How to do This? *LINK*

Re: How to do This?

Scott in Douglassville, PA

>I've seen it done with the right-to-left rails tenoned into the other rails, grooves cut into all rails, and the shelf tongue-and-grooved into the rails with enough room for expansion. It's captured that way, and doesn't splay or rack the legs.

Re: How to do This?

Richard Gillespie

>Sliding dovetails on inside edge of legs with blind pins on shelf.

Another way is, to use pocket screw holes on the underside of the shelf. Just enlarge the screw hole in the shelf to account for expansion and contraction.

Re: How to do This?

John Pappas

>Tom, My solution has been to use breadboard ends on the lower shelf.

Re: How to do This?

Sam Simpson

>Hi Y'all,

Tom, when I do this, I use an X stretcher between the legs. The stretcher is lap jointed in the middle and tenoned into the legs. The shelf is then supported on the stretcher. In your picture the shelf is thick enough to have the stretcher let into it. This way the stretcher is not seen.

Regards Sam Simpson.

That shelf is notched

Brian, Boothbay Harbor

>about 1/2" right into each leg. The shelf is about 15" and considering 1/8" to the foot movement for cherry you won't have a problem with it splaying the legs.

I have a couple of them built for at least 7 years and never a problem.

Brian

Thanks

Tom Scott

>guys for the responses. Obviously, the easiest way is to just notch the leg and glue as Brian suggested. My initial thought was to add a small stub tenon at each end on each side that went into mortices in the legs. Considering the thin legs, though, I was afraid it might weaken them too much.

I'll post pics when I'm done, but knowing me that will be a while.

Thanks again for the help,

Tom

Second this approach

Andrew F in Australia

>For what it's worth, it's how I do it too - I'm a trade cabinetmaker and if I remember correctly, Sam has advanced (UK) trade certification.

No support = the shelf bowing as humidity swings or load placed upon it. This will over time either rip the shelf from the legs or place undue pressure on the drawer blade/apron/leg assembly, causing joint failure and/or the drawer to bind.

Cheers,

Andrew

Re: How to do This?

Tom Scott

>Sam,

When you say X stretcher, are speaking of stretchers that cross diagonally with a half-lap in the center (like an 'X'), or a more standard looking stretcher with a piece at each end and then a center one running perpendicular (like an 'H')?

In either case, I assume the shelf would then be screwed in the center from the bottom of the stretcher. Am I seeing this correctly?

Tom

Re: How to do This? *PICS*

Scott Post

>This one is a little different from the one you pictured, but I plowed grooves in the stretchers and the shelf has a tongue all the way around that fits in the grooves. The shelf is allowed to float like a raised panel door. The picture doesn't make it clear, but there are four stretchers. The two running front to back are attached to the legs with M&T. The two running side to side are M&T into the front to back stretchers. Hand fitting the shoulders on a tenon that fits into a mortise on tapered legs is a bit challenging.

Here's a (poor) sketch of how the shelf fits into the grooves in the stretchers:

Tom, like an 'X', cross halving at crossover

Andrew F in Australia

>

Beep-beep

Paul M. in San Diego

>I just love the subtle drive-by with the shoulder planes. Care to elucidate?

Re: Beep-beep

Scott Post

>I made those 5 or so years ago when a company called Hoosier Tool was selling kits similar to what Shepherd sells now.

Re: How to do This? *LINK*

William Claspy in Cleveland

>Coming to the dance late here, but I thought I would offer a description of how I handled this very issue recently. The link here has pictures of the table I built (actually built a pair of them). The last picture in particular shows the bottom shelf.

I ran the rails from front to back, mortised into the legs. The tenons are verticle. The rails have grooves ploughed along their inside edge. The shelf has a long tongue that fits into the groove, sort of like a bread board. I glued it in the middle of the span only to allow for seasonal movement, as the shelf is a single piece of wood.

I hope this helps!

Bill, in rain soaked Cleveland


http://hrothgar.cwru.edu/tables.html

I haven't had any problem with M&T the shelf

Mike Johnson - Chicago

>A few years back I was looking at the exact same catalog and struggling with the exact same question!

I knew I didn't want slots/cracks for dust and crumbs. So, I did the calculations to determine how much movement was really going to occur.

And then I saw a headboard that was made with the panel tenoned into the legs. Which is a more stressed application because it is 2 tenons attached to the same leg, so it can't even flex to allow the movement.

Add to this, that the legs are fairly small in cross section AND the distance between the shelf and the upper rails is long enough to allow some flex...I just M&T'd the shelf right into the legs.

That was 3 years ago and we have had no problems what so ever with movement, flex, or bowing of an "unsupported" shelf.

Check out the pics and go for it!

Regards,

M.J.

Detail pic 

Mike Johnson - Chicago

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