>So the guy at my local hardware store sells an oil for 2 cycle engines that claims you can use it in any engine, regardless of the mix the particular engine calls for. I've used it in my lawn-boy lawnmower and my husky leaf blower, with no apparent problems.
With the arrival of the new chainsaw, though, i'm suddenly a bit more cautious. Those of you who have more than one 2 cycle machine, what do you do? Do you keep a separate mix for each, or do you follow the one-mix-fits-all approach?
>If you read the manuals that come with each of your tools carefully, you will probably find that the ratio of oil to gas varies greatly from tool to tool. Cheap 2-cycle engines like those found in $75 leaf blowers usually require more oil per gallon of gas, a ratio of say 40 parts of gas to 1 part oil. Higher quality 2-cycle engines like those found in chainsaws and outboard motors usually require less oil per gallon, say a ratio of 100 to 1. Use too much oil and foul the spark plugs. Use too little and maybe permanently damage the crankshaft bearings. I'd play it safe and follow the instructions for each tool.
>I would think the mower would be 4 stroke and not need gas oil mix. As for the others, I use the same mix in our business equipment. We own a landscape maintenance company with 5 crews all using blowers, chainsaws and trimmers. This is a stetement of what we do and not a recommendation. I would check with the vendor of the equipment and be sure not to void the warrantys. The dealer may also input their recommendations.
>There's NO WAY I'd run any 2 cycle engine with a 100:1 mix! I raced motocross for several years, and those 250cc engines were definitely much higher quality than a chainsaw. Run a good quality oil mixed @ 40:1, no richer than 50:1.
>My leaf blower (Homelite), chainsaw (Stihl), string trimmer (Stihl), rototiller (Mantis, Echo engine), and snow blower (Toro) all recommend 50:1 ratio. I use the Stihl 2.6 oz bottles - 1 bottle to 1 gallon gas. I prefer the Stihl oil mainly because it already has a gasoline stabilizer in it. Besides, my dealer gives me a pretty got deal on it by the six-pack.
>Since I hate my Weedeater but love my Stihl, and only have one can for 2 cyle mix, the Weedeater is going to have to be happy with the Stihl oil mixed at 50:1. I like the idea of the stabilizer in the Stihl oil.
>I have always used Stihl Chainsaws, for more than 25 years now, and I have always used Stihl 2 Cycle Oil. I have had no problems using this formula. One thing my Stihl dealer does recommend however is the proper gasoline. They suggest, as does Stihl, using gasoline without ethanol if you can get it. (Regular grade, 87 octane is fine, and is what Stihl recommends.) Fortunately, in our area (St. Louis Metro) we have a chain of service stations/quick shops that does offer Gasoline without ethanol. Also, Stihl suggests keeping the mixed gasoline no longer than 6 to 8 weeks. Due to the refining methods used today to meet the EPS emissions standards, gasoline does not stay "fresh" as in once did. I have no personal knowledge of these claims, other than I follow these suggestions, and have no problems with my Stihl Chainsaws, or other 2 cycle equipment. It works for me!
>I used to work on 2-cycle motorcycle engines, and have put 1000's of hours on my chainsaws without ever having to split the crankcases. My advice would be to run the same mix, but use the richest oil to gas mixture that is recommended for your various equipment. That is, 40 to 1, rather than 50 to 1.
With modern, electronic ignition systems you shouldn't have to worry about fouling spark plugs with a richer oil mix. You might gain a little horsepower by leaning out the oil, but remember that the oil in the fuel mix is the ONLY lubrication that the crank and rod bearings get. I lean toward better lubrication, particularly for high rpm engines.
>I keep two 1 gallon tanks for oil/gas mix. I do not know the ratio, but I use 2.6 oz per gallon in the chainsaw. I use 4 oz per gallon in the weedeater and kids motorcycle. No concerns with either in over 10 years.
Although the chainsaw oils have stabilizer on them , they still go bad after a couple months, I recommend adding the proper amout of "Sta-bil" fuel stabilizer, use the recommended ammount for short term storage and double that for long term storage.
I make a ritual of adding the 2 cycle oil and the extra stabilizer to the can before adding the gas. I cannot get gas without ethanol in this island and even so the gas keeps well with the Sta-bil.
I do my chain sawing in fall or winter (mostly) and so the chain saw sits for long periods, but starts readily.
Around here using a chain saw can be a fire hazard when the ground is dry, and I live in and love the woods, so I don't want to burn them.
>Kevin do yourself a favor, use the gas / oil mixture and grade that the engine manufacturer recommends. You won't be sorry, experiment with different mixtures and your playing with fire. Don't laugh but I have three different mixtures (3 jugs) here as well as one jug for pure gas. Be sure and place a large tag on each jug. I keep a tag on mine with a note on the tag noting what piece of equipment each mixture can be used in. Kevin make sure those that use the different equipment are aware of the different fuel requirements. I worked at any later managed and engine rebuilding company, we rebuilt both gas and diesel engines two horse power - several thousand horse power and I want to tell you I could write a book on the horror stories that I have experienced with improper lubrication.
>If it is "smokeless" or 100 to 1. Also, use only the brand the manufacturer recommends or you will have warranty problems. You are talking pennies, not dollars, so get the brand called for.
>Your hardware store OWNER if he will give you a written guaranty to replace the saw if it doesn't work as he says . . .
"Whoa, Hoss, I just sell this stuff according to the manufacturer's instructions! I m'self an' it's fhine, but I yain't no warranty guy. Sez right thar own tha bottle "Fer all 2 cicle en-jines,' so thet's why I carry it."
You saw is specifically engineered, right down to the alloy of the metals used in the piston, shaft, and cylinder, to use a specific concentration of lubricant to fuel. Depart from that at your own peril with the understanding that doing so voids your warranty and the manufacturer, with its extensive research and data-base on lubricant failures, will know instantly what happened.
One thing that has not been mentioned is that you should not store gas in your saw; it is the single most major cause of saw engine repair. If you're not going to be using your saw for more than a week, drain the tank back into your gas can, and pull the starter several times with the ignition to "off" to clear the lines and carborator. Gas left in the saw will rot the fuel lines and gum up the needle valves and piston rings.
By all means use a gas stabilizer. This is especially true for ethanol and/or "oxygenated" fuels as they degrade rather quickly. Don't feel bad about dumping old fuel either. Many Public Works departments have drop-off points for used motor oil as well as old gas (including gas/oil mix); check with your local agency or recycling program office.
>There is always much confusison and disagreement on this topic. From discussions about this elsewhere, it seems to me the reason for the different mix recommendations is due to differences in the oil, not the engines. For example, a newer (better) oil can be safely used at 50:1 in an older engine that came with a 25:1 recommendation. It appears that the correct ratio to use is based on the oil iteself rather than the engine, i.e., mix the oil as per the instructions on the oil.
This note came directly from Stihl, posted on the TractorPoint forum:
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The Stihl oil produced today we feel is better than the oil produced in the past. We recommend
mixing the oil at a 50:1 ratio. Mixing the oil at a 25:1 is not recommended. Using the 25:1 ratio can lead to excessive carbon deposits and insufficient cooling.
Thank you again for the e-mail.
Sincerely,
Kris Williams
Technical Advisor
Stihl Inc."
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In other words, use the new Stihl oil at 50:1 but do NOT use lesser oils at 50:1. If you want to run at the 25:1 or 16:1 ratio recommended when your engine was new, it might be best to find and use the kind of oil widely used then.
My Stihl/Husky dealer actually recommends using Sten Mix instead of the mfr's brands. I understand it is also a synthetic oil. The Sten is mixed 50 ml oil to 5 liters gas (100:1) and it claims it is for "All 2-cycle engines", contains stabilizer, and works with alcohol-gasoline fuels. The oil is made by Interlube International to ISO-EG-D+ rating: http://www.opti2-4.com/opti-2.htm and http://www.opti2-4.com/technology.htm
When pressed on this, the dealer said this is the best oil he has found and would stand behind that mix in all 2-cycle engines. I've been using it in two saws for a couple of years now with hard use and no obvious problems. The spark plugs stay clean, no clouds of smoke, the engines start easily and run with plenty of power, and there is no overheating even when run hard all day.
Note that the same discussions happened with the motorcycle racers years ago. These guys push their engines to the extreme. The racing teams all switched over to new synthetic oils run at a much leaner oil mixture.
>How do you tell if a brand of gasoline has ethanol in it? I get my gas from the local Exxon and have seen no mention if ethanol anywhere around the pumps.
>Are Opti 2 and Sten Mix the same thing? The url in your message is for opti 2, which is the oil i was talking about in my original post. Google sent me to stens.com for sten mix, but i couldn't find the oil listed on their site.
I think the Sten Mix 2-cycle oil is Opti-2. The Sten Mix label indicates "A product of Interlube International. Made exclusively for Stens Corp" The label also indicates the E-GD+ spec, as does the Interlube site. To be sure, you could try contacting Stens and/or Interlube.
I found the oil on the Stens site, but no technical details other than "TC3 rating":
Not meaning to flame a possibly good product, but I went to Interlube's site and searched diligently for anything even hinting that a) the product meets saw makers' specs and/or b) the company will pay for damage to your saw's engine. I would think that if their product is actually the wonder their site says it is, there would be some warranty compliance and guaranty information. Since it's not there, my naturally suspicious nature imparts "use at your own risk" or similar disclaimers.
>john, a Stihl dealer a few years ago sold me on some 100:1 mix. He claimed it was better than Stihl oil (which I had already sat on the counter to buy). 5 gallons of mix later my Stihl chainsaw would not run. I took it back to the same dealer and he said the piston was burned. I put it back in a box and took it to another dealer and had him check it. This second dealer told me the saw was burned up due to lack of lubrication. I contacted Stihl headquarters and they said the dealer knew better than to recommend the 100:1 mix. To make a long story short, Stihl had me send my saw to them in Orlando and they rebuilt it, NO Charge, then they pulled the dealership from the guy who recommended it to me. Please contact Stihl and give them the name of the dealer who recommended the 100:1; they will receive a call from Stihl.
>For any Stihl equpiment, regardless of age, they recommend the 50:1 mix of their newest formulation of oil. They also recommend mid-grade 89 octane, as local variations in gasoline quality might cause problems if using the lower grade 87. No extra fuel stabilizers needed, but they recommend you ditch the mix after 60 days, whether it's in the tank or still in the gas can. Finally, use of a synthetic oil will void the warranty if the engine fails because of inadequate lubrication.
That's enough for me; i've got too much dough tied up in two stihl machines to risk messing them up with the wrong fuel mix. If i have to have three gas cans, i'll use three gas cans.
Thanks to everyone for your replies. As always, a wealth of information.
Oh, and i was surprised to learn that Stihl rhymes with "steel" and not with "still."
