Bowl gouges?

Re: Bowl gouges?

MP Wall

>I use the p&n bowl gouge and have ground the wings back to an ellsworth style grind. It works great and I really like the P&N's, they seem to hold a good edge for a long time. I buy mine unhandled and handle them with big ash handles.

MP Wall

Re: Bowl gouges?

Mark Kauder, Phenix City, AL

>Rob,

Don't worry about the grind, find a decent gouge that you can afford, and grind it the way you need it. The P&N is a good gouge, and is my recommendation for starters.

Mark

Re: Bowl gouges?

TDaniel

>Rob, we will be discussing the bowl gouge on our weekly chat tomorrow night. We'll try to cover the things you can do to prevent catches. Join us at 9:30pm eastern time for the topic. We start logging on at 9:00 so we can get our greetings done before topic time.

TD

Are the sizes listed the same

Fred in NC

>As a Sorby, Crown, etc ?

In other words, is a 1/2" P&N the same size as a 1/2" Crown ?

Based on the recommendation here, the price, and the fact that I would rather make my own handle, I am about ready to order some P&Ns.

Thanks for the help, and best regards everyone!

Maybe not !!

Fred in NC

>I measured the shank in my 3/8" Crown bowl gouge. It is 1/2".

The P&N page in the Lee Valley web site says:

"

P&N Professional Turning Tools

Though relatively new to North America, the Australian-manufactured Patience & Nicholson (P&N) turning tools are well known in the South Pacific and valued for their robust construction and ability to hold an edge. The tools are hard-wearing, M2 high-speed steel. Supplied unhandled, they can be fitted to a custom handle you make or you can use a heavy-duty metal handle (like the Kelton handles), which allow you to set the projection of the shaft to increase comfort, bolster rigidity and reduce chatter.

The skew, parting and beading tools are milled from flat stock, the gouges from round bar stock. The parting tool (1/2" x 1/8" rectangular shank), beading tool (3/8" square shank) and skew chisel (1/2" x 5/16" rectangular shank) are for work between centers. The skew has a radiused bottom edge for better control when beading. The shallow-flute detail gouges (all shanked to size) have blunt fingernail grinds suitable for beads, coves and grooves. The bowl gouges, with deep flutes, are particularly effective on end grain where they slice without pulling fibers. The 3/8" version has a 3/8" shank; the 1/2" and 5/8" versions have 1/2" shanks. The spindle gouges (all shanked to size), with shallow bevels and flutes, halfway between a bowl gouge and a detail gouge, are ideal for fine beading and cove work. The deep-flute supa gouges (1/2" shanks) and massive roughing gouge (1/2" shank) let you quickly rough down squares.

[Sizes listed in the price lines are outside diameter (gouges) or shank dimensions (flat stock). Overall blade lengths are between 9-1/4" and 12". ]

Therefore I assume that to get a 1/2" gouge I will have to order their 5/8" size !

Please, somebody correct me if I am wrong, before I place the order.

Thanks much !

Re: Bowl gouges?(long)

Jim Rutten

>Hi Rob,

Don't know where you are in Kansas but it might be worth a trip to Turn About Wood In Kansas City, Missouri. I was faced with a similar situation but had already bought a traditionally ground Sorby. Dan Moreno (Sandy's husband; you might have seen that Sandy is running for the AAW board) put a swept back grind on it for $6 Since then all I have to do is maintain it.

On the subject of Sandy, I went to one of her demonstrations at the Kansas City Woodturners and while she was turning her square bowl she was talking about her program where she teaches high school kids on the lathe. She apologized after the demo because she didn't finish her bowl, but everyone was so enthralled in her talk about the kids I don't think anyone noticed or cared. In my opinion, for what it is worth, you could not get a more caring individual in the AAW board nor one that will pay more attention to educating the young people about woodturning than Sandy Moreno. I know I will be voting for her.

Re: Thanks everybody!

Rob in Kansas

>Thanks for all the input. As I have plenty of ash and need to watch my $$ I think I'll go ahead with the P&N for my first one.

TD I think I'll be able to get out to use a computer tonight(don't have internet at home). I'll try and log in.

Fred, from what I remember the 5/8" is 5/8 and has a step down to the 1/2" shank. Also, I remember Lyn M. writing that the shank was actually metric and just a little bit off of 1/2". He sent a suggestion that for the import (export for AUS) market that they make it a true 1/2". I don't know if they were able to impliment his suggestion or not. Watch that and I'll report when I get one in.

Jim, I have never made it to TAW. I tried one time remembering only the street name and thinking I was in the vacinity. I went along the road a couple miles, but I guess I was too far south. I'll make it there one of these days. I do alot of work with young people too and admire anyone that takes the time to do so. It takes alot of time and effort, but the experience is priceless.

I'll post a pic of my attempt when I'm done.

Rob

Re: Tang size

Lyn J. Mangiameli

>I just received the new LV catalog Saturday and I note they specifically identify the tang as 1/2 inch, so I assume the change has been made. You can probably call LV customer service to verify, and I'll email Rob and Greg Jensen tonight to get a definitive answer.

For purposes of a wooden handle, it doesn't really make any difference, as long as you will want to go slightly undersize in drilling out your wooden handle. If you wanted a metal handle, the Vermec lead filled handle is just great and specifically has a 12mm bore. No current NA importer to my knowledge, but you can obtain it from Carrol's Woodcraft Supplies via the internet.

Re: Thanks everybody!

adrien

>absolutely! You're going to have to learn (if you don't know already) how to grind the gouge to suit your needs, Irish grind or not. You might as well practice on the less pricey one.

Re: Maybe not !!

Mark Kauder

>Fred,

Yes, the P&N 5/8" is the same as a Sorby or Crown 1/2".

Mark

That's what I thought! Thanks !

Fred in NC

>

Re: Thanks everybody!

Rob in Kansas

>How right you are Adrien! I had bought a nice fine grinding wheel and since I don't have a grinder I put it on one side of the grinder at my dad's shop. They use it to remove metal to balance knives on a production moulder. I assumed his employee would see that there was a difference between my nice fine, white sharpening wheel verses the course gray grinding wheel and not use it.

I should have known better!!! I was able to use it once when I put it on...the next weekend it was totally useless! Needless to say I was not a happy camper. I'm going to have to find something for myself to keep at home.

Re: Maybe not !!

Brad Vietje

>Bowl gouges are usually measured by the width of the flute. Spindle gouges are usually measured by the diameter of the round bar stock from which they are made (or the diameter of the shaft, if not made that way). thus, a 3/8" bowl gouge usually has a 1/2" diameter shaft, while a 3/8" spindle or detail gouge would commonly have a 3/8" shaft.

However, this is not entirely uniform across the turning tool industry, so do read each manufacturer's description closely.

Safe Spinning,

Brad Vietje

Thetford, VT