shapening a plane blade without a jig

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

No, you don't need a jig. I was taught freehand sharpening and sharpened for twenty years before I heard of jigs. The plane irons in the Seaton chest (1796) averaged about 1/8 inch thick and tapered so they were thinner when the had some wear on them. And the chisels in the chest were often in the 0.1 inch range. We have been doing this for centuries.

Lately some have made plane irons thicker as a result of the mistaken notion that thick blades prevent tearout. They do not. Thin blades are preferable. because they are easier to sharpen. 

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Eliot, I freehand sharpen all chisels and plane blades, with the exception of high angle BU plane blades. The latter receive a high angle micro (tiny) secondary bevel, and a honing guide is necessary to create an accurate angle. 

There are three choices when freehanding bevels:

1. On the full bevel. I do this with Japanese laminated blades as it is traditional for them, and I like this added aspect. It is not necessary from a technical point of view.

2. Create a secondary bevel. This is what Cosman does. It is also what a honing guide is designed to do. I do not like this method (outside of BU plane blades) as it is difficult to strop and difficult to register a chisel bevel down.

3. My preferred method is to hollow grind first, and then hone on the hollow. The hollow reduces the amount of steel to hone, the sides act as a guide when honing, and the bevel face remains coplanar (keeping registration for BD chisel work).

It is worth noting that these methods attempt to trick the thick blades into acting like thin blades: The hard cutting layer of the laminated blades is thin, the secondary bevel on a thick blade, and the hollow grind to reduce steel.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

If a person is physically able to sharpen without a jig......meaning their hands are steady and they have good control of their muscles and limbs.....then, perhaps they should try free-hand sharpening.......but, they should expect a learning curve while developing the muscle memory and skills needed.

The reality is......many people are not that physically gifted......and would benefit from the use of a jig.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

"...as it is difficult to register bevel down ..."  The difficulty of registering bevel down for a thin blade is exactly what I was lamenting about. ( I don't seem to have trouble for a wider blade.) So perhaps we are on the same page; you use the guide to hold the tiny high angle micro bevel at the correct angle.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Are you telling me that you have no trouble registering a thin (1/8 in.) bevel to sharpen on a stone? Let's say you wanted  25 deg. bevels, and you did a bunch of plane irons that way. If the bevel angles were then measured accurately afterwards, are you saying that these plane irons will indeed all turn out very close to 25? (It does occur to me that even if they don't, it doesn't matter that much.) What I do worry about when I try to do it by hand (on thin blades) is that the blade won't get sharp --regardless of the intended angle-- because I won't be able to keep a CONSISTENT  angle. I feel that I will keep honing small angle changes that  effectively rounds over the edge. For wider blades, OK; but how do you manage it by hand on something so thin? Not trying to argue, Just want to do it right.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Eliot, I think it's time you read this hoary old chestnut, A lesson in Sharpening if you haven't already done so. I can honestly say I've never used a jig to sharpen either plane blades or chisels, whether of the various types such as bench, carving or turning. Slainte.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

"...as it is difficult to register bevel down ..."  The difficulty of registering bevel down for a thin blade is exactly what I was lamenting about. ( I don't seem to have trouble for a wider blade.) So perhaps we are on the same page; you use the guide to hold the tiny high angle micro bevel at the correct angle.

Eliot, evidently I did not explain myself clearly enough. I was not referring to sharpening, but using. A chisel with a small secondary bevel is more difficult to use bevel down. This relates to riding the bevel and then dropping it to cut. A secondary bevel can interfere here.

The action of sharpening a micro secondary bevel is about experience. It is not difficult to judge, say, 5 degrees after a period of practice. More difficult is re-sharpening at the exact angle, and some will need to restore the full primary bevel before doing so.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

It's a hoary old chestnut all right! I've been there and back. But I still would be curious to know whether or not the old Scot could feel the bevel by hand. The chestnut doesn't get into it.

My sharpening routine is indeed fairly straightforward: I start with the primary bevel of 25 degrees using a 180 grit CBN wheel and a modified Tormek jig. Then I sharpen with water stones up to 12.000 grit. I can do it all by hand;  but, and I still confess it, I have trouble feeling the bevel if the iron is thin. I try to do what Cosman does for a 30 degree micro bevel at the final stage by just raising the blade on the stone a few degrees. That used to be the end of it. Just recently, I added going to a 16,000 Shapton. I believe the old timers would approve.

I plane  mostly with an old Lie Nielsen  4 1/2 or  my newly-acquired Veritas low angle jack. And the results are just wonderful!  I enjoy using hand planes.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Eliot, it's not difficult to 'sense' the grinding angle on a plane iron or bench chisel if you use sharpening mediums that include a lubricant in the process. For instance, oil stones are lubricated with oil and I use water on ceramic stones. To finding the chisel's or plane iron's grinding angle have a thin smear of lubricant on the stone, hold the ground bevelled end of the chisel/plane iron on the stone at an obviously too acute angle and keep raising the blade until the ground bevel rotates downwards enough to squeeze a little lubricant out at the front.

With the grinding angle found you simply raise the blade a bit more to establish the honing angle. After that it's just a case of sharpen and use. How complicated anyone wants to make their sharpening routine after the basics described in my last two sentences is up to them. They can use ten stones of succeeding fineness and move on to all sorts of ever more complicated methods to refine the cutting edge to their satisfaction if that's what makes them happy. Personally, I find probably about 95% of all sharpening needs for almost all general bench work are covered through the use of a single bench stone of about 1000 grit and a bit of flipping the blade on the palm of the hand. On those occasions where I need a more refined edge I add a finer stone and a means for a bit of more refined stropping, e.g., buffing compound on a bit of leather or on a felt disk spinning in a drill. 

I can't give you an opinion on any of the sharpening routines espoused by various gurus whether they promote the use of bench stones, abrasive papers, jigs, guides, or whatever because I don't pay any attention to what they say. I just sharpen in basically the same way I was taught with a couple of additional stages as described above if I need an especially refined cutting edge. I like my sharpening routine based on the KISS principle. Slainte. 

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

I tend to sharpen everything at 30 degrees. It is hard to deviate from this angle.

Some bloggers tell beginners to rock back and forth to find the bevel, but in practice we just start right in on sharpening and feel the bevel as we sharpen. No trouble sharpening a chisel that is close to 1/16 in thickness. Most carving tools are less than 1/8 inch thick. Eighteenth century chisels were often less than 1/10 inch thick. I used an 18th century plane iron for some years that was 7/64 inches thick (probably around 1/8 when new).

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Out of habit and long established muscle memory I automatically hone/sharpen my personal tools to what I believe is the same 30º angle you describe. I don't measure it to know for sure, but long established repetition and practice suggests that's about the angle I use. It also helps that I create the grinding angle myself, and whatever that is to a degree or two either side of 25º it is consistent enough for me automatically hold tools I'm sharpening at my muscle memory's sense of 30º.

The time I use the method I described to Eliot for finding the grinding angle, i.e., raising the blade until a bit of lubricant squeezes out is when I need to sharpen somebody else's tools, especially shared tools in learning environments, e.g., colleges, where all the tools tend to be abused and neglected, usually dull to the point of useless, chipped, ground at weird angles, and so on. Frequently, the only real option in a crowded joinery class full of inattentive learners very few of which are keen to learn is just to hone as best as possible to get the tool just about good enough to do a job. Time just isn't available to do a proper regrinding job and honing when you've got learners with the attention span of gnats and the behavioural characteristics of immature five year olds, ha, ha. Slainte.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

You tip about lubricant squeezout  is especially helpful because it suggests an actual method. I will try it the next time I sharpen.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Sgian, I tried to respond to your suggestion about the lubricant squeez-out approach, but for some reason, it didn't post.What I said was that I particularly like that advice because it is actually a method. Today I tried it out on a few chisels and it works beautifully! It's a really good way to do it! But a chisel has a fair amount of area on the bevel. so for me it's a bit like working on a thicker plane iron, where I don't have the problem. I still find it difficult to feel the bevel for thin plane irons.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Eliot, thanks for the feedback. I'm pleased to hear that my tip helped. I can make another suggestion that also might help. On several occasions I've made a wee jig to help learners develop muscle memory through practice where they become adept at automatically holding plane irons and chisels at 30 degrees, or thereabouts. All it is is a piece of plywood, or similar, with two edges cut at 30 degrees to each other. Place one edge of the plywood on the stone, or whatever you use to hone, place the tool edge needing sharpened on to the stone and rest the wide face of the chisel or plane iron on the 30 degree angled edge of the plywood. Hold the tool at that angle in the manner you hold your tools for sharpening and move the jig/angle setter out of the way. Sharpen. Use the angle setter if you think you need it every now and then as you're sharpening to check you're still maintaining that 30 degrees.

A bit of time and practice should lead to developing an automatic sense of what 30 degrees feels like, at which point the wee angle setter jig thing can be chucked away. This works for any tool that has a grinding angle of anything less than about 28 or 27 degrees. Most workers aim for most common bench tools to have a grinding angle of about 25 degrees. Some people advocate different angles for other tools, e.g., for mortice chisels a grinding angle of 30 degrees and a honing angle of 35 degrees is often suggested. I can't help with bevel up planes iron angles as I don't use them so never had a need to consider how best to grind and/or hone the irons. Slainte. 

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Hi Eliot

If freehanding, have you tried a side-sharpening method ...

The advantage of this freehand method is the greater degree of face support. Compare this to the traditional front-back method where the bevel face will want to roll.

• Rock the blade until it is flat on the surface.

• Use short strokes to the end of the stone to maintain registration (the temptation is to immediately take long strokes, ala a traditional guide).

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

This method does make more sense to me in that registration along the long edge would be no problem and I could see any side to side variation more easily. As I say, I only have problems when sharpening  thin plane iron blades by hand. I have a bunch of old Stanley and Record planes that I have picked up over the years and restored, and they nearly always have thin blades. (Having followed your posts for a while now, I do have a feeling that your plane irons are not usually the thinner ones.)

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Thanks, I'll try it. I You seem to have done a good bit of hand sharpening. Is your muscle memory good enough to sharpen those old Stanley irons by hand?

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Eliot, I've only ever honed chisels and plane irons freehand, and not just my own tools, but a multiplicity of different planes, chisels, and so on. In addition to my own mostly furniture production I have taught woodworking skills at more than a few centres of learning, sometimes salaried, and sometimes on short term contracts, and at such places, as I mentioned in a post earlier, the tools available are usually a sad bunch of badly abused clunkers. You get used to improvising with the tools available to make the best of a less than ideal situation, including adapting your honing technique to somehow get the learning job done.

As to plane iron or chisel thickness and sharpening or honing, the thickness or thinness of the tool makes no difference to me regarding holding the tool at ~30 degrees for honing: my grip just seems to automatically sense what ~30 degrees should feel like. I put it down to what I mentioned in another post, i.e., muscle memory and years, no, decades of repetition. But, as I've mentioned before, sometimes you need to adapt to suit whatever tool you've been presented with. I've even been presented with plane irons that have had the tip ground at something greater than 45 degrees. I could still hone such an iron but even if I did so it would never work because of the angle of the frog being at 45 degrees in standard pitch planes - honing is a waste of time, of course. Plane irons so badly ground simply have to be reground at, typically, ~25 degrees. Slainte.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

We often sharpen knives that have a bevel that is less than 1/16 inch wide. We do this not by feeling the bevel so much as keeping the knife at a steady angle. The"rocking on the bevel" and "feeling the bevel" strategy is someone's idea of training wheels for beginners. We do feel the bevel as we sharpen, but more important is to learn to keep a steady angle with your hands. 

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Impressive! So --  and it's what I wanted to know --  is that with sufficient experience, it's possible to get the feel of it even for thin irons. So now the question is : what is the advantage of doing it by hand, by feel? Cosman says he likes it because it's a SKILL  and HE wants the credit--doesn't want the jig to get the credit. I'm not sure I really see the point. Hand cut dovetails, for example LOOK better. But if all you want to do is sharpen a plane iron, wht not just use the damn jig?

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

To follow up on this point, I often start my sharpening process using a CBN wheel with a modified Tormek guide set to 25 degrees. And I wouldn't dream of holding the iron to the CBN without the Tormek guide ( or just an ordinary fixed platform.) The same  is true when I sharpen my turning tools on the CBN. I use the Oneway set up. ALL the best turners use it. I, like others, can sharpen turning tools without such guides, but it's just crazy to do it that way. The idea is to get a good edge on the turning tool and get back to turning. (I once asked Jimmy Clews if he would sharpen his turning tools on a Tormek. He said he would -- if he was doing a five year stretch!)

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

The advantages to freehand sharpening are many. It is faster.

With a honing jig you are limited to a small portion of the stone, so you have constantly flatten the stone to make up for this. Believe it or not some flatten the stone every time, a great waste of time and stone.

With freehand sharpening, you can take long strokes, using more of the stone and you can manage the stone, evening out the wear and shaping the stone to give a smoothing iron camber. And you a lot more control over cambering in general: you can take off material just where you want to make a even arc. Not just clumsy leaning to one side. With freehand you can apply more pressure to the stone, much more control.

I think that if you can learn to write your own name, you can learn to sharpen.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

Eliot, Warren answered your questions in his 7:30 am post. I endorse everything he said. But, in truth, my experience of jigs is very limited. That's because a few learner's I've taught have turned up with jigs and asked me for my opinion. In most cases I've had a bit of a go with them but I've always found them restricting, much as Warren described, as well as being time consuming and usually finicky to set up just right.

Basically I can't be bothered with jigs, and freehanding the honing process means you can just get on and sharpen whatever needs sharpening whether they be flat tools or more awkward stuff such as gouges, carving chisels, and so on. Slainte.

Re: shapening a plane blade without a jig

I use a jig for my plane irons because I do not use the plane often enough to develop the muscle memory for excellent repeatability.  For my turning tools, I free-hand them.  However, I will occasionally use a jig to reset the grinding angles on gouges because my free-hand grind might drift over time.   Carving tools are 100% free-hand.