How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

ThomD

>They aren't in my store yet. I gather others have tried them. Normally if it's in the insert catalogs, then it's available at the store. Maybe they are having the same problems a lot are having getting stuff out of factories in the east, given the level of demand.

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Gary Karner

>I received mine yesterday, I'll play with them today and get back to you.

By the way they sure look nice and are really sharp. Each one came in it's own plastic tube with a screw on lid, very nice way to ship and store them.

ace

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?  *LINK*

Paul Kierstead

>


My experience

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Stephen Shepherd in the State of Deseret

>I ordered a 5/8" spoon bit to give it a fair try. As was mentioned it is sharp, in all the wrong places. Spoon bits, quill bits, gouge bits and nose augers are all traditionally (and logically) sharpened on the end where they cut.

The bit apart from its appearance (looking nothing like any originals I have seen) has a fatal flaw. They are sharpened on the sides of the bit. Any wobble and the hole is distorted into an oval or other irregular shape.

I could regrind the sharp shoulders to make it look better and dull the sides. If some careful design considerations had been made as well as consulting somebody that actually uses these tools could have avoided problems.

I recommend first thing is to dull the sides to prevent hole distortion.

Stephen

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Gary Karner

>Well i've played with them a bit, and I found them to drill a nice clean hole. I've not hand any experience with this type of bit before and I had no idea what to expect.

After reading Stephens post above I went back out to the shop and dulled the edges a bit and was able to get nice round holes with accurate edges.

All said and done they seem to be well made and will do the job I expected from them.

Ace

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Dean Lapinel

>Stephen,

Have you discussed your findings with Rob? I'm curious if your experience will have some impact. A good company will usually respond to good feedback.

Dean

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Greg B�tit Crown Point NY

>They are sharpened on the sides so you can change angles as you are drilling. This is especially important in drilling the holes for the spindles in the crest rail in a bow- or sackback chair. It's also helpfull when drilling the leg holes in the seat. If they weren't sharpened on the sides they'd be no better than a twist bit. It's not for nothing that they're called chair maker's bits.

greg

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Stephen Shepherd in the State of Deseret

>Dean,

I just recieved the bit and did some tests. I was going to post something and this thread came up.

I took a pretty good bashing for my suggestions of some aesthetic design problems, so I was a bit gun shy of saying anything.

But with bit in hand and in wood I could see the problem. And having purchased the bit as a customer I have a right to say something. If used in a drill press it would be a good tool, but not in a brace.

Also in the advertising it says it works in any two jawed chuck. I have used it in two jaw Spafford brace, jamb tapered wooden brace, square tapered thumbscrew brace, and a spring chuck brace. I am sure you could mount it in a T-handle and it would work as well. It is a square tapered bit, so it will work in any tapered hole tool including a lathe.

But you really need to dull those sharp sides.

I would be glad to talk to anyone about old tool design, I use these traditional tools everyday, that is what I do, and after 35 years in the field I am still learning new thing all the time about old tools.

Stephen

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Bob Strawn

>Stephen, Greg, Ace and Dean,

I thank you. The range of reaction tells me a lot. Oddly somewhere between your posts is great clarity.

I don't think the absolute answer exists. I think I want two sets.

One to start angled cuts, but dulled on the side to keep a straight hole.

Another set to start angled cuts and be able to wall out a hole. Both seem quite useful to me.

I'm glad they come sharp, because it is easy to dull if you want to.

Bob

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

ThomD

>One certainly wouldn't need much of the sides sharp to steer them since those adjustments are made within the first few turns. The key thing would be that the noses are sharpened since that is a felatively complicated grind, a helical spherical thing. Having to dub the edges is not much bother.

I'm not sure who they talked to when making this stuff, but I find the tapered reamers too steeply ground also. I'm sure they did their research though.

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Stephen Shepherd in the State of Deseret

>Greg,

You can only change angles in drilling up to a depth about one half the diameter of the bit before you must then drill straight or you ream your hole.

A center bit can change directions of drilling in the hole as you are drilling and that is why they are used for shallow holes.

Gouge, quill and nose augers or bits can also change direction but that change has to be right after the pilot hole is established, some of the bits wander and need a starting hole, an awl can provide an acceptable starting point. Once the angle is established the drilling can continue. But the changes are made on the surface so the sides do not need to be sharp. Nor does it appear any old examples that I have seen are sharpened on their sides.

Your comments about not being any better than a twist bit may be true for Jennings or Scotch or L'Hommedieu patterns, but the Gedge or earlier Cook pattern twist bit will drill any angle hole of a spoon or other end cutting bit or auger.

Stephen

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

Greg B�tit, Vergennes VT

>It may very well be reaming the hole, but when you're drilling leg holes into the seat, you check your progress against the bevels set at the correct angles several times. This implies that there will be need for adjustment, as I often must indeed do.

Also, picture the hole for the outermost spindles in a bow back chair. You start this hole perpendicular to the tangent of the bow, and then move the angle needed for the spindle as you are drilling. Again, maybe the hole is getting reamed, but the depth is a lot deeper than one half of the diameter- especially on the uphill slope- before you are at the correct angle. I've seen this done with brad point drills, but the sides are cutting their way up to the correct angle the same as a spoon bit does.

One nice way of starting a spoon bit is to make a dimple with a smallish high number gouge. With practice you can learn to offset the bit the correct amount & this dimple is unnecessary.

I've been looking for Gedge or Cook's pattern auger bits ever since I saw Curtis Buchanan using them at Colonial Williamsburg (two years ago?). There don't seem to be that many around.

greg

Re: How Are The New LV Spoon Bits?

paul womack

>I had a similar observation the first time I used a tapered reamer in a brace.

I naively expected it to make a hole matching it's taper, but in fact, it will make almost any taper more obtuse than itself...

BugBear