Need advise on Stanley #45 combo plane

Re: Need advise on Stanley #45 combo plane

Ernie Miller Topeka

>78 &45 are two totaly differant planes for differant jobs Sure you can use the 45 to cut rebates like then 78 but the 45 can do more like cut dados there is also some molding blades that you can get for it I only have the beads that came with the plane and it does a good job of that. Changing blades isn't that hard of a deal. It takes some time learning how to set it up and use but with some practice any one can do it. One problem with it is it has no mouth so it can be subject to tear out. I think it is a must have plane but I also have several dedicated molding planes that do a better job of cutting profiles. They seem to be going cheap right now so I would keep an eye out for one or two.

Re: Need advise on Stanley #45 combo plane

L. Hanson - N. Idaho

>You either love 'em or hate 'em. I personally think they're indispensible, but YMMV.

Some pages on 45's on the web that are pretty informative include these (The first 2 refer to types):

http://users.ev1.net/~gmuster/TypeStudy/StanNo45CombPlaneTypeStudy.htm

http://www.tooltrip.com/tooltrip8/stanley/comb-planes/45types/45types.htm

http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan6.htm

They aren't going to replace a set of wooden planes, but they do come in handy on occasion. I personally prefer the later models that have the adjustable fence, but YMMV.

Leif

norsewoodsmith.com

Get one

jim_reed@marietta

>The #45 does the job of the #78 and much more. Use a 1/8 blade to cut to depth and then use a larger blade to cut the rabbet. Works like a charm with none of the dust & noise of a router. I still use a router to hog out lots of waste and then use the handplanes to clean everything up. As for the type numbers, they refer to the different types and follow a date sequence. Later types have more improvements and generally make better user planes. Good luck.

Re: Need advise on Stanley #45 combo plane

Skip in Falls Church

>Hi Asher,

I've had a 45 clone (Craftsman/Sargent) for a couple of years but haven't used it much until recently. At first it did seem unwieldy and kind of a pain to use. However, I really needed it on a project I'm doing now so I got it out and started practicing with it.

I found that, in spite of its short-comings, it's a pretty good plane and not that hard to use. With a full set of blades, its very versatile. It's probably not as good as individual dedicated planes would be for each job, OTOH, it doesn't take up nearly the space that a whole herd of dedicated planes would. I've decided that I really like it.

Skip

I have...

Christopher Fitch @ Memphis

>...a Stanley 45 (Type 9 I think) the type before they added the adjustable fence, IIRC. I also have a Record 405 (Stanly 45 clone) which, I believe, was only made with the adjustable fence.

I recommend the Record 405 over the Stanley. It's just made better IMHO.

Compared to the Stanley 78, there is no real comparison. The 78 was a special purpose tool and the 45 can do alot more. Also, the 78 was not the best version of a rabbett/dado plane. That is reserved for the Record 778 which had a small but signifigant improvement over the Stanley and Record 78. The improvement was the addition of a second rod for the fence that really helps.

Now the 45/405 is not a perfect plane by any stretch. Patrick Leach describes the two main problems with them quite well:

1) It's finicky to adjust. The blades can be tricky to setup and the fence is worse. This is why the fence adjustment is so nice to have.

2) The lack of a real toe in front of the blade also hurts and causes the user to have to be more careful with respect to wood choice and grain direction.

However, it's a flexible plane that you can find rather easily in pretty decent shape on ebay. Also, you can find them at plenty of used tool dealers for good prices.

In addition, you can buy extra blades which allow you to do other types of cuts like flutes, reeds, etc. Finally, you can buy the hollow/round bases which can take the place of molding planes.

However, all of this adds up money wise.

You could just get a 45/405 for basic operations and then buy wooden molding planes as you need them. Plenty of those around at godo prices.

Lots of choices which is a good thing...

;)

Re: Need advice on Stanley #45 combo plane

David Miller from Iowa

>With regard to the Types, I'd say the blade advance is a must have and second the notion that the fine fence adjustment is really swell. Don't overlook one of the keys to using this plane though - good wood. Clear, straight-grained wood and a sharp cutter will turn you into a galoot in nothing flat. Start off on some reversible or twisted grain and your 45 will be back on ebay in a few days.

Good luck

Skip it

Adam Cherubini, NJ

>For me, and I know this doesn't apply to everyone, I had the choice between a SW S#45 an a wedge-armed wooden plough. After a few years of use, I choose the woodie and sold the #45.

I found the #45 more difficult to set-up. The double skate requires the fence to be parallel (or the skate will hit the inside of the groove). This isn't obvious until half way through the groove at which point screwing with the fence isn't exactly high on your to-do list.

For small cutters the double skate is even worse. I tried removing the outer skate, but the skate that remained was off center and I didn't like that.

The adjustment/locking mechanism is especially hokey. Adjusting the blade or locking it moves the blade. I guess you'd get used to it, but believe it or not, hitting a wooden plow's blade or wedge with a hammer seems more elegant in comparison.

I didn't have the beading sole, so I can't objectively compare the performance of the S#45 to a wooden side bead. I can say the shapes created aren't the same and the wooden plane's fixed fence is a clear advantage in a shop where time is money. I don't have a reeding plane and wish I did. If you can accept a S#45 bead, you have the capability to make reeds as well. Something I can't do at the moment.

Since you mentioned the S#78, I guess I'd like to throw in my agreements with an earlier poster. When I make a rabbet, I use a small cutter in my plow to form the shoulder. Pushing an 1/8" cutter is almost like using a marking gauge. The work goes fast. The plow's depth stop gives me a nice shoulder at a consistent depth. Then I waste away with a chisel. The roughened bottom is planed smooth with a rabbet plane. I feel this approach is both faster and gives a squarer shoulder than a S#78 can do.

So I recommend against both the S#78 and the S#45 for the reason that better alternatives were available to me. If you don't have access to wooden planes, or they aren't practical for your environment, then by all means you'll be able to work with the metal stanleys.

Before you make up your mind, I'd like to suggest the following:

1) See if you can borrow a 45 to try.

2) I forget where you're from but if you are in my area, you are welcome to try my wooden planes.

3) Consider a S#46 in lieu of the S#45. I've never used this tool and have always wanted to ty one.

Adam

Re: Need advise on Stanley #45 combo plane

Jim in Burlington Ontario

>I have bought them both in the last few months. The 78 is useless. The fence is a POS supposidly the Record with 2 fence posts is alot better so I'll look around for one of those. The 45 is complex and going to take some serious use in soft woods to master. The adjustable fence is a big improvement over the standard one in fine tuning and I bought it off of e-bay parts are super expensive and I'd suggest you buy the booklet from Lee Valley to make sure your getting all the parts. The wooden plough plane I bought is very cool and does a great job in the test cuts I have made but I need to buy or make more irons for it. After using my firs wood plane I plan on making a few or at least trying to make a few.

Re: Need advise on Stanley #45 combo plane

Alan Hamilton

>Asher,

I haven't touched a router in over fifteen years. I haven't needed to. My combination planes--including a #45--and a few scratch stocks have done all the work I used to do with a router.

I've heard and read all the horrors of how difficult they are to set up and use, how they don't work on ill-mannered wood, and the rest, but that has not been my experience. With a little practice setting it up and using it many of the horrors are caged. Sharp irons--I mean REALLY SHARP IRONS--and a very fine cut have eliminated just about all my difficulties with bad-tempered grain.

Get one! They're quieter, safer, and cheaper than a three horse router and several drawers filled with carbide bits. Besides, I find them just more fun to use than something that's screaming at me and trying to hurt me.

Alan

If you get one, buy a book

Bill Houghton, Sebastopol, CA

>The best book I've seen on the 45 (actually, on the 405, but it's basically the same plane; and I haven't made an exhaustive study of books on the subject) is "Planecraft," sold by Woodcraft for about $10; though I note that Lee Valley sells a book reprinting manuals for the 45, 55, AND 50 for $4.

I can't speak for the Lee Valley reprints, but in "Planecraft," you'll learn about some of the important tricks, some of them counter-intuitive, like starting your planing at the far end and working backward in short strokes until you've got the profile established before planing in the conventional full-length manner.

I've only begun to test the uses of my 45, but I find it a useful tool. It's not as easy to just pick up and use as a bench plane, but then it's doing more complex things; and it's both more peaceful and more deeply satisfying than a screaming Tasmanian devil-on-a-cord, as I've learned how to use it. As with all hand tools, it's also more flexible, even as it calls for more judgment on your part.

Oh, yeah, as for the 78

Bill Houghton, Sebastopol, CA

>The 78, because it has a sole and a mouth, is a better rabbeting tool than the 45, which lacks both. I believe others who say that the Record 778 is superior, but I've found my 78, which came to me fairly cheap, to be a decent tool. It also has the occasionally useful capability of being a bullnose rabbet plane (which the 778 also has). Were I starting from scratch and willing to spend a little extra, I'd probably buy the 778, based on what others have said; unless I waited and paid more extra for a 289, which accomplishes the same sort of work but with a skew blade.

Simply terrific!

Asher F.

>Good morning everyone!

This place is truly terrific. I sincerely appreciate your replies! To summarize, most of the replies suggest that:

1. You either love�em or hate�em :)

2. The dedicated rebat plane will do a better job then making rebates with 45 combo. It sounds like record 778 is a better version of Stanley 78.

3. The dedicated molding plane will do a hell of a better job then combo 45.

4. The Record version of Stanley planes is a better alternative...

5. As with any other cutting tools, the blades should be in proper shape in order to get most out of it.

6. Getting a book on �How To�s� and what to expect form the 45 (55) is a good idea.

Also, links posted by L. Hanson were very helpful and educating, resolved my confusion about plane types.

Again, THANK YOU EVERYONE for sharing the wealth of your knowledge and expertise!

Asher.

Bill makes a good point...

Mark Harrison -- in Sydney, Australia

>It is really non-obvious that starting at the wrong is the way to go! However, you are guaranteed frustration if you don't do it. This goes for the plough plane and the rebate plane too.

I picked this tip up from St. Roy when I was in the US on business and spookily turned on the tele and there he was answering the object of my frustration the weekend before I left!