned bowls quickly.

Gil

>Have you done any experimenting with the nightmare woods such as cherry and apple? I recently turned 20 cherry bowls and boiled them via the prescriped method. I've lost 5 bowls so far, which stinks big time. I think boiling and then anchor sealing might be the key. Also my basement might be too dry 30% Relative Humidity.

-Gil

Re: Drying rough turned bowls quickly.

Wally Dickerman at Green Valley, Az.

>Sounds like you've come up something Dave. Do you have a good answer for WHY it works?

Mike Schwing has been telling us that he's going to be showing us some wild new turnings. Do you suppose that he's come up with these ideas while he was inhaling all of those alcohol fumes?

Wally

sycamore, apple, plum, wild cherry, pecan

Dave Smith, Longview, WA

>Just to name a few of the types I have dried using the alcohol soaking method. I do not think your basement is too dry for the process to work. Wrap the outside of the bowl and place it upside down on a rack so air can circulate inside the bowl. I will post some pictures later.

Dave Smith

Get my groceries in paper bags in Longview, WA.

Wally you have a good since of humor.

Dave Smith, Longview, WA

>Hi Wally,

I was working on the drying process when you told me about your method of putting wax on the out side of turnings. That confirmed my notion that only wrapping the outside of the bowl was contributing to the success of the process. Soaking in alcohol apparently allows water trapped in the cells to migrate out with minimal stress. Nearly every turning I have shown you has been dried using this method. Including the piece of apple we turned when you visited my shop a couple years ago.

Dave Smith

Wife wants to wash cars, YUK, in Longview, WA.

Re: Wally you have a good since of humor.

Gil

>Dave do you wrap the bottom of the bowl in paper as well? Or just tightly around the outer surface of the bowl?

Thanks,

Gil

Re: Drying rough turned bowls quickly.

Mike Rubes, Apex, NC

>Hi Dave,

This is very interesting. Just curious, have you noticed any discolorations associated with the soaking? Does the wood turn any differently or sand differently after soaking?

Like most people, I've had some good/some bad luck with drying by conventional methods and would be interested in trying your method.

Thanks for the information,

Mike

A beautiful fall day in Apex, NC

Could be Wally!

Mike Schwing from Md.

>Some of the things I'm working on are on the insane side for sure. I really hope they work out like they look in my head. But don't look for them soon, more than half of this work is in the development. Volcanoes, fireworks, strange creatures, they all have a part somewhere in these things in my brain.

The truth is that these insane ideas pop into my head while I'm attending the symphony. I think the music coupled with the lack of anything to really focus on opens up my brain in ways that don't show up otherwise.

As in most off the wall ideas, they'll be a hit or a flop.

Re: Could be Wally!

Wally Dickerman at Green Valley, Az.

>Mike!... what kind of music does your symphony orchestra play? Volcanos, fireworks, Strange creatures?....Couldn't be Strauss waltz's. Must be something wild.

Wally

Discoloration is only skin deep.

Dave Smith, Longview, WA

>Hi Mike,

One of the things I wanted to know was if light colored bowls would be discolored if soaked in a solution which previously had dark wood in it. My experience has been that there is no permanent discoloration. The surface darkens with oxidation when it drys but it is turned away when the bowl is finished. The surface of an alcohol soaked bowl looks similar to a boiled bowl when it drys.

Dave Smith

Got to go do some finishing in Longview, WA.

Re: Discoloration is only skin deep.

Kevin Gerstenecker

>Dave is RIGHT on with this method. I just finished turned my first bowl today using Dave's method. I cut this Sycamore the neighbor had taken down on November 7th. Later that afternoon, I roughed a bowl and put it into Alcohol. I soaked it overnight (12 hours) and followed Dave's instruction......wrapped the outside with grocery bag paper, folded in over the rim, making taped it in place, and cut off the excess paper. I finished turned it this morning, and it stopped losing weight after 3 days! I can tell you, this bowl was DRY when I turned it today. It turned like dry wood, sanded like dry wood, and soaked up Watco Oil like you would not believe! I have about 6 more bowls in the process of drying right now, and they are looking VERY good. A little distortion, but NO cracks, and they feel and look dry. I will let these go longer than the 6 days I did with this one, but I just couldn't wait any longer! Besides that, it was DRY as best as I could tell. Sure is a revolutionary idea Dave, I really appreciate you sharing it with me when we met after Steve's BBQ.

Comparative results?

Andrew Hilton

>Have you done any comparisons with a control and a few other common methods/protocols of drying at the same time?

Re: Drying rough turned bowls quickly.

Dick Hines

>Ok I like the idea of drying bowls in a week or two. Now I want to know how safe it is to have a bucket of alcohol sitting around the shop. The safety question has not been answered or asked for that matter.

Re: Drying rough turned bowls quickly.

Jerome Laux

>Thank you for sharing. I have a couple of kitty litter buckets that I can use. I wonder if isopropyl would work??

Re: Drying rough turned bowls quickly.

Jerome Laux

>Denatured alcohol kept in a closed container doesn't pose that much of a hazard. Besides, you are only soaking the bowl or rough piece for 12 hours. The rest of the time it is drying.

You should have reasonable ventilation to your shop (exhaust fan or large open door). The explosion limits for ethanol are about 3% vapor concentration to about 25%. The flash point is relatively low (12-14 C) so it does present a fire hazard - so no open flames, and probably no sharpening (unless you have a Tormek or similar wet grinder).

Re: Any hardware store for the alcohol

Fog Tanner

>Dave,

Have you tried methonal alcohol. I usually buy that in 5 gallon quanitities from a local raceing fuel supply for at $2.50 a gallon. You can also buy it from dirt race tracks, just bring your own container.

When I get a chance I'll try your method using methonal. Thanks for the info.

Fog

Methanol is dangerous stuff.

Dave Smith, Longview, WA

>Hi Fog,

I am not too sure about methanol. It is the stuff that is used to denature ethanol. If it ain't good to drink then it can't be too good to breathe. I don't recommend its use.

Dave Smith

Not a chemist in Longview, WA.