So I always wonder why 15 people can be absolutely certain they are correct when they respond to a question on a forum, no matter that there are 15 different answers. Seems there is a name for it, heard it today on NPR.
"Dunning and Kruger proposed that, for a given skill, incompetent people will:
fail to recognize their own lack of skill
fail to recognize the extent of their inadequacy
fail to recognize genuine skill in others
recognize and acknowledge their own lack of skill, after they are exposed to training for that skill"
Oh oh, now I'm worried about my answers! LOL Oh the creative human mind!
Flip side: The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
New converts are often the most zealous, and this excitement can carry over into giving advice as if they think they know something. Later it may occur to them how much they didn't actually understand. I have had this feeling, and wonder -- when I feel qualified to comment/teach a topic -- if maybe I'm just fooling myself?
I think this explains why some YouTubers spout off with definitive answers, when clearly they have lots more learning curve to climb themselves.
I think about this almost very time I post a reply, especially in response to a "how to" or "why" question. Am I correct? Is my experience insufficient or skewed? Am I simply repeating something I read which may be incorrect? How many have far better ideas? How much is knowledge and how much ego? Am I contributing something or just wasting bandwidth? Will at least one person care?
I try to stick to what I have learned from experience, education, or careful research - NOT two minutes with Google! However, every public post invokes a risk.
I know many people read messages and never post a response. It is from shyness or wisdom? (Or because they have better things to do?)
In the balance, I am glad for those who do post even if some may need filtering. Otherwise, WoodCentral would be as dead as some other forums I've visited.
Thought-provoking stuff, for sure. Vis-a-vis forum discussions, it brings to mind one of the basic observations I've made about this medium for decades now, namely that the forum format is necessarily populated by people of all levels of competence and experience, and that this has positive and potentially negative impacts. On the positive side, the variety expressed in those 15 responses of yours, most likely examine more aspects of a given topic than one person's didactic pronouncements can or ever will. My presumption has always been that this "look around" the subject stands to a) provide a more complete understanding and b) open up more discussion on the topic.
I imagine that not all forums are alike, though I confess that I don't get out much. But, what they all have in common is that they tend to attract persons with at least some common denominator, whether it be expertise, voice, philosophical outlook, social skills, outside interests or other unspoken commonality. I suggest that these shared traits don't negate the value of the colloquy, or necessarily color the individual responses. By hanging out with a group of regular visitors or members for a while, we all learn whose expertise we tend to give greater credibility to. But, we often aquire a broader understanding by reading the other replies, many of which aren't so much differing as they are tangential to the conversation. These digressions and alternate opinions can add a wider perspective without negating the most expert opinion. If anything, they underscore the fact that not even the most authoritative opinion is infallible or all-encompassing.
Personally, I never try to have the "last word" on any topic, as I don't believe there really ever is one. We're here to inform, question and challenge each other, not to compete or try to prevail. I learn something every day here, and I suspect I always will. This level of interaction is what gives this forum its unique personality. It's the unspoken undercurrent of mutual respect here that encourages people with anything to say to say it. And, yes, the vast majority of our visitors stay on the sidelines. I've estimated that for every poster, there are a hundred lurkers, eager to partake in the exchange but presumably not confident or experienced enough to venture an opinion one way or the other.
We're all sorting out our personal take-aways in these discussions. That's as it should be. That is why we're here, Dunning-Kruger effect notwithstanding. Even the underinformed may have something valuable to tell us. And it's a welcome humility and courtesy of the well-informed to underestimate their own expertise.
Yet another nosebleed. I don't know what gets into me these days....
So I always wonder why 15 people can be absolutely certain they are correct when they respond to a question on a forum, no matter that there are 15 different answers. ...
These people are really annoying to those of us who do know the correct answers to everything.
How many internet forum members does it takes to change a light bulb?
•1 to change the light bulb and to post that the light bulb has been changed
•14 to share similar experiences of changing light bulbs and how the light bulb could have been changed differently
•7 to caution about the dangers of changing light bulbs
•1 to move it to the Lighting section
•2 to argue then move it to the Electricals section
•7 to point out spelling/grammar errors in posts about changing light bulbs
•5 to flame the spell checkers
•3 to correct spelling/grammar flames
•6 to argue over whether it's lightbulb or light bulb ... another 6 to condemn those 6 as stupid
•2 industry professionals to inform the group that the proper term is lamp
•15 know-it-alls who claim they were in the industry, and that light bulb is perfectly correct
•19 to post that this forum is not about light bulbs and to please take this discussion to a lightbulb forum
•11 to defend the posting to this forum saying that we all use light bulbs and therefore the posts are relevant to this forum
•36 to debate which method of changing light bulbs is superior, where to buy the best light bulbs, what brand of light bulbs work best for this technique and what brands are faulty
•7 to post URL's where one can see examples of different light bulbs
•4 to post that the URL's were posted incorrectly and then post the corrected URL's
•3 to post about links they found from the URL's that are relevant to this group which makes light bulbs relevant to this group
•13 to link all posts to date, quote them in their entirety including all headers and signatures, and add "Me too"
•5 to post to the group that they will no longer post because they cannot handle the light bulb controversy
•4 to say didn't we go through this already a short time ago?
•13 to say do a Google search on light bulbs before posting questions about light bulbs
•1 guy who uses the search, then bitches that the search found nothing about light bulbs.
•1 forum lurker to respond to the original post 6 months from now and start it all over again.
•1 mod to lock it down after it goes off-track for the nth time...
I often wonder what would make someone video record their "capabilities" for everyone to see? Do they really think the world needs another video of someone tearing wood off while "cutting" in against the grain?
I honestly think that cell phone cameras make it too easy. I wonder how eager people would be to post videos if they were "rated" by their peers? I'm betting that getting a D or an F would cause reflection
I remember one video on the skew where the guy spent 5 minutes at the beginning telling you how putting the remote control for the tv in a plastic zip lock bag kept the dust out.
The Dunning - Kruger test only sets about quantifying a persons self assessment of ability.
We have known for some time of an observation made by Laurence J Peter of "hierarchically organized systems in the human society" that "people rise to the level of their incompetence" and that "work is accomplished by those employees who have not yet reached their level of incompetence."- the Peter Principle.
