electrical problem

Re: electrical problem

Lee Dale

>John

I assume (dangerous word) all of the old circuits work since you sent a message on the computer. Are you using the same brand of breaker? Sometimes when using similar breakers they appear to go in the seating notch but do not snap tightly over the bus bar in the panel box, hence no juice..... Lee

Re: electrical problem

Dick Hines

>John be very careful. It shound like you lost one of the legs to your box. If that is the case you may find you have voltage on the ground. Not a good thing.

I had that happen to me a while back. I was in the shop turning with the dust colocter on. The phone rang and I shut every thing down so I could hear. When I turned the lathe back on, or should I say tried to turn the lathe on nothing worked.

Went to the breaker box in the house and every thing was good. Nothing in the shop. Called an electriction and between the both of we found I had set a fince post right on the lines to the shop. Where else would you set a fince post.

I had nicked the one of the wires and over time it had gone bad. The surge of turning the lathe back on had burned one of the hot lines in two. If you have not been setting fince post check your conections to make sure they are tight.

GROUND MAY E HOT BE CAREFUL!!!!

Re: electrical problem

Barry Irby

>John,

It sounds like your failed to properly reset the main. Check in your main panel and see if you have 120 to ground on both of the buss bars and 240 from buss to buss. If you turn only one side back on you have 120 only, but it may back feed through 240 devices such as a water heater or anything else with a heating element. You may find that some of your circuits in the house are dead or partially energized by being back fed. Some lights may be dim.

Try resetting the mains again.

Another possibility is that the new breakers are not compatible with the circuit box. Did you buy the exact brand and model of the panel or did you try one that should be compatible or universal?

Can you figure out how far the current makes it? Do you have 240 across the main incoming lines? Does it exit the panel on the breakers? Does it arrive in the new shop? I once had a transformer go bad and the local power company was only delivering 120.

And Dick is right, be careful, it is possible to have an imbalance in the system and feed current onto the grounds or neutral.

Barry Irby.

Re: electrical problem

john Lucas

>Thanks guys I'll look further tomorrow. I don't think it went to ground. I don't think it's the circuit breakers because I measured from the contact points where there weren't any breakers.

I don't know how to describe this but there are 2 screws right below the main ciruit breaker. I can read from one of those and I will get 110 on every other breaker I'll say 1,3,5 etc. If I measure from the other screw I will get 110 on 2,4,6 etc. If I measure from the neutral wires I only get 110 on 1,3,5 etc not on 2,4,6

Is it possible for the main circuit breaker to go bad? I agree it seems like I've lost a let somehow. This is a seperate box in the detatched garage. I crawled under the house to see if there was a seperate breaker or something and couldn't find where the wire goes from the main incoming to the house to the garage. Maybe I was just too tired.

Re: electrical problem

Mike Brazeau

>John - did you install a pony panel in your workshop or are these breakers added to your main panel? If it is on your main panel, you should be losing a whole bunch of existing circuits on that leg that is indicating zero. Could be as indicated in one of the other responses that the breakers are not clipping on to the one side of your 240. Got to be careful in panel boxes. One slip here or there and there is a lot of current available.

Mike

Re: electrical problem

Wood Spinner

>John

I hate to say it but if you do not know enough to see what you did wrong you need an electrition.

You may get it to work and it still may not be to code. If you have a fire the ins. company looks at wireing first. If there is any problem they may denie your claim and you get squat.

Good turning and be safe

Bill in Casa Grande, AZ.

Re: electrical problem

john Lucas

>Mike

I'll check the breakers tomorrow. I was pretty sure I bought the same thing but not sure they are the same brand. I've done this in my last three workshops with no problem. John

Re: electrical problem

john Lucas

>I hear what your saying. I'm not an electrician but have been working with electricity most of my life. I've just never had this particular problem before. The box was already there and had several circuits. Now that I look at it the previous owner was only using every other breaker which makes me think this problem existed before I got here. When it stops raining I'm gong to try to find the main source and check it. I'm also going to try to talk to a friend who is a real electrician to get his opinion if I can reach him tomorrow. If I get in trouble I'll ask for serious help. I'm not above that. One thing I know is that I don't know it all and hopefully know where to stop.

Re: electrical problem

Steve Mushinski

>Now that make sense John. If I had to guess you only have 120 out to the shop. The first description kind of lead me to that but I was thinking you had a lost ground. No where did you find 220 volts did you? In the house you will find that they only use one line out to the shop therefore only have 120 volts. Most panels are set up to be the way you describe. Two breakers side by side give you 220 volts. But if there is only one wire run to the shop you will only see 120 volts in one spot and nothing in the next one unless they jumpered the 120 leg to both buss bars which they did not in your case. Sounds like you have a bit of a hack job to deal with. But since you need 220 I am sure you will run the right size wire and breakers to get this fixed up.

Re: electrical problem

Dave Peebles Lyons, Ohio!

>Hi John,

I do a lot of my own electical work too. But I am far far far from an expert. :)

I just wanted to say, be careful buddy!! I would hate to loose you.

I have a real healthy respect for the power of electrons. Having been in a house that was hit by lightning as a kid.... big fireball!! And I also inserted a bobby pin into an outlet as a two year old.

Gee, the more I think about this.... it explains a lot about the person I am today. :)

I now have a working theory. Sometimes it pays to call in the experts.

Take care,

Dave

Re: electrical problem

john Lucas

>Dave

I hear ya man. I've been zapped so many times over the years. I had a short spell as a copier repairman many years ago. My boss was traveling with me for a review one day. I remember looking through a bundle of wires tracing a current path and all of a sudden a big fireball followed by a loud bang. Everybody in the office looked our way. I just looked at the boss said "got current there". That's probably why Ihave curly hair.

Re: electrical problem

john Lucas

>Steve

That occured to me last night while I was laying in bed. I'm going to look a little harder and see if I can find the source tonight. I was getting pretty tired yesterday so I quit working. You make stupid mistakes when your tired.

Re: electrical problem

Barry Irby

>John,

Go back to your shop panel and check the main incoming wares again. You mentioned you have 120 to ground on both of the screws (lugs) above the main breaker. Check from screw to screw. you should find 240 volts. Do this with the main in this panel off or if there is no main, with all the breakers off. If you have only 120 or it reads Zero, then the problem is in the supply from the house panel. If it reads 240 there but not on the buss bars that the breakers clip onto, then the main breaker in the shop panel it not connecting.

If you don't have 240 across the main lugs in the shop panel, you have to go back tot he house panel and figure out why. Either the previous owner never hooked up the second 120 volt wire or the breaker feeding the shop is bad. You should have a double pole breaker and you should read 240 from pole to pole on the breaker.

To do this properly here, now, you should have a four conductor wire running from the house to the shop. A black and red carrying 120 volts each and a white neutral and a ground that is either green or bare. I'm guessing the previous owner ran a three wire circuit. It is possible to run 240 on that circuit and it used to be common practice, talk to an electrician about whether it was "grandfathered".

Barry Irby

Re: electrical problem

John Lucas

>Barry

Thanks. I plan on doing some serious diagnosing tonight if it isn't hailing a raining as hard as it is right now. Makes me glad I work indoors on days like this. It didn't occur to me when I was trouble shooting last night that there might only be 110 coming in. That would explain a lot of the confusion on my part. I've never had to diagnose a problem as far back as the panel itself so it didn't dawn on me to check the obvious. Must be age.