WoodCentral Forums

Est. 1998 — 27 years of woodworking knowledge

Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

Posts

Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

#1

Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

John Cotten, Harrodsburg, KY

>I have been reading for some time some of the posts regarding the level some people are taking their wood with sanding on the lathe, and just thought I would bring up a point which I am sure is going to make for some argument.

I rarely sand past 320. On occassion 400, and most of the time 280 grit. When you sand to the point of going to 1000, 2000 or above, you polish/burnish the wood to the point you frequently close off the cells of the wood, or fill them with enough microdust that you have a polished surface.

While in the near time, it produces a beautiful finish initally, most finishes will not bond properly with the cells full or closed off at this level of polish. The wood needs some porosity for the finish to adhere properly to the wood. I typically use a good sanding sealer, then lacquer to the desired level, or use oil and wax depending on the intended use. I have some turning that were done by Rude Osolnik 20 years ago and the finish has begun to haze and come off. I have a few I did some years back where the finish has had some problems. Using a jewelers loop, in both cases it was from the wood being over polished and the cells of the wood being filled to the point the finish did not bond well.

My point is, while it makes a beautiful finish polishing the wood, or burnishing would be a more accurate statement, over sanding will eventually lead to finish failure. It is better to buff out a oil or lacquer finish with a few coats to a glass smooth surface rather than burnishing the wood to achieve the glass smooth feel and look.

We woodturners are a fairly impatient lot when we really come down to it, that is one of reasons we turn, we can finish a piece in minutes or a couple of hours easily, but we are trying with the use of friction polishes and other similar processes to shortcut the finishing process, which if we look at classic case work, frankly takes time and patients have proper outcome.

I know there are those who will argue this point, but it is just an observation after nearly 34 years of turning.

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

#2

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

Dane Lance

>Good point. I saw this subject batted around on turning forums before and I think the general concensus was as you describe with one exception...pens. Finishing the bare wood to a smooth, shiny polish on pens is desireable. Pens are handled a lot in the course of their lives, so even if you take the time to finish it properly, finish degredation is inevitable. The idea here being that when some of the finish does rub or wear off, the shiny wood underneath doesn't show the defect as bad.

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

#3

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

GeorgeBalock

>John,

I'll start by saying that I haven't been turning as long as you have. I would agree with you except, in turning you are sanding across the grain half the time and with the grain half the time. With that in mind I think that you need to sand to a much finer grit than you would with a flat object in which you were sanding entirely with the grain. I sand to 600 grit on most pieces, unless it is going to be used for food. I agree that burnishing will close off the pores of the wood, but I do not have any problems with finish penetrating the wood with either oil or lacquer. Thanks for brining up a topic that I am sure will gather a lot of posts.

George

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

#4

I agree partially...

TDaniel

>John, I think you may be correct if the chosen finish is lacquer or such. I sand my finish into the wood by sanding with oil right up thru the grits, all the way to 2000 or 2500. When I am finished my finish looks like lacquer but is in the wood, not on the surface. It carries a life-time guarantee (I'll repair it as long as I am alive if the finish fails). This finish is very labor intensive and not for the faint of heart, however. American quality though!

TD

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

#5

Re: I agree partially...

Barbara Gill, Remlik Virginia

>TD, the difference is that you use oil while you sand so the oil penetrates the wood before it is sanded. A very good example of what John is talking about happened when we finished the floors in our house. Instead of stopping with the 120 grit screen, we burnished the floors with a steel wool pad before applying the oil finish. There was a major difference in how much oil was absorbed by the wood.

Based on my experience with how much oil would be absorbed by the wood we bought a 55 gal drum of oil. We used only about 10 gallons on the floors.

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

#6

Right Barb

TDaniel

>All the observations in this thread are correct. I have dry sanded maple to the point that it will not take a finish. IF you want a fantastic gloss finish, try sanding WITH the same oil you plan on using for the final finish. Now my secret finish is no longer secret........

TD

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

#7

Re: Right Barb

David Hammond, in Powder Springs GA

>Yep, your secrets out Terry - I've got five peices, and they're close, they're really close: sanded through 1000 grit with oil, and one finish coat. Really getting some gloss now, without all those ring scratches 400 grit was leaving. I'm shooting for two, maybe three more coats, and I think I'll be there. I've only been turning for a couple of years, but of all the finishes I've seen, used, and read about, tung oil tops 'em all - but it does takes some patience.

David

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

#8

Re: I agree partially...

Tom Colligan, Peoria

>Terry, what oils can you recommend for this finishing method? Would 'Antique Oil' be acceptable? Thanks in advance,

Re: Sanding or polishing wood too smooth... long

#9

Re: I agree partially...

David Hammond, in Powder Springs GA

>I'm speaking for Terry here, but he can chime in if I start tellin' lies. :o) I took a class from him, and have been using his basic finishing method ever-since. Terry uses tung oil. Find a bottle of oil that lists tung oil as one of the largest ingredients - there are oils sold that are called "Tung Oil", that contain no real tung oil... Go figure.

David

👍 This page answered my questions

Your vote helps other woodworkers quickly find the answers and techniques that actually work in the shop.