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Jointing and planing questions

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Jointing and planing questions

#1

Joe Fleming

OK.  Here is one for the experts.  I'm making some end-grain cutting boards from maple and cherry.  They involve two glue-ups:  long grain of strips, then they are cross cut into sections and re-glued into the end grain cutting boards.

Process:  

  1. Ripped material into long strips for initial glue-up.  Power jointed and planed faces for glue-up.

  2. Glue up strips.

  3. Cross cut plank into new strips so that each strip is comprised of small pieces of wood that are side grain glued, but exposes end grain.  These will be flipped up to expose end grain and re-glued on the side grain.

  4. Before the second glue up, I need to surface the new strips:  joint one side and plane the other.


Question:

  • The new strips are going to get jointed and planed on the side grain, but because they were cross-cut, they will run through the jointer and planer with the long grain parallel to the blades instead of perpendicular to the blades as is traditional.  Pros and cons?


Note:

  • I already jointed one side of all the pieces.  they are dead flat, but are just a bit "fuzzy".  They are not knife smooth like a long grain jointing would produce.  Do I need to sand these or does the very subtle fuzz make for a better glue bond?  Using Titebond 3.

Re: Jointing and planing questions

#2

Joe,
If I'm reading you correctly, you're proposing to try to plane stips (1-2" wide) laid sideways in the machine.  I envision exploding wood chucks flying every whichaway.  Most planer heads want at least 9-10 inches in length.

As for your glue choice, I suggest you change to epoxy (NOT the 5-min junk).  By reputation, TB-3 is degraded by water.  Cutting boards have to be scrubbed.  Epoxy, OTH epoxy will be there forever, and the fuz will only strengthen the joint.

Re: Jointing and planing questions

#3

I've made one cutting board using epoxy and noticed the joints opening up after about a week of use. It wasn't the 5-minute epoxy but I don't remember the brand. We had some extra at the commercial shop I was working at. I did some internet searches and it seemed that Titebond III was the most often recommended adhesive so I tried it. The cutting board has been fine for about five years. I believe most manufactured wood countertops are made with urea formaldehyde (aka plastic resin).

Re: Jointing and planing questions

Edited #4

I have made dozens of  cutting boards, some of them almost sixty years ago.  Most of them were edge grain, just strips glued together and planed or sanded flat.  I have used epoxy, plastic resin, Urea formaldehyde and Titebond 2 and III.  If I were to make one now, I would use Titebond III.  Most of the end grain boards were the ones made from strips, cross cut and turned on end and rotated to make a brick pattern.  Some were random triangular pieces carefully fitted into rectangular blocks and then the blocks were glued together.  Before I got a drum sander (Performax) I glued a sacrificial piece on the trailing edge of the end grain boards and ran them through my Dewalt planer.  Light passes worked well.  Without the piece on the trailing edge, the back end would explode.  The drum sander does a good and easy job of flattening the end grain ones.  I have also used a 4 x 24 belt sander.  Don't get me started on juice grooves.  

My favorite ones are round.  I glue them up end grain, cut them round on the bandsaw,  flatten one side on the lathe and cleanup the edge, turn a groove in the edge for a finger hold,  and Cock the other side so that it is sloped and the juice runs down next to the rim.  The flat side is slightly dished and is for veggies, the sloping side is for meat, nice rare juicy meat.  My lathe is big enough to make them 16" in diameter.

I have fixed defects in the surface by drilling a hole and inserting a matching or contrasting piece of hardwood dowel.  I finish them with walnut oil.  I like them to have a slightly concave surface so they rest on the four corners.  The ones for bakers to roll dough on need to be flat unless you turn them a rolling pin with a matching curve.  None of them are dishwasher safe, be sure the users know that.

Re: Jointing and planing questions

#5

Leo Cuellar

I believe you are jointing both sides of the laminated plank before crosscutting? The issue is with tearout on the ends of the pieces? Moving forward, I would suggest a finer tooth crosscut blade, using a zero clearance insert (if on the tablesaw) or sacrificial bottom board if using a chopsaw that doesn't have a replaceable insert. I would also additionally tape the cutlines with masking tape to limit the amount of tearout. Reducing the feed rate of material should also help. Light sanding or skimming with a finely set hand plane should handle any existing pieces. 

I've never tried running parallel grain through a planer or jointer, and would suggest Barry is correct.

Tightbond III is an excellent glue. the board (rescued scraps from a bowl project) in the picture below is a daily user and gets run under hot water and scrubbed with soap multiple times a day. Never in the dishwasher though!
IMG-20240203-130531349.jpg

Good luck!

Re: Jointing and planing questions

#6

Sorry, but I don't understand why you need to joint and thickness before the second glue up. you glued up the long strips, planed them and crosscut them, the flip the crosscut pieces so that the end grain is facing up, then just glue them together to get your end-grain board. Why do they need to be jointed and thickness planed?

Re: Jointing and planing questions

Edited #7

Joe Fleming

20240204-170021.jpg
20240204-165834.jpg
20240204-165753.jpg
free photo hostingAll,  The assembled strips were cut with an 80 tooth cross cut blade and zero clearance insert.  Very clean cuts.  The jointer surface was lightly rough as previously mentioned.  I took less than 1/32" per cut.  No blow-out.  The planer surface was smoother.  Again, light cuts.  No blow-out.   Overall, there was virtually no splintering.  All of the cut edges were very clean.  I am happy wit the result and was able to do the second glue-up without issue.  Titebond 3.  Cherry wood.

Added later 4 d 2 h 18 min 56 s:

OK - terrible job explain this.  That is on me.

  1. Rip strips and glue up into conventional side grain cutting board.

    1. Rip

    2. surface glue surfaces (joint one side and plane the other)

    3. glue into side grain cutting board

  2. Slice the cutting board across the grain with slices that will be turned up on end-grain and glued side to side.  Flip the slices around to get interesting pattern, color, etc.

    1. If I had a planer or thickness sander large enough to surface the entire blank, I would have done so.  I don't.  So I sliced up the blank first, then surfaced the individual strips.

    2. Slice across grain on table saw.  The slice width will be the nominal cutting board thickness.

    3. Because the ripped strips, when glued, were not completely co-planer, each strip (approximate 18" long) were passed over the jointer, then the planer to clean up each side.  This eliminated the slight variations in the original board blank and removed some of the glue squeeze out.   The first photo shows the slices still laying on the side grain indicating the direction of the wood grain and the direction that the slices will be passed through the machines.

  3. Flip the newly surfaced slices onto the end grain and arrange the slides in a desirable end grain pattern for glue up.  I selected a brick pattern.

  4. Glue up the slices into a new, end grain panel.

  5. Trim the edges square and surface the new board.  Will probably use a router in a sled with a surfacing bit.

  6. Cut the juice groove and the handle recesses if desired.

  7. Round over the edges.

  8. Sand and finish.  I'm using Mahoney's walnut oil.

Re: Jointing and planing questions

#8

Moses Yoder

just a word to the wise, end grain will really soak up water and fast. I made a nice end grainmaple board and wascleaningfish on it and dousing it with water, it bowed and cracked in about 4 hours. I like the end grain boards, just use minimal amounts of water for cleaning them.

Re: Jointing and planing questions

Edited #9

Peter Martin

Sort of related, during my tenure in the restaurant industry, I delved into the NSF regulations governing equipment in commercial kitchens. Among these standards, cutting boards held particular importance. While the prevalent perception favored plastic boards for their non-porous nature, they often displayed knife marks, fostering bacterial growth. Personally, I leaned towards wooden cutting boards, influenced by studies comparing their efficacy with plastic counterparts. These experiments involved identical use, cleaning, and storage conditions for both plastic and wooden boards, with bacterial contamination levels measured after 24 hours. Consistently, wooden boards outperformed their plastic counterparts, attributed to the inherent antimicrobial properties found in certain wood types.

Remembering this, I just sought out information on this interweb thingy about wood varieties boasting superior antimicrobial attributes and discovered the following insights:

  1. Maple: Maple wood is commonly used for cutting boards due to its tight grain structure, which makes it less prone to harboring bacteria. It also has natural antimicrobial properties that help inhibit bacterial growth.

  1. Cherry: Cherry wood is another good option for cutting boards. Like maple, it has a tight grain structure and natural antimicrobial properties.

  1. Teak: Teak wood is known for its natural oils that make it resistant to moisture and bacteria. It's a popular choice for cutting boards because of its durability and antimicrobial properties.

  1. Acacia: Acacia wood is naturally antimicrobial and has a high level of durability. It's a popular choice for cutting boards due to its attractive appearance and resistance to moisture.

  1. Bamboo: While technically a grass, bamboo cutting boards are also worth mentioning for their natural antimicrobial properties. Bamboo contains a natural antimicrobial agent called "bamboo kun," which helps inhibit the growth of bacteria.

Regardless of the type of wood you choose, it's essential to properly maintain your cutting board to ensure its antimicrobial properties remain effective. This includes regular cleaning with soap and water, thorough drying after each use, and periodic oiling to keep the wood hydrated and sealed against moisture.

Re: Jointing and planing questions

#10

“just a word to the wise, end grain will really soak up water and fast. I made a nice end grainmaple board and wascleaningfish on it and dousing it with water, it bowed and cracked in about 4 hours. I like the end grain boards, just use minimal amounts of water for cleaning them.”

The maple end grain board I made soaked up a lot of mineral oil when I oiled it - so much that I finally just stopped applying oil even though it was still soaking some up.  Wish I had weighed it before and after to see how much oil went in.  I then used a bee’s wax/mineral oil finish on it.  It just won’t soak up any water when I wash it.   I’ve probably only rewaxed it once or twice in a decade of use and it is still going strong.

Re: Jointing and planing questions

#11

Joe Fleming

Good advice, Gary.  thanks.  

I'll post pictures when I complete them.

Re: Jointing and planing questions

#12

Just an FYI - I used Titebond III for the glue and it has held up well.  Should work for you.

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