rabbet block plane as a shoulder plane?

I use

jim reed @ tallahassee

>a Stanley #93 and #92 and occasionally an Ulmia woodie. These are proper shoulder planes and work well for me. I cannot imagine a rabbet having the same level of precision.

Re: I have all three...

Glenn Madsen near San Francisco

>and have been told, somewhere, that there is a good reason to use the rabbet block plane only where you need it.

The block planes are sweet, and get used a lot. The LV Medium shoulder plane is great, and relatively affordable. The LN rabbet block was kind of a whim purchase, and still has very few fingerprints on my copy.

Besides, you're going to want to clean up those dados & grooves, too. The edge of the slope is right over there. You won't slide TOO fast.

Re: rabbet block plane as a shoulder plane?

mikew

>Hi Sam.

The short answer is you can. The longer one is that it is not as well suited, which explains the shear number of styles and makers of shoulder planes.

The LN rabbet block plane--which I have and use--can do smaller tenon shoulders as well as a shoulder plane. By smaller I mean in width. Once you get very large, the registration just isn't as good and the length/weight of a larger shoulder plane necessary for accurate work.

Well, that's my experience anyway.

Take care, Mike

Re: rabbet block plane as a shoulder plane?

Michael Brady

>Your question is a good one and I can give you an opinion based on ownership of LN versions of the rabbet and medium shoulder planes. Because you are planeing cross-grain in tenon trimming, the absense of an adjustable mouth limits the rabbet plane to closer grained woods. The shoulder plane on the other hand offers the opportunity for closing the mouth to extreme fineness and a resulting cleaner cut. Some of this is going to depend on how clean you want your tenons to be...after all they disappear in the mortise never to be seen again. I continue to use both for this application, but I would give up the rabbet plane long before the shoulder plane. I hope this helps.

Shoulders or tenon face?

Bill Houghton, retired fun in Sebastopol, CA

>The responses you got seemed to focus on the tenon shoulders, which is what shoulder planes are designed for (the one old one I saw didn't even have a chip escapement, since the "chips" are all end-grain and break up on their own).

I've heard that some who have rabbet block planes like them for trimming the tenon faces. No direct experience on my part, though - I'm a bottom feeder and haven't found one yet.

Re: Shoulders or tenon face?

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>Exactly what I was thinking, Bill. For faces, large shoulder planes work and so do the 140 type planes in rebate mode (without the side cover). I don't worry about trimming the inside of the shoulder a bit because I usually want that for better fit.

For shoulders, I use either the 1/2" LN shoulder or the large LN shoulder. You want the blade flush with the side of the plane so you don't weaken the tenon. I've also used chisels on shoulders to good effect, but the plane is faster and causes less worry.

Pam

Re: rabbet block plane as a shoulder plane?

Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia)

>I am now thinking about buying a L-N rabbet block plane, since it seems like it could serve for both trimming tenons and general block plane work. Do you think the rabbet block plane is a good substitute for a shoulder plane?

Hi Sam

I will echo the comments of Mike and emphasize that ..

(1) For myself the choice of weapon is based on the aspects of registration and momentum.

(2) My go-to shoulder plane is a no-name dovetailed infill that is large (1 1/4" wide) and heavy. It will slice hard Jarrah endgrain effortlessly. Its height makes it possible to register comfortably against the tenon faces as I trim the tenon shoulder. The low side wall of a block plane provides less (too little?) registration for maintaining squareness.

I do have a couple of 3/4" shoulder planes that are excellent tools insofar as build quality and design, but their lightness is less helpful with hardwood. Since I do not spend all day trimming tenon shoulders, the weight of the infill does not induce fatigue.

(3) For faces of tenons I tend to use a rasp (got that from Mike) or a Stanley #140 (tuned up and with a LN iron). I have not used the LN rabbet block plane but if I had one I would. It is probably more useful that the #140, although the #140 is the appropriate plane for crossgrain planing (still, a little extra roughness from the LN is not be critical here). The block plane is preferred over a shoulder plane (even a wide one) for tenon faces again because of registration. The shoulder plane is too tippy in this situation since it has too little to register against.

My 2c worth.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: rabbet block plane as a shoulder plane?

Frank D. in Montreal

>I have less experience than most here but I use and like my rabbeting block for both tenons and shoulders, mostly because I can use the same plane to do both at the same time (when I do everything by hand I usually have to touch up both at the same time--a little off the tenon gives me a little more to take off the shoulder...). Size is an issue like Mike has said, but on smaller tenons required for most of the stuff I do, my rabbeting block gives me more registration on both the sole AND the side of the plane if I compare it to my LV medium shoulder plane (the escapement is a lot bigger on the shoulder plane so hardly anything rests on the tenon when I do a shoulder). Add this to the fact that it feels a lot better in my hand so I have more control over the angles and I hardly ever use the medium shoulder plane even if it's a fine plane. I do use my large shoulder plane for big pieces.

Re: rabbet block plane as a shoulder plane?

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>The block plane is preferred over a shoulder plane (even a wide one) for tenon faces again because of registration. The shoulder plane is too tippy in this situation since it has too little to register against.

That's interesting. I've often used the LN large shoulder for tenon faces with very good results, especially since I can reverse direction with no bad consequences. I agree about the rasp, very cool.

Pam

Re: rabbet block plane as a shoulder plane?

SamW

>A RASP!

Rasps for tenon cheeks

mikew

>And don't forget wood files for a slightly less agressive means of taking even less wood per stroke.

Rasps and files are our friends...

As sawn, as rasped

Mike

Use what ya got...

David Charters (Durham, NC)

>Sadly, I don't have a shoulder plane, a rabbet block or any of that. I use my good old #78 rabbet plane (with less than stellar results, but hey).