You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
Mike Schwing from Md.
>Its kind of harsh....
Review of Delta 1440 lathe
Mike Schwing
New woodturner - 8 months
The Delta 1440 is my first lathe. The only other lathe I have used is a small Jet for a turning class. I have been aggressively and enthusiastically learning to turn since summer of 2003.
I am no stranger to fine power tools, and have a lifetime's worth of experience in automotive and boat building/restoration.
The decision to purchase the Delta 1440 was reached via research and availability, and recommendations from my friends at the local Woodcraft. I had my wallet in mind, and knew that this would be a "starter lathe" for me. I did not want to invest large amounts of dollars in a tool before I was certain I would enjoy the hobby. I am aware of the "you get what you pay for" saying and realize this is the case here, compared to high dollar lathes. I was also enticed by the included starter set of turning tools, of which today I only continue to use the parting tool. Someone on WC asked for this review, and I have complied with that request.
The Lathe
I am unimpressed overall by this lathe, both as a tool and as a lathe. I will have a few good things to say about it, but generally, you will find my review to be negative. As a tool, I feel it is poorly designed and built. The A-frame stand is flimsy, very flimsy. Even a slightly thicker grade of steel would have resulted in a remarkable improvement in stability. The stand has no holes in the feet for bolting it to the floor or adding rubber/leveling feet, to me an unbelievable oversight. Leveling the lathe/stand so all 4 feet sit firmly on the ground is accomplished via loosening up every one of the numerous bolt head screws, and shimmying the entire contraption around, then retightening them.
The lathe shaft is secured by one set of bearings, approximately half way between ends of the shaft. I'm no design engineer but this would seem to be a way to put undue stresses on those bearings and wear them out rather quickly. I would like to see another set located some distance away. (yes, I'm getting what I'm paying for here) The outboard end of the headstock has a hand rotation wheel that wobbles excessively. In fact, after trying to align it, it was properly seated yet wobbly, removing it entirely resulted in a smoother lathe operation. About once per month the variable speed mechanism suddenly becomes nearly impossible to operate. Removing the cover and lubricating the parts involved corrects this problem.
The lathe motor itself is secured to the main housing poorly, two small 13mm head bolts are all that secure this heavy motor to the main housing. Tighter, heavier attachments would, in my mind, yield a smoother performing machine. It also, to me, seems a poor balance decision, in a machine where balance is so critical, to hang such a heavy motor directly off of a small headstock such a distance from the axis of spindle rotation.
The tailstock slips. Despite my best attempts at correcting the situation, the only way I have been able to maintain a satisfactory hold down on the tailstock is to let the bed of the lathe rust. Even with this, normal hand pressure on the locking lever will not produce a tailstock that stays put, occasionally a hammer is needed.
The lathe has a mechanically variable speed control, governed by preset stops/detents. The detents are embedded in a nylon cover that restrains a pin on the speed control lever. Several of these nylon detents have become damaged through normal use and are no longer usable, of course in the speed range most often used. I would consider this a very poor choice of material for this part. Yes, warranty coverage will replace this part.
My 1440 has two speeds at which the lathe vibrates, regardless of headstock position or whether anything is mounted. I have replaced belts, tightened/retightened everything yet the problem remains. No, those are not the same unusable speeds as a result of the broken detents.
I would also like the lowest speed setting to be a little bit lower. The top end setting is useful to me for buffing, but I'd be terrified to turn something that fast.
The starter switch is mounted in an incredibly awkward, and slightly dangerous position above the headstock. This requires the operator to reach over the spinning workpiece in order to turn off the lathe, or move around the spinning workpiece, putting the body of the operator in direct line with the spinning object. My starter switch literally blew itself to pieces by simply flipping the switch to the on position. The lathe turned on, the switch self-destructed, and blew apart all over the room. I had to unplug the lathe to stop it. Delta sent me a replacement but by that time I had installed a better switch on my own.
What are the positive points about the 1440 lathe? I like the toolrest that came with the lathe; it is extremely versatile and only deflects if used at the extreme edges. A regular filing of the contact edges keeps the tool moving smoothly along the rest. Occasionally the shear/finishing cut with the Ellsworth grind will cause the tool handle to bump into the release handle, but other than that I like the toolrest. Removal/replacement of the toolrest and tailstock is a snap. I'm a short man (5'5") and I'd like the lathe axis to sit a bit lower, but this is a problem for me with all tools, the lathe is built around a person of more normal height.
For small bowls, up to 10" in diameter and relatively thin (3-4"), I find the lathe to be perfectly acceptable. I am able to turn larger diameter work pieces IF I can true them at the lowest speed before the lathe walks too far away. If the low speed setting were lower I would be able to turn a wider range of wider diameter objects, as once they are trued the lathe spins OK. I am not a spindle turner and have never needed more than 30" of bed to turn a table leg occasionally. The small amount of spindle work I have done makes me think this lathe is perfectly suited to a furniture maker/spindle turner.
Realizing that this is a mid-sized, relatively inexpensive lathe, I keep my grandiose ideas in check when searching for turning lumber, but its mostly impossible to mount an irregular shaped or out of balance blank if it has any heft or size to it. I seem to be gravitating towards turning irregular and odd shaped designs, so this lathe is going to wear out its welcome pretty quickly in my home.
Can many of these problems/defects mentioned above be corrected? Sure they can, and many of them I have worked on myself. I don't consider a good tool one that needs a lot of re-design and repair to do what it was supposed to in the first place. The vibrations, even with nothing mounted, are totally unacceptable, yet I fear even a total headstock replacement would yield identical results.
This was a good introductory lathe for learning. I don't think it is a well built/designed tool. It taught me a lot about what to look for in my second, more permanent lathe. It also allowed me to learn techniques for carefully mounting/balancing/centering objects to a more precise degree than would have been necessary with a larger, more stable lathe. Additionally, it allowed me to discover that I enjoyed turning enough to make it a real hobby, without spending thousands of dollars first, and allowed me to turn at least a few of the large objects I have a desire for. Would I buy it again or recommend it to a friend? No.
Mike Schwing
You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
Posts
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#2Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 144
Mike Caldwell
>Good job Mike. I couldn't have said it better.
The sad part is that it has the Delta name on it. Sadly, I'm finding that it doesn't mean what it use to.
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#3
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 144
Richard Allen
>Hi Mike
Thanks for the review. I hope it helps others make good choices.
Richard
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#4Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 144
Tug Fork Bob
>I agree with much of what has been said, but I have had a couple of other problems:
1---The live center that came with the lathe has
a live center with a cup that was not sharp
it has a flat approx. 1/16 wide. Like Mike,
this is my first lathe and I didn't know any
better until recently so I still have it.
In all honesty, It hasn't caused a problem but
I mostly just turn bowls.
2---The index pin does not accurately position the
spindle rotation--The original index pin ass'y
allowed about 1/16" rotational "wiggle on the
perimeter of the 8" faceplate. If anyone
intends to rig up a router to cut splines on
spindles you will have to modify the
mechanism. Delta promptly sent out a
replacement but it was no better.
3---By far the worst problem has been an
irritating low speed rattle. New drive belts,
replacement motor drive pulley, and finally an
entirely new headstock /motor assembly has not
resolved the problem. I found that initially
there is little noise, but with use it gets
steadily worse.
The only thing good has been that Delta has been
responsive and has tried to correct problems.
After 6 months I have finally done enough complaining to Delta, Delta's regional Sales Mgr., his boss, and the dealer that the
dealer has offered to come pick up the lathe & reimburse me. I'm just waiting for him to make a proposal on a different lathe--(gonna try a Jet 1442 next time around).
Bob
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#5Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 144
Glenn Hodges
>Is this one of Delta's lathes made in China? Sounds like it.
Nashville, Georgia
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#6Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 144
Ray
>Mike,
I have had the same lathe for about five months and I have to totally agree with you. I have the same vibrations. I have had no problems with the detent shifter yet, but you can tell that it is a problem waiting to happen. I don't know about all their other equipment but this was my first Delta purchase and will be the last. I kick myself all the time for not getting the JET 1442.
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#7Thanks for the review
David Eaves
>I don't think I was tempted by such a lathe, but certainly won't be now.
What lathe do you think you will "upgrade" to eventually?
Unfortunatly I've got my eyes on a Nova DVR.
David
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#8You're welcome
Mike Schwing from Maryland
>I'm amazed at the responses, all remarkably similar. I believe I'm going to print them out and send them to the Delta rep when he asks what I'm talking about! (I'll remove your names).
What will I upgrade to? I don't know but when that decision time arrives I'll be begging the long time bowl turners here for advice and guidance. It won't be a Delta. I'd see me with one of those nice bowl turners lathes, no need to mention names at this point. Probably be blue though...
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#9Re: You're welcome
David Eaves
>Sounds a good idea giving them feedback. It certainly can't do any harm. A company would be mad to ignore constructive and detailed accounts of the flaws in their products.
Hmm.. Blue, well I think I could guess from that. :o)
David
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#10Temptation to generalize
Jim Engel
>I guess that what I see here is a temptation
to generalize.
Many people are of the opinion that thirty or
so years ago Craftsman power tools were pretty
good for the money, and that a really old
Craftsman table saw is a pretty good starter
saw with an after market fence.
Looks to me like Delta is the same deal.
A lot of the old stuff was first rate and old
Delta tools are really worth looking at.
But it seems that every new Delta tool is
cheap and poorly designed, whether from China
or not.
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#11
Re: Temptation to generalize
Keith Tompkins
>hey JIm, I have a 1953 Craftsman table saw made by King-seely (General Motors) Big, (395 lbs) heavy and accurate. It was the first machine to have the arbor machined in place, after assembly. Dead accurate. I wouldn't trade it for a truckload of unisaws! It is highly collectable for this reason.
I restore old WW equipment....far superior to the new stuff, as a rule.
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#12see and raise.
Jim Engel
>OK, I will see your 1950 craftsman table saw
with a 1943 cast iron, including the motor, housing, leather belt drive drill press.
When I bought it I was worried about how I was
going to replace that leather belt. Still
worried about it, but I wipe it down and oil
it every ten years wheather it needs it or not.
I would not trade it for anything I see out there,
does everything.
And I will raise you my 1940 or 50 something
Walker Turner lathe, which has been a little bit
of a struggle to get going because it was
missing some parts and had some funny parts
added.
But I think I have it running pretty good.
Thing is, I paid $100 for the lathe, a dozen
pretty good lathe tools and a plexiglass screen
that still is in the catalogs for $170.
I have spent a great deal of time reasearching
and tinkering with this thing, but it looks like
I am going to have something solid when I finish.
Actually I actually turned something today
for the first time, four new handles for the
tools. ( Hey, for me it's a big deal.... )
But it sounds like the people buying the Deltas
spend as much or more time and in the end are
going to be less satisfied.
I am more and more convinced that if you can find
an older machine and find the parts you can
often end up with something much more heavy duty.
I will say my Delta Unisaw has given excellent
service and no problems. But it was designed
sixty years ago and made in America, and my guess
is that everybody at Delta who had anytthing to
do with it are long gone, replaced by the China
boys.
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#13You guys are making me all misty eyed!.
Dominic Greco in Richboro, PA
>talking about all those old tools. So much so that I'll have to jump into the conversation. How about my Craftsman/King Seely 1HP Shaper from 1944? And I have a Buffalo tilting table tablesaw from 1940. Both of which are awaiting restoration in my garage loft. My old Craftsman/King Seely 18" Jigsaw from 1950-60 (which everyone seems to have one of!) is now residing at my brothers while it awaits sandblasting. God I love old tools!
See ya,
Dominic
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#14
Re: You guys are making me all misty eyed!.
Keith Tompkins
>Did I mention my walker-turner "driver"line drill press? Almost finished restoring. Beautiful. I want to find an old PM or walker-turner BIG lathe!
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#15Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 144
Lester Gillett in KC Mo
>Will after reading all the post about the Delta
1440 i had to put my two cents in. I have just
started using my 1440 and i have not had any of
the trouble some have said they have. The turn-
ing store here in kc has 5 of them that they use
for there classes and they haven't had any
trouble with them. I talk to the repair man at
the Delta/PC repair center and he said they have
had a few complants but no real big ones.
I will say that some of the delta equipment has
sliped in quilty but over all i am happy with
with Delta equipment i have. If any one out
has a question about there Delta/PC tools and
need to ask some i am sure Gerg at the KC Delta
PC center would answer your question. Phone is
816 221-2070.
Lester Gillett
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#16No, it won't...
Peter Teubel
>I've seen this time and time again. A new turner wants to get started and invariably they buy a "starter" lathe (Either this Delta or something like the Jet 1236), without considering the mini-lathes (Jet, Delta, etc). They think that the mini lathe is too small and the next size up will be better. After a while they will realize that all those people advising them to spend more for a better lathe WERE RIGHT!
They in turn will try to advise other new turners of their experiences, but they won't listen. The cycle will repeat itself over and over again. It must be human nature or something. I probably would have done the same, but I knew nothing about turning or where to look for help when I bought my first lathe (Jet 1236). The reason I bought a lathe in the first place was because I didn't have one.
I'm not trying to dis' anyone here for their equipment choices or recommendations, just being a bit philosophical.
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#17Here's another one:
Alan Tolchinsky
>I have had at least four of the small adjustment handles break on me. These are the ones that tighten the tool rest and the lock handle on the tail piece. I have had some slight hand injuries when these broke. They are made of a cheap pot metal type alloy as far as I can tell.
As far as rigity problems go, I made a base that connects the front and rear legs and a cross member that connects the left and right sides. I attached the lathe to this with screws/washers. This helped a lot with the lathe walking and shaking.
This lathe is not made for big heavy blanks/logs. I've tried it and I agree the slowesst speed is too fast.
The motor/speed controller mechanism is noisy. I've gotten to wearing hearing protection when doing certain things on this lathe.
I understand the speed control getting stuck is from Cosmoline where the pulley slides on the shaft. I read that mineral spirits followed up with a dry lube is the way to fix this. I haven't experienced this yet.
I still think this lathe is not a bad "beginner lathe". It's not a lot more than some of the minnies and you can do a lot more with it. Of course it's not going to have the qualities of some of the more expensive, heavier lathes.
I know if I tried one of the big lathes I would think this one is cr-p. So I won't. I just want to be happy with what I have for now.
I'm sorry this lathe didn't live up to your expectations and is not exactly suitable for your work. But looking at what you've turned out something is working pretty well. :)
Are you driving up to Bill Grumbine's place and using his big old lathe? Yeah, that's your secret isn't it!
Alan in Md.
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#18Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 144
Jim Rutten
>I am also from the Kansas City area and also have no complaints about this lathe. It did come out of alightment, but I used a double-sided morse taper to line it up and it is fine now. I've made bowls, candlesticks, tops, etc. with no problems. Think it's the area?
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#19Yeah, but....
Jim Engel
>... how many guys have so much fun rebuilding
old tools that they never get back to woodworking,
just go on forever tinkering with the cast
iron, belts and steel ?
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#20At least Delta is consistent
canyoncraft (habitual lurker)
>At the Pasadena AAW meeting in Aug 2004, I printed off a number of rec.crafts.woodturning messages that had been posted on Delta lathe quality problems, and handed them to the manager of the Delta booth to read. I stopped by later, and they kept up a good front of telling me these situations were just isolated incidents. I told them they were developing a reliability and an image problem that needed correcting. Don't know if anyone at Delta took it seriously or not.
If you want to see the specifics, I printed off the more contentful messages from the following rec.crafts.woodturning threads from 2003 and 2004:
- Possible Problem with a Delta Midi?
- Off-center turning - determining fault
- Wobbly Lathe
- Delta Lathe Faulting Problems
(Use groups.google.com advanced-search to find them. I've tried pasting below the links to these threads, but they didn't show up in my sample message and the posting screen accepts only one link.)
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#21Re: At least Delta is consistent
canyoncraft (habitual lurker)
>Correction: when I said "At the Pasadena AAW meeting in Aug 2004", obviously I meant 2003. sorry....
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#22Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 144
Jack
>Howdy,
I'm sorry for your bad experience with the Delta. I suggest that you take it back. I bought the Harbor Freight version of the Jet 1236 and after some minor tweaking got to going my way. That was 3 years ago and it still is ticking along. Oh yest, I paid 169.00 for it on sale. I couldn't have bought a motor for that number!
I'm in the process of re-motoring it with one of those Vega DC motors in order to get the minimum speed under 600 or so RPM.
The only thing I added was a shelf underneath and a chisel/scraper rack on the left end.
I've yet to have it bog down.
One question I have though that one of you heavies might know. What is the almost 1/2" LJ thread in the end of the right hand side of the power head? The best I can find out is that it is a proprietary 1/2-10 thread. My friend's Atlas can't cut a thread to match!
Jack (Oregon Coaster Workturner)
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
#23Re: Outboard thread
Ed Thomas, Toronto ON
>Hi Jack,
I'm not one of the heavies (at 6' 155 lb) but I took a look at my lathe which I believe is of the same ilk as yours and seeing as all the threads except the spindle are metric, you're probably looking at a 12mm LH thread. Nope, went back and measured the ID at 10.5 mm which, after allowing 80% for thread depth gives 13 mm. Ain't metric wonderful.
An easy way to get low speed is ... treat the motor as a jack shaft, put an 8" pulley on the back of it and hang a1725 rpm, 1/4 hp motor with a 1 1/2" pulley off the stand. Low speed on mine is about 55-250 rpm. Don't ask me why I did that. :)
Ed
Re: You asked for it Richard - review of Delta 1440
Edited #24@Ray,
I need a new electric drive motor for a Delta Iron Bed 1440