Bench Photos (long)

Attaching the Crochet

Brad in Ottawa

>Dean,

Great bench! How did you attach the Crochet? Did you just rely on bolts?

You also implied that you could or would take off the vise. Have you done this yet? If so, how long does it take?

Cheers!

Brad

Very nice...

Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA

>Looks great Dean! Thanks for the action photos too!

Re: Attaching the Crochet

Dean J in MN

>

Great bench! How did you attach the Crochet? Did you just rely on bolts?

Four 3/8" Lag bolts.

You also implied that you could or would take off the vise. Have you done this yet? If so, how long does it take?

How fast can you unscrew? No more than 30-45 seconds.

-Dean

OT - Fenced Plane

Gerry Doll

>Dean,

In the fenced plane shot, it appears you are using a 13-052. Not to offend the purists, but I recently picked one up. It is missing a couple of blades. Any idea where to purchase?

Secondly, in looking at mine, there appears to be no accomadation made for a knicker. Am I missing a piece or is it just poor design? Leaves horrendous tear-out against the grain.

Gerry

Re: OT - Fenced Plane

Dean J in MN

>

In the fenced plane shot, it appears you are using a 13-052.

044C actually. And Rob Lee -- where is your plough plane? :)

-Dean

Great Post

Wendell @ Murphy, TX

>After all the pestering about photos, I can't believe I almost did not notice your post. I must be tired :) I agree that this post (really the whole thread) should be turned into an article. Now I wish someone could do a similar set of photos using a Nicholson style bench.

You've almost got me convinced to try to a crochet on the bench I am going to build (someday). Was it hard to get used to edge jointing with a crochet? It seems very different than edge jointing with the board in a vise.

I noticed that your bench is in the middle of the room, accessable from all sides. Are there operations that you do on the back of the bench? I am pretty much forced to put my bench up against a wall in my shop i.e. garage. Do you think this style bench loses any functionality if it is put against a wall?

One issue I am still debating in my mind, is whether to use a LV twin screw vise or try to find/make wooden screws for the face vise. If wooden screws were readily available, would you have used them instead of the LV twin screw?

Have you cut any half blind dovetails with this bench? The one thing I've seen a tail vise used for that I thought was neat was cutting half blind DT's. In Kingshott's video, he uses a tail vise to hold the socket board at angle so he could saw parallel to the ground rather than angling the saw. Adding a tail vise just for this operation is probably not worth the effort, but I am curious how you would handle the same operation.

Thanks again for the great post!

Wendell

Exceptionally fine post

Wiley Horne

>and great stout bench!

Dean, what I am finding fascinating here is that you have set the vise screws straight into the benchtop. Really a stout installation, and I would like to ask you about the details of how you did this:

1. Did you mortise into the bottom side of the top to make a place for the nuts?

2. What diameter hole did you drill for the main screws?

I am thinking this would be a pretty good installation for the LV Twin as an end vise as well, and could be done as you have done, or if a deeper jaw is wanted, could be done by making a 'raft' of 2x4's on edge, drilling it as you have done, and affixing that under the benchtop.

Or maybe I have this all wrong. But I found that to be a stunning design idea that you have incorporated.

Wiley

Re: Bench Photos (long)

Luke Herzberg

>Great post, great bench!

I'm sure I probably missed it somewhere, but what type of wood on the top and base?

Also, what glue did you use laminating the top?

Thanks,

Luke

Re: Dovetails

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>Wendell, Kingshott demonstrates cutting half-blind dovetails; but the tail vise would be handy for any type of dovetail.

Pam

Crochet ?

Paul in NJ

>Dean,

What a great bench for handtools, thanks for taking the time to share it with us. I was wondering about the crochet. If you made the mouth of the crochet at a more acute angle do you think it would secure the end of the board with a wedging action?

Paul Dzioba

Re: Great Post

Dean J in MN

>

You've almost got me convinced to try to a crochet on the bench I am going to build (someday). Was it hard to get used to edge jointing with a crochet? It seems very different than edge jointing with the board in a vise.

Not hard at all. I hated edge jointing in a vise, so anything was better. I like the fact I can just pick the piece up and check it with a square, then put it back down. No more unscrew, lift, check, rescrew. Granted you can use a small square and crouch down to look, but for me the board jack and crochet is nice freedom.

I noticed that your bench is in the middle of the room, accessable from all sides. Are there operations that you do on the back of the bench?

Thus far I have done all my work from the front...

Do you think this style bench loses any functionality if it is put against a wall?

I guess that would depend on how you work. For me, I would say it would not lose any functionality.

One issue I am still debating in my mind, is whether to use a LV twin screw vise or try to find/make wooden screws for the face vise. If wooden screws were readily available, would you have used them instead of the LV twin screw?

I would have used wood screws had I been able to get them turned the way I wanted them.

Have you cut any half blind dovetails with this bench?

Funny you should ask -- I'm starting a project and the carcass is half blind dovetails... I'll let you know what I find.

-Dean

Re: Exceptionally fine post

Dean J in MN

>

Dean, what I am finding fascinating here is that you have set the vise screws straight into the benchtop. Really a stout installation, and I would like to ask you about the details of how you did this:

1. Did you mortise into the bottom side of the top to make a place for the nuts?

Yes. More or less. As I was glueing up the top I was able to drop the nut into the hole, trace around it and cut a shallow mortise to fit the nut. I then cut the bottom of the hole out in that board. The nut can slip up in what looks like a 'T' shaped mortise which resulted when I glued up the next board.

2. What diameter hole did you drill for the main screws?

1-1/2"

I am thinking this would be a pretty good installation for the LV Twin as an end vise as well, and could be done as you have done, or if a deeper jaw is wanted, could be done by making a 'raft' of 2x4's on edge, drilling it as you have done, and affixing that under the benchtop.

I would think you could do as I did for an end vise... I'm not sure about the 'raft' and deep jaws. If you clamp a piece of wood near the top of the jaws with that setup the vise will try to rip that raft off the bottom of your bench...

-Dean

Re: Bench Photos (long)

Dean J in MN

>

I'm sure I probably missed it somewhere, but what type of wood on the top and base?

Top is hard maple, base is soft maple.

Also, what glue did you use laminating the top?

Titebond Extend and a ton of clamps, one board at a time.

-Dean

Re: Crochet ?

Dean J in MN

>

I was wondering about the crochet. If you made the mouth of the crochet at a more acute angle do you think it would secure the end of the board with a wedging action?

It was a trade off between the angle and how big the final crochet would be. I wanted to be able to edge joint wood up to 12/4 so needed the crochet to have an opening that large. A more acute angle would have made the crochet longer. In use I have not had an issue with the board not being secure, but it would be something to try if you are building your own.

-Dean

We need some Moxon help here....

Dave (Arlington, VA)

>Hi Dean -

Thanks for your reply. I haven't read Moxon, but I did read what I thought was Adam's description of Moxon over on the Porch a while back. In the pic, your hand looks somewhat like the contortions I was going through. It seemed so awkward... and I thought I might hurt my itty bitty pinky... and I couldn't for the life of me figure out how to get my right shoulder into it.

Oh, well. My vote is for Adam (or someone) to demonstrate this once/if Ellis is willing or able to get a short video function up and running. In the meantime, I wouldn't mind a pic tutorial or two on the subject if there were any volunteers ....Dean?.... Adam?.... Chris....?

Again, Dean, thanks for the reply.

Regards -

Dave

Re: We need some Moxon help here....

Joel

>Here are Monons instructions for chopping a mortise.

the previous part talks about laying it out. The next section deals with tenons.

He is describing a very large mortise for a house frame - 1" wide and I think 2" long

If you read the text closely there seems to be three basic steps:

1) With the mortise chisel 1/4" (remember this is a very large mortise so 1/4" isn't much) away from the ends of the mortise "knock hard upon it" again and again to get the basic rough width and depth.

2) Then using just hand force pare away a the 1/4" of mortise at each end. Then use a narrow paring chisel to pare to exact length.

3) Finally using a wide paring chisel pare to exact width on the scribe lines.

It's fun to read - and once you get used to the font and spelling of the time and the cadence of the writing it's very interesting.

Re: Whoa there....not so fast.....

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>Your technique phot looks a whole lot like the grip I saw Adam demonstrate, to very good effect. Attempting to reproduce his techniques, and results, when I got back to my shop, were disappointing. I wish now that I had taken lots of photographs. I think I need some more hands-on instruction to master this very useful technique.

Re: Read and Heed

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>...as clearly documented in the installation instructions that Lee Valley provides with the TSV.

I would strongly recommend that these instructions be studied and carefully followed, both during the planning of the bench and the installation of the vise.

Further, anyone contemplating installing this well-designed and well-implemented vise should read and download these instructions. These instructions also provide much insight that you can use even if you are building your own vise, totally from scratch.

Re: Read and Heed

Dean J in MN

>Yep -- And I was fine with not having the cover.

-Dean

This is great -

Scott in MN

>I've been looking forward to this - very informative post and follow-up discussion!

Thanks for taking the time to do this.

Re: Read and Heed

Frank Mutchler in Colorado Springs

>Gee, Bill. The tone of your post strikes me as a bit authoritian.....kind of like there's only one way to mount a TSV and to diverge from the published instructions is certainly frowned upon by some.

I've always tried to understand all I can about a project and then see if there are methods I can employ to suit my particular needs. Seems to me that's not an unusual characteristic of many who frequent WC.

Re: Read and Heed - the voice of experience?

Ted Shuck, Centennial, CO

>Bill's post impressed me as more of a DAMHIKT than a RTFM.

Sometimes experiences can be humorous and it can be fun to relate the joke on oneself. At other times they are just downright painful and it is difficult to convey the warning in such a lighthearted manner. I've been down this road many times with my kids.

Ted

Re: Read and Heed

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>I didn't mean it that way Frank. I just meant that the installation is complicated and some precision is needed to make it work well, and the instructions are well written. Of course, not everyone will need the instructions.

Some people even pride themselves on never needing to read any instructions for anything. I am envious of those who can make that strategy work successfully. In my case, I often find I even have to write construction instructions to myself when I'm designing something, because I have been known to forget what is was I had in mind. On very good days, I design. On good days, I build. On so-so days I clean up the shop, put away tools, move stuff around, sand and finish. On bad days, I warn people about bad days.

Thanks for setting me straight, Bill!

Frank Mutchler in Colorado Springs

>