Est. 1998 — 27 years of woodworking knowledge
segment turning
jack
>my son gave me a book beyond basic turning. i cannot figure out how to make the curved segments if any of you have this book and see what i mean if you could direct me somewhere that would help me understand how to do this or any instructions you could give me
thanks
jack
Do you mean "Beyond basic Woodturning"? (long)
Dominic Greco in sunny Richboro, PA
>by Jack Cox? If so, then I COMPLETELY understand your confusion! Let me say now that your son meant well. I think it's neat that he gave you a book on a subject you can get into. While I can't help you understand it, I hope I can at least commensurate with you about it's rather "unique" content.
(If "Beyond Basic Woodturning" by Jack Kox is not the book in question, just skip to the part where I recommend another book....) :>)
And to those of you that may actually like this book, I apologize in advance, and reiterate that the following comments are my opinion, and my opinion alone!
Now normally, I'm of the "If you don't have anything good to say, don't say anything at all" school of thought. Well,...I feel pretty strongly about this,...so here goes,....
RANT mode:ON
I purchased this book and have YET to understand it, nor be able to read through it. If if wasn't for the fact that it would cost more to return the book, than it is worth I would have shipped it back to whence it came in a millisecond! The charts are incomprehensible, the jigs almost too complicated to figure out, and the writing style is as dull as a butter knife. (Don't block Dominic! Tell us how you really feel)
The book reads more like a high level mathematics primer than a book on turning. I'm no slouch when it comes to math (had almost enough to qualify for a Math minor in College), and I found it boggling. Every time I started to read it, the words turn to those WAH WAH WAH sound that Charlie Brown's teacher makes when she talks.
I believe the problem with this book lay in the fact that it was written before the advent of affordable desktop computers and spreadsheet programs. It's pretty much out of date.
RANT mode:OFF
(Whew! I needed to get that off my chest!)
If you are in the market for another book, I recommend Ron Hampton's book "Segmented Turning", or Segmented Woodturning" by William Smith. Both have gotten pretty good reviews. Both contain tons of photographs and plans for jigs to help you make all sorts of segmented bowls.
For curved segments, I suggest posting a question directly to our resident wizard Russ. I believe I've seen him post pics of a platter with curved segments not too long ago.
See ya around,
Dominic
Who is switching to decaffeinated tea TOMORROW!
NIAGARA FALLS! Slowly I turned.....
Dominic Greco in sunny Richboro, PA
>Geez! I looked at my message and am reminded of that Three Stooges episode where Moe goes crazy whenever someone mentions "Niagara Falls"!
Man I need some time off!
See ya around,
Dominic
Re: Do you mean "Beyond basic Woodturning"? (long)
John Trant (Baltimore/WashDC)
>In general, I agree. Things that I have understood, I found brilliant but most of it is just incomprehensible words. Personally I am glad it wasn't just me that found the book difficult.
John
LOL Dom!!
Dave Peebles Lyons, Ohio!
>Hello Dom,
I don't do segmented turnings. It make my head hurt :) I am a left brainer all the way. But I admire all those that do.
Your post made me laugh out loud though.
Also, please don't give up the good stuff in the coffee or tea. It does my heart good to hear an honest opinion.
Thanks,
Dave
Re: NIAGARA FALLS! Slowly I turned.....
William R. Duffield on the Cohansey
>The advice I have always received is that when turning, "Speed is your friend."
I thought that particular form originated with Abbot and Costello, but on further reflection, I think maybe they turned some exotic tropical hardwood called Pokomoko, instead, but had the same problem with catches.
In any case, both the Stooges' version, Gents without Cents, and Abott and Costello's version, Lost in a Harem, (of an older vaudeville routine, perhaps originated by Joey Faye) were playing on the silver screen in late 1944. Rumor has it that Lucile Ball also did a version on I Love Lucy, in which the catch was the infidel's name instead of the location of the infraction.
It's a conspiracy
Russ Fairfield
>Your's isn't a new complaint. There has always been a conspiracy among the authors to make segmented and polychromatic turning so complicated that it would discourage anyone else from making them.
And, the conspiracy continues because there is now a new generation of woodturners who are convinced that it it is so difficult that only a computer can figure it out. 8>0
Re: segment turning
John Lucas
>Jack
I also understand. You ask him what time it is he tells you how to build a clock. I've found that you have to go back and re read the sections your interested in over and over. Sometimes it's just one sentence that finally sinks in and solves the question. His wording is often different that what we use in the US and makes it difficult to understand.
I will have to go back and re-read that sections but I believe it's either done with a bandsaw using a guide template or a the same sort of template and a router. I never tried the bandsaw because mine was too crappy. I did try a small one on the router and did a fair job but got tied up with work and never got back to it. You have to work on the template until you get it exact then you can cut as many as you want. I forgot to mention you need a pattern bit. I used a router table and got the bit that has a bearing on the shank. I used double stick tape to attach the pattern to the piece. If I do it again I'll rig up my vacuum pump and put the pattern on the top and get a pattern bit with the bearing on the bottom.
I used to try a lot of different segmented techniques but gave it up after I moved to this rental house. The basement where I work is simply too moist and I have trouble with wood movement after the piece goes to the gallery. Also around here I simply couldn't get the prices you need to recoup the time involved. I have been getting back to adding segmented work to my hand mirrors.
Re: segment turning
Darryl Hansen
>I haven't tried segmented turning yet, but there are two sources for info you might try.
www.beaverpondstudio.com
www.woodturnerpro.com
There is also a web site that is dedicated to segmented turnings but I can't find it right now...
Re: segment turning
John Lucas
>Jack
I looked through the book this morning and he does the curved segments on a bandsaw or scroll saw using a modified version of a circle cutting jig. Since I have a new bandsaw I may try that today.
I could not find where I read that it's done by using a template and router. Maybe I invented that (not). It's probably in one of my router books. I'll look when I take my lunch break. Before I got into turning I ate slept and breathed with my routers.
Is this the one..........??
Russ Fairfield
>I assemble these from bandsaw cuts that are made free-hand. There are no templates and no jigs. All that is required is a simple tayout, patience, and keeping track of the pieces. All cuts are made in stacked pairs and the pieces interchanged to make two (2) discs at a time.
The word "generation" has crept into our vocabulary to describe things that are assembled from segments and sectors. For those who are concerned with such things, this plate is a "4th Generation" assembly. That means that I have gone through the layout and saw routine 4 times, and assembled 6 intermediate discs, to get to this one.
Forget these if you have a profit motive behind your woodturning. It takes me about 20 hours to get to a finished plate that looks like this.
A detailed description??
Hey, I have to have some secrets.
Mr. Wizard!
Dominic Greco in Richboro PA
>Russ,
That the exact platter I was referring to.
You're telling me you DIDN'T use a jig to make those cuts?! They're freehand!!?
OK, now I'm convinced. You ARE a wizard.
See ya around,
Dominic
Re: It's a conspiracy
Mark Kauder, Phenix City, AL
>Here, Here -
Russ is exactly right, some people make it far too complicated. When I demo segmented turning, I show that the easiest way to design segmented bowls, is with a piece of graph paper and a little basic math. I do use a computer now, but only as a convienience to speed things along - print out my cut sheets, etc - after I have sketched it on a piece of paper.
That particular book gives me a headache everytime I pick it up. I have been particularly interested in the curved segments you mentioned.
Mark
Class *LINK*
Russ Fairfield
>I have been doing classes on making these plates. So far there have been 2 completed and 2 to go.
If you are interested see my Website at the link below, and send me an e-mail.
Segmented and Polychromatic classes
Don't miss this opportunity !!
Wayne Allen - Carson City. Nevada
>I have had the wonderful experience of having had the opportunity of taking both of the classes that Russ offers. He shows the way to create these beautiful pieces using methods that do not involve calculus, differential equations or complicated jigs designed by Rube Goldberg. If he can teach me, he can teach anyone. Like anything else, (i.e. brain surgery, flying a 747, etc), it is not so hard to do if you have been taught how to do it, and Russ will teach you how to do it in 3 days. I give him a 2 thumbs up in his class presentation. Also, his wife Geri (sp?) is a great cook.
I forgot !!
Wayne Allen - Carson City. Nevada
>Now ---if he or anyone else can teach me how to post pictures using this *&%$#* computer, I will try to show some of the results of the class.
Re: segment turning
Keith Tompkins
>In Orlando, I will show how to make a segmented piece with nothing more than a pair of dividers and 8th grade math.
Everything I produce is based on the basic fundamentals, then I just build on that foundation. I feel if something can be broken down into its simplest components, it's much easier to understand.
Re: segment turning
Keith Tompkins
>Beaverpond is Rich Pagano's website.....he's one of the best.
Re: segment turning *LINK*
Darrell Feltmate
>Keith
I got my first degree in math. I have also played around with segmented turning enough to know that it is not my thing but I like to look at it. From the mathematician? Keeping things simple is still the best way to make things understandable. Now that I work with words for much of my living? Keeping things simple is still the best way to make things understandable. Good for you and your students.
http://www.aroundthewoods.com