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Est. 1998 — 27 years of woodworking knowledge

Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

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Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

#1

Maurice

It's insane. When I look back on starting my own shop and where it is now. 
Why does this simple material need so many tools ? It never ends if your not careful.
How do you give honest advice on a subject with so many choices ? So many options ? My grandfather was way smarter than me and a better craftsman too. When he handed over the business to my uncle he built a small shop in his back garden. Very Spartan and clean. No rubbish lying around. Just the core machine's, his work bench and some storage for screws etc. The shed had three tip up garage doors that gave him space to work outside on trestles when the weather was good. He kept making stuff for customers until he got motor neurone and died shortly after. He made country furniture, garden sheds, garden benches, cabinets. Whatever anyone threw at him within reason. He smoked rollies on his breaks. Just sat on a trestle and licked a Rizzla.
His machine's were old meticulously maintained Wadkins. He never bothered fitting dust extraction to the combination planer. But the knives were always sharp and threw out dust free shavings. They went in the compost. He rarely drove his VW bug. It was again kept in mint condition. 
Because he was spec ops during the war he never talked about his service. The war took its toll on so many of my family.
I got selected for basic training and passed the psyche and field test's at Brecon Beacons. He was proud and happy for me. But I wanted a normal life too so Volunteer Reserve gave me that option. 
So if I were to give honest advice to anyone, pro or hobby I would suggest this.
Try to keep it simple. Focus on mastering the core skills and avoid the sexy Gizmo tools. Save your money for a good jointer,  a bench top thicknesser is plenty good enough. A 10" table saw is more than adequate. Wait for a good used bandsaw to show up. Good bench, good trestles.
Cut your teeth on softwoods or cheaper hardwood. Jorgensen pipe clamps are great.
The basic two joint's are not hard to learn.
Focus on getting your speed and efficiency before worrying about perfect tight execution. The pleasure lies in making something useful that will last. 
The traditional skills give you core confidence in your ability. Master those first.
Boutique tools won't make you a competent woodworker. Practise will. 
One indulgence I would heartily recomend. A decent compact mortiser. You will rarely need to cut mortises bigger than half inch.
So 6mm, 10mm and 13mm chisels will serve you well. 
And if down the track some young lad or lass shows an interest, make the time to share what you have learned. Pass it on. 
That's why I'm here. It's a worthy and valuable skill. 
Cheers and best wishes.

Re: Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

#2

Maurice, I agree it does not require many tools to do the job, but where's the fun in that? Some may argue that the whole aim is to look like a woodworker, without actually getting sawdust on your hands. If one can be an Air Guitarist, and scientists can be Air Heads, why cannot one be an Air Woodworker? Just think of the possibilities - protecting the climate (no need to cut down trees) ... reduced demands placed on medics (no danger of cutting flesh) ... and speaking of the latter, revival of table saws like the Watkins and demise of SawStop. Replace all with wood printing and CNC. So exciting! I need to rest now.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

#3

Maurice

Whatever floats your boat and gets you a measure of peace and contentment between slogs. 
Sustainable harvesting gives sapplings room to mature. Life and death. 
I never knew a guy on the shop floor who used bridge city tool's. But we did invest in quality Japanese chisels. Spend three weeks chopping dovetails for 32 ft stop Pipe tower's and you will understand why. You go with what makes your work easier. The duds gather dust. 
Everyone had a 12" Starret universal square.
I still use mine every day. 
Before I leave I will take a picture of my most used tool's on the bench. The core tools. 
Cheers Derek. Mate, just do what you love.
Leave the place better than you found it and everyone's happy. That's my motto.
Can't be bothered to argue about machine favourite's. Show me a 10" saw with really good dust extraction and I will get hard.

Re: Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

Solution #4

Ellis Walentine

Good advice, Maurice. Thanks for posting. I echo many of your sentiments.

My grandfather was an immigrant and a successful small farmer. Back in the '40s, he built all his farm buildings and accessories with an old Sears 1/2-hp tablesaw, a Buffalo drill press, a 12" Sears bandsaw and a 4" jointer. My father was a chip off that block -- a pharmacist who enjoyed the economy and satisfaction of building cabinets and carpentry projects around the house. He gave me my first workbench and tool kit when I was 4 1/2 years old and got me started down the slippery slope with his father's Deltagrams from the '40s. I grew up spending a lot of time in the basement, making things: birdhouses, "one-evening projects," eventually coffee tables, canoe paddles and projects from Popular Mechanics and other rags. I got my first lathe at age 9 and continue turning to this day, but that's another topic.

My early introduction to working wood became a lifelong concentration on woodworking and design. I don't consider myself a great designer, but I've managed to design and build a whole helluva lot of furniture, houses and architectural woodworking projects in the past 50 years. I can't help but view everything as a design problem, and woodworking has been my main solution. I got started professionally around 1970, when acquaintances asked me to build something for them. I began taking commissions, and word got out that I did nice work. Gradually, I acquired more tools and machinery and ran a successful cabinet shop, building furniture and treen for the rich and famous, mostly in Philly and New York. 

In 1992, I was recruited by my old publisher pal David Sloan to work with him at Rodale Press's American Woodworker magazine, where I got to write about everything woodworking, and design projects that taught all levels of skills and techniques and awareness. I started WoodCentral in 1998 as a way of continuing my passion for designing and writing about the field of woodworking. I've stepped back quite a bit in recent years as I concentrate on trying to retire. Still, not a day goes by that I don't work on some project or another, and I'm still building furniture when the need strikes. 

Your post resonated with me when you discussed mastering core skills and finding pleasure in making something useful that will last. My philosophy is to do what you can with the resources you have. If the design problem calls for the highest level of craftsmanship, then do that; otherwise gauge your output to the task at hand. When I lost everything in a shop fire 25 years ago, I had no choice but to make do, and to this day I've been able to make whatever I want using simple machines and quality hand tools. 

Thanks again for posting.

Ellis Walentine
Host

Re: Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

#5
Maurice wrote:

Whatever floats your boat and gets you a measure of peace and contentment between slogs. 
Sustainable harvesting gives sapplings room to mature. Life and death. 
I never knew a guy on the shop floor who used bridge city tool's. But we did invest in quality Japanese chisels. Spend three weeks chopping dovetails for 32 ft stop Pipe tower's and you will understand why. You go with what makes your work easier. The duds gather dust. 
Everyone had a 12" Starret universal square.
I still use mine every day. 
Before I leave I will take a picture of my most used tool's on the bench. The core tools. 
Cheers Derek. Mate, just do what you love.
Leave the place better than you found it and everyone's happy. That's my motto.
Can't be bothered to argue about machine favourite's. Show me a 10" saw with really good dust extraction and I will get hard.


Maurice, I think you do not get my humour. I don't disagree with you - I was just sending up the topic of tool choice. It's a lot like sharpening discussions.

Would I know what it is like to chop dovetails for 3 weeks? No, of course not. But it does not mean I lack an appreciation of what makes a good tool to get work done. I have dabbled in building furniture.

No worries.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

Edited #6

Maurice

Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia) wrote:
Maurice wrote:

Whatever floats your boat and gets you a measure of peace and contentment between slogs. 
Sustainable harvesting gives sapplings room to mature. Life and death. 
I never knew a guy on the shop floor who used bridge city tool's. But we did invest in quality Japanese chisels. Spend three weeks chopping dovetails for 32 ft stop Pipe tower's and you will understand why. You go with what makes your work easier. The duds gather dust. 
Everyone had a 12" Starret universal square.
I still use mine every day. 
Before I leave I will take a picture of my most used tool's on the bench. The core tools. 
Cheers Derek. Mate, just do what you love.
Leave the place better than you found it and everyone's happy. That's my motto.
Can't be bothered to argue about machine favourite's. Show me a 10" saw with really good dust extraction and I will get hard.


Maurice, I think you do not get my humour. I don't disagree with you - I was just sending up the topic of tool choice. It's a lot like sharpening discussions.

Would I know what it is like to chop dovetails for 3 weeks? No, of course not. But it does not mean I lack an appreciation of what makes a good tool to get work done. I have dabbled in building furniture.

No worries.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Yes, I figured you were but I hear all those inane comments about sustainability from greenies who drive Volvo's and Tesla's and I just think, GTFOOH. lol.

Added later 16 min 43 s:

Thank you Ellis for the kind words.
I'm a great believer in keeping it real. You have to anyway to get stuff done.
What saddens me is seeing the craft reinvented by marketing guys and YouTube influencers who frankly are spinning the basics to sell product that isn't going to get you there any quicker. 
I take emotional subjective prejudice out of the equation and step out side to objective analysis. If it stands its good. 
Core principles don't change because your marketing strategy needs to suffocate beautiful timber in expensive epoxy or sell a Gizmo that looks pretty and is pretty useless.
You can cheat your way but sooner or later the past will bite you in the arse.
Timber is nature's carbon fibre. It's an exotic material that needs to be well understood to
get results that stand up to use in the real world. 
People who bring their feels in to the workspace never last. Nobody cares. The wood, the machines, the tools. 
Do it right the first time or pay for your crime. A through or blind tenon will outlast a domino every time.

Re: Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

#7
Maurice wrote:
Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia) wrote:
Maurice wrote:

Whatever floats your boat and gets you a measure of peace and contentment between slogs. 
Sustainable harvesting gives sapplings room to mature. Life and death. 
I never knew a guy on the shop floor who used bridge city tool's. But we did invest in quality Japanese chisels. Spend three weeks chopping dovetails for 32 ft stop Pipe tower's and you will understand why. You go with what makes your work easier. The duds gather dust. 
Everyone had a 12" Starret universal square.
I still use mine every day. 
Before I leave I will take a picture of my most used tool's on the bench. The core tools. 
Cheers Derek. Mate, just do what you love.
Leave the place better than you found it and everyone's happy. That's my motto.
Can't be bothered to argue about machine favourite's. Show me a 10" saw with really good dust extraction and I will get hard.


Maurice, I think you do not get my humour. I don't disagree with you - I was just sending up the topic of tool choice. It's a lot like sharpening discussions.

Would I know what it is like to chop dovetails for 3 weeks? No, of course not. But it does not mean I lack an appreciation of what makes a good tool to get work done. I have dabbled in building furniture.

No worries.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Yes, I figured you were but I hear all those inane comments about sustainability from greenies who drive Volvo's and Tesla's and I just think, GTFOOH. lol.

Added later 16 min 43 s:

Thank you Ellis for the kind words.
I'm a great believer in keeping it real. You have to anyway to get stuff done.
What saddens me is seeing the craft reinvented by marketing guys and YouTube influencers who frankly are spinning the basics to sell product that isn't going to get you there any quicker. 
I take emotional subjective prejudice out of the equation and step out side to objective analysis. If it stands its good. 
Core principles don't change because your marketing strategy needs to suffocate beautiful timber in expensive epoxy or sell a Gizmo that looks pretty and is pretty useless.
You can cheat your way but sooner or later the past will bite you in the arse.
Timber is nature's carbon fibre. It's an exotic material that needs to be well understood to
get results that stand up to use in the real world. 
People who bring their feels in to the workspace never last. Nobody cares. The wood, the machines, the tools. 
Do it right the first time or pay for your crime. A through or blind tenon will outlast a domino every time.


Hi Maurice

All good.

Your comments are interesting for me, and I will note that these come up with a few other experienced woodies from time-to-time. Why so? It is partly that earning one's stripes is a hard-won experience, and with this comes developing a mindset that supports doing things in a thorough-but-efficient manner with an eye on the long term, and rejecting quick-fix, short-cut methods which side-step the development of sound skills. Such as new woodworkers who are building furniture within 5 minutes of starting out because that have a Domino or some other expensive joinery machine (hey, I have one of these!). 

Why this is interesting to me is that I suspect it is a situation which likely occurs in many professions and crafts where experience develops and enhances skills. It happens in my profession. I am a clinical psychologist. I have been in practice for over 40 years. Not only do I do advanced diagnostics, and am at the forefront in therapy in my speciality, but I train others and lecture and run workshops. I have earned my stripes. It irks me when I see newbies coming along making promises in advertising (which I recognise as bullshit), taking shortcuts when collecting data, and offering therapies which amount to gimmicks (but acknowledging that an old dog can still learn new tricks). I accept that there is a some resentment here as I believe respect must be earned and not purchased. Equipment? I have not bought anything new in decades other that replacing what I have used up. There are a million tools (aka psychometric tests) which could be added to ones the workshop (library), but I want to rely on the few I have and know well, as well as my hard-earned knowledge and acumen.

We are really not that different.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

#8

Maurice

Interesting. I have long been a keen student of Jung and found his insights vital in my journey. Life is an outer and inner journey.
They complement one another. 
Nothing is harder to bear for a well trained craftsman or woman than to watch the virtue of his craft and its therapeutic value, perverted by snake oil salesmen and pretenders.
I inherited skills and values passed down over many centuries, unbroken. Now the hacks are reinventing the wheel and doing immense damage. My treatment by the other forums is a classic symptom of this malaise. The sensitised easily offended censors of heart and soul. Those who never had the courage to make their own journey and became the simulacrum of virtue rather than its substance.
Yes. I can put a few well crafted sentences together despite my vulgar trade.
There is nothing more tragic than the theft of a man's dignity in his work. The demeaning of honest labour and the culture it builds for all to enjoy.

Re: Lost in the worlds biggest toy shop.

#10

Maurice

No. I knew he built Bollingen and liked working with his hands. He kept it simple.
No lecky. A simple fire pit. I'm going to do the same in my house. 
Assuming I'm not AI. Lol.

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