Last Second bids/snipes

Re: Last Second bids/snipes

Jack Guzman from Maine

>Bid as high as you possibly can.In your circumstances you can't expect a bargain.The best you can do is hope noone else wants it as bad as you do so your high bid will hold up.---Jack

Re: Last Second bids/snipes

mike recchione

>This is a tough one, but you've still got time. I did a quick Google of "ebay sniping service review" and came up with a boatload of stuff. Essentially, you give the software the information about the auction, your maximum bid amount and the time you want it placed, and the service/software places your bid at that time.

Several of the hosted services have free accounts available, or allow you to place some number of bids for free every week. I'd want to see reviews before I trusted one on something I really wanted. (I guess that's why you posted this :-) ).

My concerns with hosted services would be (1) you have to trust them with your eBay ID and password, (2) the bandwidth/reliability/latency of their connection to the Internet (this is a situation where fractions of a second makes a difference), and (3) what priority does your bid get relative to the others they're servicing. I would imagine most commercial services would have (2) pretty well covered, and wouldn't be in business long if they made a practice of being lax about (1), so (3) would be my main worry, particularly with the free accounts.

For PC resident software, only (2) above is relevant. I guess if I really trusted my own broadband connection, lived in a place where a sudden power outage that could cause an unexpected reboot was unlikely, and didn't mind leaving my PC on while I was away, then I might opt for the PC resident option. Another thing to look for on the PC resident stuff is state recovery after an unexpected reboot. (I would expect it to save its state and reload with every startup. However, if your PC hangs there waiting for you to enter a password after a reboot, you might be hosed.)

You probably know all this stuff and were looking for real answers, which I don't have. I'd be real interested in hearing what you find out, though. I'll also keep nosing around and share what I learn. Gee - it sounds like tool people either don't use this stuff or won't talk about it. If it's the former, this could totally change the way eBay works for us (maybe not for the better).

Re: Last Second bids/snipes *LINK*

Rossmoor Galoot

>What's to think about? I have used Phantom Bidder for all my eBay bids for over a year now and have never had a problem with them. I use them for convenience sake only as I place my high bid with them and do not have to worry about someone inching up to just get over my bid. I just set it and forget it. The service is reasonably priced. I have no relationship with them other than as satisfied customer.


http://phantombidder.com

Re: Last Second bids/snipes

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>I've been very happy with Hammersnipe for the past year or so. They allow three free bids a week and place your bid 10 seconds before the end for the free service. Their paid service places bids 2 or 3 seconds before the end, but the charges are ridiculous for someone who only makes one or two bids a month.

I donate $1 per bid in $5 or $10 transactions to them.

Pam

Re: Last Second bids/snipes

John Truxell-Svenson (jvs)

>Like Pam and Don, I use a service and am happy with it; BidNip (no affiliation other than satisfied customer). First five are free, and it is a fire-and-forget system with geographically diverse ops/data centers, 1-30 second timing choices, etc.

Geeze--all this free advice and you're not going to tell us what you are bidding on??? :)

/jvs

Re: Last Second bids/snipes

Wendell @ Murphy, TX

>I use Hammersnipe also. I've cut down on my Ebaying quite a bit so three bids a week is plenty for me. I used to use some software on my computer but it never worked reliablely. I haven't had any problems with Hammersnipe not getting a bid in.

Wendell

Dittoes on Hammersnipe, works for me

Dale Stansbery

>

AH HA! more suspects

Todd O. Cronkhite Maine Native in FL. Exile :~(

>Ah HA! Admitted snipers! AH HA! So, which one of you was it that sniped me on that nice Translucent yesterday huh? Come now, come now, fess up.

Todd O.

Rounding up the usual suspects

Re: AH HA! more suspects

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>Suspects? Is sniping bad? I don't think so. In fact, I rarely, maybe once or twice a year, bid in any other way. Why wouldn't you snipe?

Pam

Re: AH HA! more suspects

Todd O. Cronkhite Maine Native in FL. Exile :~(

>No Pam, sniping really isn't bad, it's just part of the way the game is played. When you're high bidder until the last few seconds and you get outbid by exactly 1 dollar it can be aggravating to be sure, but when it comes right down to it thats the chances you take when you decide to play the game.

I've lost out on items in the last few seconds that I really wanted to the point of being really mad, and now, I can't even remember what they where. I say if you want to use the sniping programs knowck yourself out, it's not illegal, and is an accepted part of the e-bay game like it or not.

Now, who got that Translucent?

Todd O.

Curious

mike recchione

>There are a lot more eBay bidders than there are sniping services, although the number of bidders battling for a particular item is probably very small. However, we've now changed the game a little. By endorsing one of them, we've increased the likelihood that WoodCentral Hand Tools readers will use that one. And they're already part of a pool of people likely to be interested in the same items. Given both of these things, it's now much more likely that two Hand Tools readers will both use Hammersnipe when bidding on the same item.

How does Hammersnipe handle that situation? Granted, the maximum bids will probably still be different, so it may not be an issue as far as winning the auction is concerned except in a truly pathological case. But I wonder how it resolves that pathological case. First come, first served? Also - What happens when there are multiple bids that it must make during the last 2 or 3 seconds, I wonder. Do any ever get dropped?

Re: Curious

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>Well, that was my first question. The answer is they submit all bids at roughly the same time and let the bidders duke it out. Of course, the bidders who subscribe get later submissions. The point of these services is to snipe the regular bidder, not other snipers.

Pam

It's the nibbler/iterator that annoys me.

Edward Damewood, Northern Alabama, USA

>To avoid that person creeping past some early bid of mine, I typically just bid late -- as Pam is suggesting. I have already decided how high I'm willing to go when I log on for my late bid, and I plop it down as late as I dare.

Sometimes the auction is already too rich for my blood, and I wait for another day. Sometimes my max is way under the winning bid; sometimes my max is way over; and sometimes I just miss the end of the auction, because I'm trying to be too cute with the timing.

For me, then, I guess it's essentially a sealed-bid auction. I assume that all the players will bid at approximately the same time, and it's all about who's willing to put up the most coin.

Re: It's the nibbler/iterator that annoys me.

Dan Clermont

>I really don't think sniping exists. People know ahead of time what they are willing to pay and therefore should bid appropriately.

The guy who is constantly bidding as on auction is ongoing and trying to win an auction by a dollar or two usually loses as he is trying to get that item for as little as possible and the serious bidders usually come in at the last minute with the showcase bids.

I love watching auctions end and seeing the bids come in. Once sold a REcord #5 for more then I paid for it from LV when two guys went head to head and got out of hand.

Dan C

But...

mike recchione

> The point of these services is to snipe the regular bidder, not other snipers

What happens when all the bidders have become snipers, many of them using the same sniping service because it was recommended here? I guess it turns into a sealed bid auction, more or less.

Re: But...

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>I would say the only real problem would be if more than one bidder used the same service and set their bids at the same amount. If I were the sniping service, I'd want to issue an error message to one or all such bidders, but this probably doesn't happen.

Sealed bids? I suppose so. And?

Pam

No and.

mike recchione

>Just an observation. The effect of everybody using a sniping service, at least with the current model, is that the sellers will realize lower prices than they would have otherwise. (That's kind of the point of sniping, isn't it?). Since eBay gets paid by commissions from the sellers, they might change the way that auctions work in order to get around the sniping services. For example, they could (as we've discussed previously), allow auctions to continue as long as bids were still coming in.

But I'm not building towards a point or anything - just thinking out loud.

Re: No and.

Todd Hughes

>I think it isn't "If" Ebay will do this but more of "When" they will do it. Several other online auctions like I believe gunbrokers continue the auction for 5 min. or so past the last bid. Strikes me as the fair thing to do just like at a live auction. I think not only would many sellers like it but judging by the number of emails from buyers moaning that got beat out and tell me if I have any trouble with the high bidder they would like it, many bidders would too. Instead of having what is sometimes an artificial winner who wins by sniping another bidder that runs out of time instead it would allow the winner to be the person that is prepared to pay the highest again just like a live auction....Todd

Re: No and.

Wiley Horne

>Mike,

Interesting point about what would happen if everybody sniped, and I'd like to pick up on it. What sniping does is force you to think about your MAX BID, and to actually put it into the auction. If everybody sniped, then the seller would in effect be holding a sealed bid auction, and would receive the highest of all the MAX BIDS. Well, not really--in fact, he would receive $1 or $2.50 or whatever higher than the second highest MAX BID. And this is the key concept.

It strikes me that sniping does change the dynamics of the auctions, but what it does is force people to think about their max. bid, and put it in--either early or in sniping mode. Because how many times does someone want to 'get sniped' where they didn't even put their max. bid into play? So you're probably right--sniping will lead to more sniping.

Now if sniping leads to more sniping, what does this do to sellers? The sniper is trying to get the item for less than his MAX BID. He wants that all-important second-highest bidder to be sitting there waiting for Godot when the auction ends. The seller is in the opposite position--what he wants is for all the potential 'second-highest' bidders to put their real max. bid in there, and press real close to the top bidder's max. The more 'max. bids' are put in, the less money is left on the table at auction's end.

Now if all those 'second highest bidders' get tired of being sniped, and begin sniping themselves--or just start putting their max. in early--then the seller's position improves. That's why I think sniping sets up a dynamic that is good for sellers, and therefore good for eBay. When everybody snipes, the seller and eBay are realizing the highest possible number of MAX BIDS being entered. And they approach the ideal situation of a sealed bid auction.

Wiley

I wonder.

mike recchione

>It seems that the current eBay system may be the worst thing for a seller. You have regular bidders putting in bids for less than they'd be willing to pay, waiting to see how the price goes. Then you have snipers taking advantage of that because the auction ends at a particular time and the timid bidders don't have time to react. But I wonder if the sealed bid auction is better than the "the auction doesn't end until 5 minutes after the last bid" model for the seller. In the latter model, there is still a potential for bidders to get into an irrational bidding war, resulting in a price higher than either of them would have been willing to pay in cold blood. In the sealed bid model, the fact that all the bids are made in cold blood might tend to limit irrational bidding and result in lower prices than the open ended model. So, going from worst to best (from the seller's point of view), I'd rank them (worst) the current system, (better) sealed bid, (best) open ended.

What do you think?

Re: I wonder.

Wiley Horne

>I agree with you, Mike, on all your points. What Todd lays out above approximates the live auction, which is the best outcome for sellers, because it gets the competitive juices going among the buyers, and gets the last nickel possible.

And then the 'sealed bid' approximation, and then what we have now. I kinda like it the way it is, but would not be surprised to see a move toward a simulated live auction, at least on a pilot basis.

However, IMO a change in auction type would mainly help the most sophisticated sellers, who present their items well. An item which is not presented well has a huge risk premium associated with it for the buyers, and it wouldn't matter what type of auction was held--the buyers couldn't afford to go very high. A lot of sellers would be helped the very most if they would (or could) copy Todd's approach of presenting a lot of information, including original catalog data and good photos on the items. His approach takes most of the risk out of the deal for the buyer.

Wiley