This might be hard to believe, but I am turning my first ever natural edged bowl with the bark on. I have turned bunches of natural edged pieces in the past, but I usually look for wood that has such an interesting edge that the bark is a hindrance, and it goes the way of all waste wood.
However, I have a piece of cherry that is all done except for the final sanding on the wings. The wood is cut very cleanly, but the bark has got all kinds of tearout in it. Those of you who regularly turn natural edged bowls with the bark - do you even worry about tearout in the soft part of the bark? I might be able to sand this stuff out, but I think I would rather go back to barkless bowls than go through this again. this one is pretty close to becoming barkless. Its bark certainly is worse than its bite.
>There are a lot of ways to do this, but here is how I handle a bark-on natural edge.
I fill those tear-out places in the soft bark with fine coffee grounds and thin CA glue. Rub the coffee grounds in first, and then drizzle on just enough CA glue to wet the coffee. The coffee acts as a natural catalyst so nothing more is needed.
If there is any bark missing, I replace it with some that I had saved from the center of the bowl, and fill it in with the coffee grounds.
Then I go all the way around the bark, inside and outside, carefully, with just enough thin CA to wet the bark and not the wood. This hardens the bark and firmly attaches it to the wood.
I fuss over natural edge bowls quite a bit, and if I had to make a living on them, I might devise a better way.
If the bowl is already going out of round, or has soft areas of bark, I dab the entire bark rim, inside and out, with thin CA, using a Q-tip or little polyester applicator, being careful not to discolor the sap wood underneath. With most woods I've used this works well, but with some, it nearly guarantees the bark will de-laminate, as the glued bark won't shrink, and the wood below it does -- not usually a problem with Cherry, though sometimes the bark warps inward or outward, which can mess us those graceful lines we shoot for. Then I hand sand very lightly with 320, 400, and a very fine (grey) 3M pad. On Cherry I usually don't get the pad near the outer bark, as it will catch and tear pieces off the bowl.
If the wood is still wet, and the bowl still round (often because I've been squirting it with water), I wet sand with 220 and 320 wet/dry paper, dry it off with paper towels, and then wet sand with the finishing oil with 320 and 400. I use Urethane Oil, and frankly, I'm not thrilled with the way it wet sands -- I'm going to try using mineral oil as a sanding lubricant, then applying the U-O after. In any case, I dab extra finishing oil into the side of the bark until it looks loaded, then allow it to cure for 2 days before a little gentle hand sanding off-lathe. The urethane oil hardens up the softer bark enough to get a good finish on it.
Wet sanding those spinning "wings" is a good argument for a turning smock or a raincoat. The Red Oak bowl pic attached was treated with Urethane Oil (bowl and bark), but not CA.
>Thanks guys. Russ, I read your post and scampered of to the shop to try it. I used sanding dust instead of the coffee grounds as the bark is fairly light in color and we drink an expresso roast around here. I was amazed at how fast I was able to treat the whole rim inside and out!
Brad, I like the bowl you posted, but did not read your method until after I tried Russ's suggestion. This bowl was roughed, dried, and then returned to the lathe to be returned. ;-) I will have to pay attention now to what happens with bark, but I will keep your suggestions in mind.
My friend Brad Sells' bowls are all carved with natural edge and I believe they use CA glue on the Cambium layer but I'll have to ask him to be sure. I think his helper commented on how much they go through one day when I was there.
>Bill -wet cherry is one of the more difficult woods to turn natural edge without chipping the bark off. I don't often turn dripping wet wood- seasoning it to the point that it doesn't sling moisture is much more pleasant! I seal the cambium and sapwood with lacquer base sanding sealer before the CA treatment- the sealer keeps the CA from wandering around where I don't want it. Winter cut wood is often ready to turn natural edge- the rest of the year I seal and turn when most moisture is gone.
One other option is to disregard the old rule of turning from the small diameter to the large on the outside a natural edge bowl.
I do this often on natural edge bowls. After I have gotten the basic shape of the bowl, I will make a pass from the top of the bowl to just below the point where the wings are. I then blend it in with the traditional cut, from foot to rim. For some reason it gives a much cleaner cut on the bark area with almost no tear out.
I learned this from someone, but since I can't remember who... I will take credit for it. :)
>Thanks for the added info guys. I usually turn my natural edged bowls just as I turn a regular bowl, from rim to center. Wet or dry, I have developed my technique that it works better for me that way.
This cherry bowl was rough turned wet, and then set aside to dry. The bark held very well for me, and if I recall, it cut farily well. Once it was dry, I put it back on the lathe to finish it off. The bark was still sticking well, but it had lots of tearout in the cambium.
I am not sure when the tree was actually felled. The log was given to me by a friend of mine who is also a turner and who stores wood in one of my barns. I received in in November, and it was frozen to the ground all winter long. We had a brief thaw about a month or so ago and I roughed it out, dried it, and put it back on the lathe yesterday. That is when the trouble with the bark began.
Lately I have been having trouble getting the bark OFF. I have some natural edge burls and some ash that has a spectacular edge without the bark, but the glue that holds that ash bark on is something to behold. If only I could synthesize and package it for sale! Now I find myself running into trouble, not keeping the bark on, but in keeping it looking nice.
I guess this is going to be one more area of learning as I go. Thanks again for the tips and suggestions. This particular bowl was oiled up last night. Depending on how things go today, I may get it buffed and photographed, but I need to check on the oil and see how dry it is. The beautiful spring weather dipped down into the upper 20s last night, and the shop has already be configured to summer mode, so it was a bit chilly last night for oil curing quickly.
>One more idea, Bill. I find that soaking the cambium layer with CA glue on the outside and THEN making my final cuts will help reduce that tearout. In addition, I use the Ellsworth method it shear cutting the bark edge...coming from the air into the edge with light shearing cuts. On the inside, I do basically the same thing. Turn the bowl to final thickness just past the bark edge, glue, shear cut (or "back-cut"). Then proceed with the rest of the bowl.
FWIW...95% of my work is natural edge bowls and with the bark on, I find they sell alot faster than barkless ones.
Tear-out can be a problem on the inside of a natural edge bowl because of the flexibility of the wood in the end-grain.
Take a look at the last photo in the Tool Grinds Library. It is a Continental Spindle Gouge used on the inside of a bowl. It is about the closest thing to a skew-cut that can be made inside of a bowl, and applies very little pressure against the flexible wood.
The previous photo shows a bowl gouge being used in a similar manner.
>Thanks Peter. I will keep that in mind. I use the same type of cut you do. I found out a long time ago that coming up from the inside often led to grief on some of the pieces I was doing. Using CA glue while turning is a good idea. The fumes are a real killer though. Fixing this cherry bowl brought back lots of memories of why I switched to poly glue for the pens I used to make.
I can also see the wisdom of leaving the bark on for some bowls (this cherry one came out looking pretty good if I say so myself), but in the past I have been doing stuff like the picture below, where the bark is more of a detraction than an asset.
This is an ash bowl stained with Watco walnut Danish oil. I have several logs of this stuff left, and the edge is really wavy, but the bark sticks on like glue. The picture is not the best I have ever taken. I needed to get a quicky pic done, and then it went out the door in the hands of a happy customer.
>Thanks Russ, I'll take a look, but does the grind help with tearout in the bark? The wood in this bowl cut as smooth as one could want, and usually I don't have trouble with tearout in the wood. The oil is dry, I think, or should be by now, so hopefully I will get this thing buffed up and photographed before too long.
