Next problem - twisting panel... *PICS* - Hand Tools - Woodworking

Next problem - twisting panel... PICS

3/23/04, 7:48 PM #1

Scott in Douglassville, PA
Guest

Next problem - twisting panel... *PICS*

Scott in Douglassville, PA

>Ok, the same gremlin that's bitten me in this project before is at it again: After milling, flattening, waiting, flattening again, and dry assembling, one of the six panels on my chest has developed a little twist:

This amounts to about 1/4" twist over the ~16" width of the panel (and, yes, the front panel needs to be trimmed to final height). The board springs into place pretty easily with just a little pressure, so I'm wondering (hoping) that the nails (I was thinking four per side, and five along the bottom) would bring things in place without further grief down the road. FWIW, the thing's been flat up 'til now; we've had several major weather switches in the past couple weeks (warm, rain, cold, snow, cold, snow, warm again). Any chance it'll sit down on it's own again?

BTW, here's the dry-assembly, front panel snafu notwithstanding:

Thanks for any ideas.

Scott

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... PICS

3/23/04, 8:39 PM #2

Jim in Burlington Ont.
Master Craftsman
Offline
2,041 posts

Registered: 11/15/17
Location: Burlington Ontario

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... *PICS*

Jim in Burlington Ontario

>Nails will hold I would clamp and predrill. Those cut nails have incredible holding power.

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... PICS

3/23/04, 9:48 PM #3

Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA
Master Craftsman
Offline
3,699 posts

Registered: 1/5/04

Now I know your not...

Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA

>suppost to use glue here, but maybe a drop on each end and 1 in the middle then clamp and nail? It's just a thought.

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... PICS

3/24/04, 2:45 AM #4

John Aniano in Central NJ
Carpenter
Offline
369 posts

Registered: 12/31/03
Website

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... *PICS*

John Aniano in Central NJ

>Scott,

Yes, I would also agree that several nails would hold this into position and keep the panel from springing out, but here's some food for thought...

Years ago, while in high school and college, I made two toolboxes having the same construction as your project, i.e. vertical grain on the ends and horizontal grain running on the front and back. I also used rabbets to join the corners as you are doing. It took several years, but the mismatch in shrinkage between the front (back) and sides eventually caused the rabbet joints to fail. I had glued them instead of nailing. Maybe if I had, the nails would have allowed for a bit of "give" and the corners would have remained intact.

So, yes, nailing should pull the corners together, but in the future, you might want to think about an alternative joint or design to allow for inevitable wood movement.

John

- - -

My bowmaking web site I have done some sort of woodworking since I was 6 years old. In 5th grade I tried, with my father's help, to make a pine violin. It hangs on the wall in my shop. Later in middle school I had basic wood shop class. No project I can remember that survived from then! In high school, I took wood shop I and II, and metal shop I and II. This along with the usual college prep courses - my counselors thought I was nuts! I made a number of clocks during high school, maybe 2 dozen altogether, including wall clocks, shelf clocks and a pocket watch with wooden case, some of which I still have. I began to collect, restore and use old wood working tools. I especially like 19th century English tools. After graduation, I made a grandfather clock which is now on the landing of my home staircase. I made the metal dial and metal hands as well. In college, I studied Industrial Arts to be a shop teacher. I made a number of projects including a multi-wood specie flax-style spinning wheel and a walnut tool box. In 1978 I began to make stringed instrument bows, self-taught at first. After graduation, between 1982 and '83, I worked for William Salchow, who, at the time, was the best known bow maker in New York City. I stopped bow making in the mid-80's to attend college again, this time for ceramic engineering. Got married in 1988 to my wife Debbie. With her help (although I did a lot of the cooking, hey, I had the time!) I pursued a BS and MS in ceramic engineering. Worked for ~12 years as an engineer in the field of fiber optics (I have one patent to show for it). In 2002 I switched back to making and repairing bows. In 2006 I won a gold medal at the Violin Society of America's International competition. Later, in 2010, I got a second gold medal. Not easy for 50+ year old eyes! I continue to do some general woodworking - dovetailed drawers, frame and panel work, restoration tasks for our 260+ year old home - things like that. Mostly hand work. I have only a few power tools - a tiny 7" blade INCA table saw (which never gets used), 6" Atlas Jointer, 14" Rockwell bandsaw, a circa 1943 Delta 768 10" bandsaw, a 9", 3 foot Southbend metal lathe, Rusnok milling machine, a no-name wood lathe, and Jet drill press. I am a member of the Central Jersey Woodworkers Association - I was the vice president for the CJWA a few years back. I took Mike Dunbar's class in the late '90s and made a sackback chair. Back in ~2010 I outfitted a new, passive solar shop space for bow making and general woodworking. New benches, tool racks, etc. Still working (ever so slowly) on my 10 foot long Roubo-style bench. As of November 2018, the four pieces of ash that will comprise the top need to be milled and fitted, but the base is ~95% finished. Absolutely the largest and heaviest item I've ever made. It has been a fun journey so far!

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... PICS

3/24/04, 12:44 PM #5

Scott in Douglassville, PA
Guest

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... *PICS*

Scott in Douglassville, PA

>Hi, John -

Thanks for the help, but I'm a little confused: I'm just using nails on this. Did you glue the boxes cross-grain, or just nail them?

Too early - need more caffeine...

Scott

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... PICS

3/24/04, 12:45 PM #6

Scott in Douglassville, PA
Guest

Re: Now I know your not...

Scott in Douglassville, PA

>Yeah, I was pondering this, too. Just about 1" worth at the top corner, but I think I'll wait a few days to see if the changing weather brings things back...

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... PICS

3/24/04, 12:47 PM #7

Scott in Douglassville, PA
Guest

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... *PICS*

Scott in Douglassville, PA

>Thanks, Jim. Adds to the confidence level.

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... PICS

3/25/04, 5:24 AM #8

William Duffield on the Cohansey
Guest

Re: Next problem - twisting panel... *PICS*

William Duffield on the Cohansey

>I would not glue them. Glue will not provide the flexibility you will need to keep the front and back panels from splitting in the winter. Hide glue, poly and resorcinol would be even worse than yellow glue, which at least accommodates a little wood movement with "glue creep."

Next problem - twisting panel... *PICS*

Posts

Next problem - twisting panel... PICS