Papa Grizzly sent a message!

Re: Papa Grizzly sent a message!

cranskin

Thanks for the update. Nice to see them try and make things right.

Too bad he didn't talk to customer service first

Dick Coers

I read at least one person that said customer service is still passing on the message that it's too bad that the owners don't like the tool rest height. Shouldn't the president tell customer service he might be going to fix this before posting a statement on an internet forum? Customer service has been all over the place with answers on this machine. You also can't convince me he didn't know about this sooner and just happened to find out from someone on the forum. This looks to me like another short cut for Grizzly. The customer gets to be quality control, service technician, and now machine designer. Sorry Roger, doesn't impress me that he contacted your forum. It would impress me more if he said he was going to institute a development plan for all new machines and have real customer input before sending the machine into production. Also, that they would be improving packaging and quality control. You know, fixing problems before it gets in the hands of the customer.

Re: Too bad he didn't talk to customer service fir

Roger Chandler

I would think that now that he has read the comments from customers for himself and understands the issues, that directives will be coming down the chain of command.

When they get the new parts design finalized, then they will proceed to have them put into production.

This may take a few weeks,or maybe a coule of months perhaps, but they are trying to be responsive to customers, and I am willing to give them credit for that.

Re: Too bad he didn't talk to customer service fir

Dale Miner

The better approach would have been to talk to woodturners during the design phase of the machine. By woodturners, I am referring to those that make a significant portion of their income from woodturning. Hobbyist turners with a limited exposure to the craft/art really don't have the depth of experience to provide the insight into what makes a wood lathe a 'good' machine.

A brief look back into the design of the 3520 finds that approach, and despite the higher price tag over the Grizzly offerings, it is still the best machine for the money (I recently sold my 3520b after buying a used 2436).

I know a couple people with Grizzly lathes, and they are dissapointed with the machines for a variety of reasons.

The old addage "You get what you pay for" is pretty tough to get around. To some, the nuances are not enough to be an aggravation, and the lower price overides those nuances.

For me though, the higher cost for a well thought out well built machine becomes a small price to pay for the lack of those deficiencies (nuances).

Gotta wonder.....

Brian Roberts

.......is it their plan to reimburse you for the time and money you have spent to correct the deficiencies in the Grizzly lathe you purchased?

To whom it may concern

Ron Bauer

I just looked at the list of sponsors for this site and no where did I see Grizzly as a supporter of our community. If they are going tout their products here, whether it be directly or via a proxy, Papa needs to put his paw in his pocket and buy advertising. A frank and open discussion about equipment virtues and drawbacks is clearly within the scope of this forum. Constant waving of ones banner is not. This of course is just my opinion.

Re: To whom it may concern

Roger Chandler

Just for the record........in NO way am I acting as anyones agent nor advocating anyone purchase any equipment from anyone! I have ZERO affiliation with Grizzly or anyone else.

The comments I have made are simply in response to comments of other posters, some of which my like Grizzly or some of which may have completely different feelings towards them........no advocacy whatsoever, just a discussion of one of their products.

Re: Too bad he didn't talk to customer service fir

Roger Chandler

Dale, unfortunately no one can change what is past, but changes can be made going forward, and I applaud the fact that Mr. Balolia is trying to do that because he wants his customers satisfied with this new lathe........when they get the new banjo designed and manufactured it will bring this lathe up where it should be.

So.....still wondering.....

Brian Roberts

do you believe it is their plan to reimburse you for the time and money you have spent to correct the deficiencies in the Grizzly lathe you purchased?

And will they upgrade those who have already purchased the substandard (IMO) machines?

Re: So.....still wondering.....

Roger Chandler

They have not announced any "plan" as of yet, with Mr. Bololia just sending that message yesterday that they will address customers concerns.

I personally am not concerned with any type reimbursement........I got the aftermarket items on my own iniative, without any direction or guidance from anyone else. If they can use my modifications to make this lathe function better, that is fine with me.....my interest is for all the customers having the best unit this has the full potental of being. I am happy with that result.

Re: Papa Grizzly sent a message!

David DeCristoforo

Hallelujah! Maybe this ridiculous "issue" can be put to rest now? (no pun intended)

I think if I see one more thread about the Grizzly banjo, I'm going to kill myself (for those who would like me to kill myself, this could be one way to get to see it).

So after months of having people complain and send emails and make phone calls all of which have been met with "Huh?", and after dozens of posts on every woodworking forum on the internet, eliciting literally thousands of responses (albeit many of them by the same person) the guy finally "notices" all of this and says he will do something about what should have never been an issue in the first place (as many exuberant exclamation points as you wish here) and he is suddenly a hero? Is he going to reimburse you, Roger for the money you laid out trying to correct the problem? Not only your machine shop costs but the price of the Oneway banjo? Not to mention the countless hours you have spent discussing this issue? And the others who have followed your suggestions and laid out their cash to "fix" the same problem with their machines? I doubt it.

So lets just say "praise the Lord" and give it a rest? (again no pun intended).

Re: So.....still wondering.....

David DeCristoforo

That may be. Apparently you have plenty of time on your hands as well as the financial resources to invest in machine work and expensive aftermarket tool rests and banjos and the like. I'm not so sure that the many others who have bought into this problem feel the same way...

Re: So.....still wondering.....

Roger Chandler

David......perhaps I did not speak clearly enough. I was not referring to any financial reimbursement, for my troubles, but yes, I do want the new banjo/toolrest when they get it made.

As for the every woodturning forum known to man......nah! I mostly posted about this on SMC, and tried to keep my posts here on WC to a minimum, and what I did post here was basically in response to some who had made comments about the discussion over on SMC. I was asked one question on WTU by Bob Rotche, that I answered, if I recall correctly, but have for the most part kept the fray to SMC, and would love for it all to end and be done with the whole thing..........especially here!

So, if I get no other comments about it, then I am more than happy to let it rest [no pun intended of course!]

Re: wondering.....

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In New Jersey

A. He shouldn't; and

B. Absolutely not. They have no such right. The manufacturer may respond to feedback with design changes in later models, but early adopters in everything take the risk of missing out on later improvements

Such a design "defect" could be easily discovered by a hands-on inspection of the machine before purchasing it. If people are going to make such a purchase blindly with no experience with the actual tool, they have only themselves to blame. "Caveat Emptor" still rules the marketplace, folks.

Praise the Lord, indeed!

Mike Stafford

I am sickened that this stupid Grizzly lathe mess has now been carried over to WC. As soon as certain people get involved you can expect a never ending stream of blather about this ridiculous poorly designed and over touted machine and virtually any other topic about which they think they are experts.

Caveat emptor indeed. The real problem is who was touting this lathe in the first place. People who bought this thing should send the bill for any modifications to make it a functioning lathe to the person who made all the posts assuring everyone that it was equal to the 9 PM 3520's, Robust American Beauty and Jet 1442's he has turned on.

Re: Praise the Lord, indeed!

Bill Jacjsonville, NC

Went to sponsor link here and do not see many tool importers listed there. From post on various message boards cannot think of a woodworking equipment importer or vendor with really great CS, technical assistance or QC.

Life would be great if could drive up to a store with good refund & exchange policy and buy our wood lathes and other woodworking machines. Today’s limited warranties, restocking fees, and shipping if required make tool buying a crap shoot. Great if everything works right out of the box, but can be a real nightmare if not.

If go to that China web page will find Grizzly’s G0766 with different color. If look you can order to specs, so if Papa Grizzly said will look into fixing the tool rest just might happen down the road.

http://burtgroup.en.made-in-china.com/product/ueMmJYgPmoAn/China-Variable-Speed-22X42-Wood-Lathe-with-Taiwan-Delta-Inverter-MC2242VF-.html

In your world maybe....

Brian Roberts

but for most of us there is no local dealer to see the machine prior to purchase....for Powermatic or Grizzly so we must depend on pictures in ads....and the manufacturer's reputation....to provide what is reasonable to expect.

It would not even occur to me to wonder if the manufacturer would include a banjo that ....by all industry standards...is too small for the lathe.

So........

A. He certainly should.....and

B. Positively.....absolutely .....Grizzly should step up and make the "early adopters" whole....as it relates to well accepted industry standards!

But.....hey...your world and mine are clearly different places.

My World

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In New Jersey

I looked long and hard when I decided to graduate from the JET 1236. I haunted turning forums and hunted up people or stores who had a machine that was on my "list". If I couldn't find one within 100 miles, it got crossed off the ballot. Oneway, Powermatic, Poolwood, Record, Stubby, Serious, Nichols, I forget the rest. With a bit of effort I found people not too far from my "world" who had machines I could actually touch and gauge for myself; even some I could turn on (with a gift of wood, of course). Takes a bit of time, but I got just exactly what I wanted and could use.

That said, it is common knowledge that Grizzly Tools are not in the same league as machines by Powermatic let alone Oneway, Robust, Stubby and such. If you think you're going to get a Powermatic for the price of a Grizzly, you're not living in the real world. If you buy into some cast iron merchant's line of palaver and puffery, you're cruising for some serious disappointment from which nobody's going to rescue you.

Brian, every salesman maintains his product is better than sliced bread; that's his job. If you can't cut through all that, there are several bridges and a whole lot of South Florida real estate on which you can get a deal. Doesn't mean it's fraud; it's just a sales pitch.

If you make a bad buy, make the best of it and learn so you don't get tagged again. You get a lathe at a much lower price, but with a funky tool holder? Get/make a better tool holder and now you've got a better machine to work on. If you don't get soaked for the new part, you're still ahead of the game, and Grizzly has lost a repeat customer. Drop them a note telling them so, and move on.

Cut out the middle man...

Geoff Whaling

who hasn't listened to customers requirements, doesn't offer any decent response to customer service, ignores customer complaints and has no viable solution yet for his customers issues, despite this lathe being an off the shelf item supplied to literally dozens of small importers all over the world.

Your answer, get ten purchasers in your region together and import the things yourselves. Specify the must haves you require & negotiate your own deal.

A while back a small importer here in Australia obviously had a deal go wrong and was offering similar machines for around $800 new in crates.

Re: Papa Grizzly sent a message!

Roger Chandler

This is the latest from Shiraz Bololia.......

Shiraz Balolia

Shiraz Balolia is offline Contributor

Join Date

Nov 2005

Posts

392

Quote Originally Posted by Dok Yager View Post

This is great news! Even if it takes a number of months at least they are aware and trying to resolve the issue. Thank you Mr. Balolia!!

No, "Thank you", fellas! If it wasn't for this thread we would not have had the best and acceptable fix.

Rather than do a banjo only 3" longer, we decided on a 5" longer one in case it was used in a slightly angled position on the lathe bed. Rather than make a new tool post we decided to lower the banjo post so the tool post can sit lower. Our Engineering department is drawing it up and making sure that the casting thickness underneath the banjo is beefy enough. As soon as I have a drawing I will post it.

Our distribution manager is also reviewing the packaging, again, to make sure that damage is reduced. Cannot guarantee 100% damage free as there are certain sub-carrier terminals that have people that just don't care. Anytime there is a damage, we lose money, so we have a financial interest in making sure machines reach their destination intact.

Re: So.....still wondering.....

David DeCristoforo

You were perfectly clear. You stated that "I personally am not concerned with any type reimbursement...". This may be a commendable position for you to take but I was attempting to point out that others might not have the resources in time and money to be quite so generous. The idea that their losses might be worthy of consideration by the company in question is not an unreasonable one, at least to the extent that they should be provided with the proper components ASAP and with no expectation that they should feel in any way indebted to the manufacturer for resolving an issue that should never have existed to begin with. An old German cabinet maker I used to know would say "Never you have time to do it right... but always you find time to do it over..."

Bloviate on!

Mike Stafford

There is no end to this ridiculous Grizzly issue. We have already been told on another forum that you have achieved "Banjo nirvana." Nevertheless you have to continue to talk about this poorly designed piece of equipment.

Once Roger gets started he will post as long as he can see his name on the screen.

Consider this a bump Roger so you can post again.

Re: Bloviate on!

john lucas

Actually I'm enjoying finding out that Grizzly seems to care. How many other companies have responded to posts about their equipment. I know there are many lathes out there that have the banjo too high to properly lower a tool rest so you can do a good pull cut. The Jet 16" comes to mind. By offsetting the portion of the banjo that holds the tool post like Powermatic did for the 3520B you have plenty of room to lower the tool rest. Of course I'm one of the rare ones that raises the tool rest way above center to turn beads on platters (and my mirrors) A lot of tool rests have too short of a tool post to accomodate this. That's because the banjo sits over the center locking rod and to get the tool rest to go low enough to get it at least to center they have to cut the tool post short. The Powermatic design allows both.

And Then

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In New Jersey

there's the Stubby design that lets you rotate the tool post through 360° on the banjo and relocate it end-for-end for maximum flexibility . .