Suggest what tool I need

Not an expert here but 18 inches in a long way off the tool rest. If dead set on using staves instead of segmented rings I would suggest at least making it in 2 preferably 3 layers. I have made a port for a speaker box for my son. It was about 15 inches by 22 inches deep, it was done using 2 inch tall segmented rings. More time consuming but a lot easier to actually do

Sam Force wrote:

Not an expert here but 18 inches in a long way off the tool rest. If dead set on using staves instead of segmented rings I would suggest at least making it in 2 preferably 3 layers. I have made a port for a speaker box for my son. It was about 15 inches by 22 inches deep, it was done using 2 inch tall segmented rings. More time consuming but a lot easier to actually do

What I'm making is a staved drum shell. I've done a lot of segmented work - but I positively do not want that look, nor the amount of glue. I imagine it would hold up during playing but it's way too much work to chance it.

I can support both ends on the lathe to do the outside. No problem there. If I were to make a holding I'd only go in 9 inches from one side, reverse it and do the other 9 inches. Many people work much farther off the toolrest to hollow large vessels. I can actually move the tool rest in quite a ways by using a wide S rest and working off one end of the S. For that matter I could fabricate a toolrest to reach in as far as I want (more work).

 What I'd like to do is use some kind of hand tool (convex plane or spokeshave or scorp ?????) to do the inside. I need a tool that will make a fine shaving in the hands of someone having little experience with that tool. In other words - forgiving. I wonder if something like this would work?

18+" off the tool rest would normally require a 1-1/4" diameter boring bar (formula is 15 times the diameter of the bar), however, since you are doing a cylinder for your drum shell, you might turn the inside by working to 9" from each end.  The real problem, then, is how to mount the piece on your lathe, assuming, of course, that your lathe has the needed swing over the bed for the diameter of the tube or you can turn "outboard." 

I'd anticipate that if spinning a large cylinder, you're likely to need one or more stready-rests to control the flex.

Note that the more staves you use, the less you have to do to both surfaces.  Do you need a smooth interior for sound quality?

Do people not read the post that they are responding to?????

In my post that you responded to, I had already indicated I could work 9 inches at a time from each side and have a tool rest that could extend into the cylinder to decrease overhang. And my lathe has more than enough swing to handle a 13 inch diameter. Kind of obvious, in that I said I would have no trouble turning the outside of the cylinder.

I need to bring the thickness down to 3/8th of an inch or perhaps less for sound quality. And the wall needs to be of uniform thickness. I'm making a musical instrument - a stave sided drum.

I doubt a solid cylinder with a diameter of 13 inches and a height of 18 inches would have much in the way of flex. Drum shells have absolutely no flex and some have 1/4 to 3/16 thick walls. Don't think I need a steady rest. Also, how could you rig one or more steadyrests to turn outboard?

In any event, it amazes me that no one has tried to answer my question. Is there a tool I could use to avoid having to do this on a lathe? If I have to do it on a lathe I'm perfectly capable of dealing with what's involved. I posted this in the hand tools forum because I thought someone with experience with hand tools would reply to the point. Guess not.

May be time to "take a pill"

Just forget what I said.

You CERTAINLY did NOT lead with:

"Is there a tool I could use to avoid having to do this on a lathe?"

If you had there would have been NO confusion as to what you were asking!

Your tone in your last message is deplorable.

Brian Roberts wrote:

You CERTAINLY did NOT lead with:

"Is there a tool I could use to avoid having to do this on a lathe?"

If you had there would have been NO confusion as to what you were asking!

Your tone in your last message is deplorable.

In original post - if you took the time to read it - But I'm wondering if there is a tool that I could use to bring the inside to a smooth thickness of about 3/8th inch? Posted in hand tools. A lathe certainly is NOT a hand tool. In a follow up post I re-iterated and even posted a picture of hand planes. I asked absolutely nothing about lathes or turning.

What is actually deplorable is that, in a forum where you are supposed to be able come for answers, people post crap that has no relation to the question being asked and post things that you already stated, and obviously don't even read anything fully to understand what's being asked before spouting off.  It's pretty obvious that my posts weren't read.

One of the most sincere forms of respect is actually listening to what another has to say.
--Bryant McGill

That would include written or posted communication. Since questions receive only irrelevant blather, there's no point in frequenting these forums anymore - bye.

Ah, so you seek a tool, assumed to be readymade, to smooth the inside diameter of your stave-built drum tube which will also reduce the tube's wall thickness from some currently unspecified measurement to a uniform thickness of 3/8".  You seek this notwithstanding that you have a wood lathe and the tools commonly used to produce such an object.
Therefore, you appear to be a tool buyer rather than a tool maker and have rejected the eons old method of fire-hollowing/hardening drums.  I shall refrain from any suggestion or information of how the make such a hand tool which will require a significant amount of physical effort on your part well beyond what would be required with a lathe over a much longer time span

Alas, grasshopper, what you seek does not exist in the knowledge base available to you here.

Good fortune on your journey, Mr. ebd, but mind that the door doesn't hit you where you sit on the way out.

Alpha
Mike
Foxtrot
[have the t-shirt ]

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Added later 45 min 04 s:

and is AMF referring to American Machine & Foundry, makers of bowling equipment and bowling alleys??.....Ah, the good ole days, when a man could take the wife and kids out for a little family time at the local bowling center......nostalgia......

Dear admin ROFLMAO - but still leaving. Only replied to this because  got an email from admin.

First. I got my answer without even asking a question on Sawmill Creek. A simple search found a long thread discussing what I need.

Second. Mr. Mandell said "Ah, so you seek a tool, assumed to be readymade, to smooth the inside diameter of your stave-built drum tube which will also reduce the tube's wall thickness from some currently unspecified measurement to a uniform thickness of 3/8".  You seek this notwithstanding that you have a wood lathe and the tools commonly used to produce such an object. Alas, grasshopper, what you seek does not exist in the knowledge base available to you here."

Well wise Markie monk wannabe, I posted a picture of double convex planes that could be used. But more to the point, I sincerely doubt that it's common to use a lathe to form the inside of a deep staved cylinder. If it was I'd assume there would be hardware for sale to hold the tailstock end. But, alas, there isn't. (Nope, a steadyrest won't do it. It exerts no pressure against the headstock. It merely supports the side.) And I would prefer to use an existing hand tool instead of inventing a way to fix the tailstock end and still allow access to the interior for the toolrest and tool.

I knew hand tools to do this must exist because coopers way, way, way long ago made barrels with no power tools whatsoever. Same for luthiers. They accomplished this work before power was invented. Do convex spokeshaves, scorps, convex drawknives, circular planes, convex planes, and yes the travisher ring a bell? Do you even have a glimmer of an intimation what a travisher is? I thought not. So your feeble attempt at sarcasm pretty much seems to match your cluelessness. So take your sarcasm and stuff it you know where.

Sorry if I am too honest. But as I've grown older my tollerance for ... well, you can probably figure out how I would finish that sentence.

Sounds to me like someone has a t##d caught sideways. Unfortunately the world is full of such people.

Sounds to me that Mr. @ebd (a/k/a Larry Litwin?) has found a home among the Creekers where his attitude may be more welcome.
Having made a couple of 18x24 staved tubes on my lathe, it ain't all that difficult provided you know how to mount it.  Obviously, the OP doesn't.
Travishers, spoke shaves, etc. notwithstanding, he'll have a "fun" time getting the precise wall thickness he demands with hand tools.

Hey ebd,  Ignoring all the back and forth, if you have a lathe, I believe that's the best tool to accomplish your goals.  I would use a steady rest and a stout boring bar.  I recommend Advanced Lathe Tools for the parts.  Lyle Jamieson also sells deep hollowing tools, but I'm not sure he has a steady rest.

Joe

Added later 05 min 06 s:

It just occurred to me that a one-handed scorp could be used.  Also, if you do not mind the dust, maybe a 4" angle grinder with coarse paper.  In all cases, you'll need to stop and measure often.

Joe

ebd wrote:

I'm making a 13" diameter stave cylinder 18" deep (12 segments) out of mahagony. I figured a way to turn the outside on my lathe. I might be able to rig a holding to turn the inside. But I'm wondering if there is a tool that I could use to bring the inside to a smooth thickness of about 3/8th inch?

Grateful for any and all suggestions. Hopefully not too expensive.

You could use a mallet and gouge to do this work.

Not for nuthin, but when I looked, the Creek guys told him the same thing: use the lathe.

Mark Mandell wrote:

Not for nuthin, but when I looked, the Creek guys told him the same thing: use the lathe.

It is surprising how many people could not understand the original post.

Warren in Lanaster, PA wrote:

You could use a mallet and gouge to do this work.

I'd find it more than a bit difficult to be swinging a mallet inside a 13" cylinder that's 18" deep.  I suppose a scorp could do, but the OP is making a drum when the wall thickness needs to be uniform for sound quality, so going the hand tool route would be a long and tedious process.  Would be interesting to use a #3 gouge in a reciprocating air-drive handpiece, but I doubt those would be available to the OP.

ebd wrote:

I'm making a 13" diameter stave cylinder 18" deep (12 segments) out of mahagony. I figured a way to turn the outside on my lathe. I might be able to rig a holding to turn the inside. But I'm wondering if there is a tool that I could use to bring the inside to a smooth thickness of about 3/8th inch?

Grateful for any and all suggestions. Hopefully not too expensive.

While it is possible to carefully and patiently plane he inside of this 13” wide cylinder to an even thickness, if you are using a lathe on the outside, it makes more sense to do this on the inside as well. 

Turning the outside use be done first to create a reference edge. The inside is then gauged against this. If using handplanes, a long, shopmade calliper would be needed. I have done this before, so I am speaking from experience. But it is a bloody lot of work, and I would use a lathe … then finish the inside with a sander or scraper.

Regards from Perth
Derek

I suppose the original person who posted this question is long gone from this site, but I just saw this on a Facebook Reel, hollowing out sections of logs.

@ebd,

Sorry your query has turned into a jumble of missed communications. We try to avoid confrontations here.

I also apologize for not responding earlier on in this conversation. Your question was legitimate. When I read it, for some reason I was thinking you were making some kind of drum, and my mind went to congas and djembes -- not thin-walled cylinders. Then I saw your post of some really deluxe-looking compound radius planes and I got to thinking about how hand planes could be the answer after all. 

I don't know if you've ever made wooden planes, but this could be an opportunity. A plane with a sole radiused in the crosswise direction (i.e., a hollowing plane) could easily do this job for you. If the OD of your cylinder is 13" and you want the walls to be 3/8" thick, you'd want the plane's sole to be curved ideally at a 6 1/8" radius. ((13-(2*3/8)=12 1/4)/2=6 1/8)) so it will match the inside radius of the cylinder. You don't need the lengthwise radius because the sides of the cylinder are straight lines.

On the downside, making such a purpose-driven plane might not make sense if this is a one-off project, although Japanese master craftsmen typically make curved planes of all descriptions for specific radii on the various curves they need to plane. If you do this sort of work all the time, it will come easy to you.

Regards,
Ellis Walentine, Host