help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

David Wheeler

>One more angle.

Doing this with the Tormek is brutal. I'm glad it is a one time event.

-David

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

Mark Kauder, Phenix City, AL

>David,

Just my opinion, but the nose angle looks a little long. It needs to be a little more perpenducular to the shaft of the tool. Some where between 60-65 degrees is pretty good.

With the angle you have there, it would be pretty hard to get the bottom of a bowl.

Look at the Grind library (top of the turning page).

Mark

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

Roger F.

>David,

Check out the Tool Grinds Library in the top left of the message window, there are some good pics and ideas. By the way, if the gouge works well for you, then in my opinion it is correct.

Roger F.

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

Ezekiel Holliday in Belpre, OH

>I agree about the angle of the nose. One more bit of advice. If you don't have one, get a bench grinder! Using the Tormek is brutal when shaping gouges. I've got one and love it for flat tools and the leather honing wheels are great. The Tormek gouge jig is identical to the Sorby one sold for use with a bench grinder. Just my humbel opinion.

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

David Wheeler

>I thought it looked "long" as well. The setting I used on the Tormek jig was for 45 degrees. I will bump up the angle and try again.

I haven't had time to take a class yet, but this weekend I planned on using Michael O'Donnell's "Turning Green Wood". He has 6 projects with step by step instructions. As long as I can get my tools in the "ballpark", I can get to turning. At least that's my plan.

Thanks for your help,

David

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

David Wheeler

>Roger,

Very helpful. If I had looked first I wouldn't have used a 45 degree bevel. I was going by O'Donnell's and he specified 45 degrees. However his grind looks more like the pictures on the grind page, anyway.

Agreed about the using what works. The way these gouges are shippped isn't even close, though; so I had to do something to get it workable.

-David

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

David Wheeler

>Ezekiel,

I'll check out the Sorby jig and grinder. Thanks for the tip.

-David

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

Brad Vietje

>David,

I agree with Roger that if it works well for you, then its "correct" for you.

Mark and others have commented knowledgeably about the ~45-degree bevel, as opposed to the 60 -65-degree bevel found on the Ellsworth grind... What exact grind you use will depend on what you hope to do with the tool. There are subtle differences in the O'Donnell grind, the Irish or Celtic grind, and the Ellsworth grind.

The blunter tip of the Ellsworth grind allows the tool to be used across the bottom of most bowl profiles, and is a good blend of utility -- the tip can be used for roughing cuts, then the tool can be rotated to make fine shearing cuts with flute up or down, and also a fine shear scrape. The Ellsworth video shows the adaptability of this tool.

The O'Donnell grind allows for cutting into green end grain, and otherwise has all the same functions of the Ellsworth grind (though sometimes with a better cut due to the finer edge, IMHO), but is too long a bevel for finishing the bottom of deeper bowls. For the projects in the O'Donnell book, which often involve cutting against the grain into end grain, his grind is probably better.

I have tools ground both ways, and use the favored tool for a given operation. I usually use a blunt (short bevel) bowl gouge with a straight-across English grind, or a heavy scraper to finish the bottom of bowls. I also use hook tools for creating end-grain bowls, so I can cut away from center, instead of cuttimg into end grain with the sharper angles of the O'Donnell grind. There are usually more than one ways to do something, depending on how many tools you have -- can you ever have enough ?

Safe Spinning,

Brad Vietje

Thetford, VT

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

John Weeks

>On the other hand, I grind gouges to have a total included angle less than 90 degrees - lets you get into corners easier. I set my tool rest platform on the grinder between 40 and 42 degrees and the sweep the same. I also relieve the bevel so that the length of the 42 degree bevel is shorter, letting me get down farther into bowls.

For deep or steep sided bowls I keep a gouge sharpened with an extreemly dull grind - 70 to 80 degrees. I use that for the bottom portion of these bowls, again with the bevel relieved.

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

David Wheeler

>I noticed that the John Jordan gouges from Oneway are double ended. I'm thinking about getting the 1/2 bowl gouge and putting and setting up each end accordingly. I'm kind of curious how the gouge seats in the handle... I guess the set screws pinch down on the bottom of the gouge.

-David

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

John Weeks

>That would be a reasonable approach. I don't know how the Jordon gouges work with the handle - I have never seen one.

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

adrien

>O'Donnell grind, Ellsworth grind�as if these people invented something.

I thought of it as the Irish grind, having seen Liam O'Neill use it many years ago.

One point: The handle is sometimes overlooked when we focus on the grind: Liam had a LONG handle�on the order of a yard or so, and it was great for getting to the bottom of deep bowls.

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

Jonathan

>David,

With some guidance from Lyn, I mounted an extra guide bar for the Tormek onto my Wolverine jig.

I use that with the Tormek bowl gouge holder to do my shaping, and then move over to the Tormek to finish up the work. Really speeds things up!

Re: help with 1/2" bowl gouge grind

Bob Hackett

>That really long handle was meant to steady the tool and has mostly been replaced by handles with lead shot in them which both helps to steady the tool and absorb vibration at the same time.

As stated in a previous post there are subtle differences between all the swept back grinds.I think you`ll find that if you looked at 10 different gouges owned by long time turners who profess to use the "Ellsworth grind" you`d find that none of them are exactly alike and probably none are exactly like the one David himself uses.Our tools have a way of morphing to fit our particular way of dealing with the craft,which is as it should be.

Mainely,Bob