Master turner

Re: Master turner

mikeee12345

And that is right about the time it morphs into a monetized system.

Re: Master turner

Mike Stafford

I would expect there to be charges associated with the program in order for it to be self supporting.

In other crafts that have similar programs there are nominal fees for the judging. If a program such as this is to be meaningful there should be a commitment by the turner and by the organization administering it. Some costs would be expected.

Since there is no support for this idea by the turning population as a whole or by the governing organization you needn't worry about costs.

Re: Master turner

john lucas

Mike I'm just wondering why it's needed. Most art shows are juried so that sort of takes care of the quality of the art in those shows. Online is a different matter. Selling online I guess you can be any expert you want to claim you are. If your selling craftsmanship to the public such as architectural turning then your skill and reputation will take care of itself. Either you will get repeat customers because your good enough, or you won't. I guess I just don't see the need for an organization to certify master craftsman, other than to please the ego of someone.

the turning world in particular is so vast that you could be a master of some style and not be good at another or for that matter many other styles. I do a lot of different things but have never turned a Hat. I'm going to take care of that shortly.

How to recognize a master turner

Joe Fleming

A long time ago, a guy on my club explained it this way: Novice wears a t-shirt. Intermediate wears a shop apron. Expert wears a smock. Master/pro has their name embroidered on the smock. See? Very easy to distinguish.

Re: How to recognize a master turner

John K Jordan

I knew I was a novice.

JKJ

Re: How to recognize a master turner

John C Lucas

I often turn with a T shirt that says John Jordan or Doug Thompson Or Monster Tools.

No masters

Ellis Walentine

I saw it nicely summed up by a group of folks on a computer programming forum who called themselves "web journeymen, because there are no masters." I think there's a lot of wisdom and humility in that. The notion is that there's stuff that even the most accomplished craftsmen don't know, and that it is vain and presumptious to claim that you are a master of anything.

Ellis

Re: How to recognize a master turner

Rum

Geez I had it all wrong, I thought it went the opposite direction..

Beginner has an embroidered smock

intermediate has a smock, often wears it

master wears a t-shirt

guru wears nothing at all

Maybe is the difference between the formal east and the informal west coast?

Personally I'm not even a master wood burner.. heck I'm still using the old outdoor fireplace in the back yard and when that can't keep up my buddies burn pile. But hey its nice to have goals.

Re: How to recognize a master turner

John Jordan

"I often turn with a T shirt that says John Jordan or Doug Thompson Or Monster Tools."

Well, there you go!

The late Francis Whitaker, widely acknowledged as THE American blacksmith said a master blacksmith was one who could do any job that was brought into his shop.

JJ

Re: Master turner

Don Orr

That sounds interesting Mike but would the turner be judged just on the finished piece or would someone watch them do the work and evaluate technique as well? I think I remember you discussing this a while back.

Re: Master turner

Mike Stafford

Don, I can't imagine how difficult it would be to find a judge or judges who would be willing to go the shop of someone who was working on a particular step within the program.

I envisioned and based my idea upon what was being done with the various needlepoint guild master craftsman programs. They have judgings at set intervals and the person attempting the program bears the responsibility of sending their completed piece to the head judge. The head judge and his/her team meet and evaluate all the pieces submitted, provide feedback for improvement and either pass or fail that particular step. It takes 5 or 6 years for a person to work through this type of program.

Each step has to be completed before the participant receives the description and requirements of the next step. Most master craftsman programs have 6 steps and judgings are done twice a year at specific dates.

Completing a Master Craftsman program does not bestow the title of "Master" and somehow signify that they are better than anyone else as some have implied/inferred. It just means that the participant completed a rigorous set of tests and was judged to have passed/fulfilled the requirements of the program. I see it as a way for a goal oriented turner who is interested in developing his/her skills and receiving feedback from recognized "experts" in the turning field. I would love to have had this kind of feedback when I was developing my turning skills. I might be better off. It would have been great for me early in my box turning days to receive feedback from someone who knew what they were doing. My dear departed friend Ed Moore became that someone and taught me more about turning than just about anyone else. He made me a better box turner and a better turner overall. Mike Schwing also contributed mightily to my turning knowledge as he took the time to tell me how I might improve things. Mike made his assessments which were spot on based on my photos. Ed, on the other hand got to evaluate a lot of my work up close and personal.

With today's ease of making a video I could see that the program might require a video showing some aspects of the production of a piece. Why not?

Someone suggested juried shows are a way for turners to be evaluated. How does that work? I have entered many juried art shows. I have never received a critique of the work that was not accepted. How does that help me improve? In most instances when a piece is accepted into the show there is no critique of it either. If a piece is selected for placing, or receives a ribbon, the judge usually will tell those attending the opening of the show what they liked about the art but not necessarily critique and state what needs improvement. Most juried shows have little or no criteria upon which entrants are judged and virtually no feedback. About the only thing most turners who are struggling with the basics are going to receive from juried shows is rejection.

What I am proposing is a very specific way to evaluate each step of the progression through the master craftsman program. When the submitted piece for each step is returned to the participant he/she will receive a critique, an evaluation of what was good and what was bad so that improvements can be made for the next step.

Would such a program work? I don't know, it depends on how much support it received and how many chose to participate. Someone commented that it would cost money. Well, yes, it should cost something to defray the judges travel and the administration of the program and to ensure that people are seriously engaged in the program.

Re: How to recognize a master turner

Lee Buck

I took a shortcut. I wear a Lee Valley smock and put tape over Valley. Lee Buck

Re: Master turner

Brad Vietje

Guy's probably pretty good at baiting hooks, too

Safe spinning,

Brad Vietje

Newbury, VT

Re: How to recognize a master turner

Barry Irby

I have a smock Richard Raffin gave me. Does that count?

Re: Master turner

Don Orr

Thank you for the thoughtful feedback Mike. I think it's a great idea myself and wish there were a program in place. The video idea is perfect for evaluating work pieces and technique. One would indeed have to be serious and committed to the program and yes, a cost would be expected. One of our local clubs has recently implemented a "machine qualification" initiative at the workshop which is in building we do not own. This educational program involves not only turning techniques but safety instruction as well. We have had several never-turned-before people come in on our Learn & Turn evenings and just jump on a lathe with little or no instruction. Fortunately we have not had any problems. Our board of directors finally decided to devise a formal plan to give people a set program of project-based education in order to allow them to work on their own unsupervised in the shop. We are using one of the better turning books as a sort of textbook to guide the program. We are also pursuing a similar program for the other machines in the shop. This has been a long time coming and I am in full support of it and will be acting as one of the instructors and mentors. It seems to be well received so far with several people already working on the plan.

Now youna master turners apprentice

Re: Master turner

Clifton C

Yep, we knew someone would go there...