Stuart Batty Gouge Grind?

Re: Stuart Batty Gouge Grind?

Nick Stagg

>Yes the flute and sides of the gouge are ground to 40 degrees. In the video Stuart shows how he sets the grinder rest angle to grind a 40 degree bevel and then he marks the 40 degree angle on the grinder rest, both sides. He then swings the handle from left to right. You may need to approxiamate the 40 degree side bevels on a coarser wheel and then finish them up on your regular wheel. Once mastered, I don't think you'll go back to another grind. The push cut is the smoothest cut I've ever made. I have a piece of spalted maple in my shop that Stuart did for our club demonstration, with zero tearout, and it appears to have been sanded to 400 grit.

HTH Nick Stagg

Re: Stuart Batty Gouge Grind?

David Propst

>Thanks Nick,

I obviously need to go back and watch the DVD again. I really want to learn this cut.

I guess I am spoiled by the nice cutting shots in Grumbine's DVD.

Thanks again,

David

Re: Stuart Batty Gouge Grind?

john Lucas

>David

I'm not so sure you it is necessary to grind your gouge to his shape although I intend to try it when I get home. After the Southern States Symposium I went home and tried the cut with my gouge which is much different than his. I've been doing a cut that looked similar to the push cut for years. It's very similar to what John Jordan teaches. Anyway I get a very clean cut this way. i think the trick is to let the tool cut with no force.

When my skills are working I can get a cut that I think is very similar to his. Not quite as good mostly because I'm not nearly as consistent as he is. He is a master of that tool no doubt.

I would try the push cut first and then regrind your tool. It makes sense to have the sides and front ground to the same angle. That way the tool cuts the same no matter what angle you rotate the flute.

Re: Stuart Batty Gouge Grind?

tek-Brunswick, Ohio

>After Stuart demonstrated at our club. I have started grinding my bowl gouges the way Stuart does also. Funny, I was going to ask if anyone else has been using the Batty grind. I find it quicker to do than using the varigrind jig. However I want to pick up another bowl gouge, grind it at a steeper angle and use it on the inside of my bowls. Jim Pugh was gracious enough to let my spend an afternoon with him at his place. He showed me how a steeper angle on a gouge lets you rub the bevel more easily in deeper bowls. Any time I get to spend with another turner always turns into a learning experience. Thanks Jim! Joining a club is the best thing I have done to improve my turning. BTW I still use the varigrind jig for my spindle gouges.

Tom

Re: Stuart Batty Gouge Grind?

Don O.

>Not too long ago I bought this video too and was interested in the push cut he uses too. Unfortunately the video does not give enough information on the grind. I dropped Stuart a note and got a very prompt reply which I will share below:

Push Cut is the only technically correct way to cut the inside of any bowl - I'll list some helpful points in this email but to cover all the things that people naturally do wrong even when shown in a class is long and that's why a hands on class with a good teacher is a great help.

Angle on the cutting edge of the bowl gouge for the first 2/3 of the way in to the bowl should be 40-44 degrees - the wing of the gouge should be swept back and straight when you look at it from the side of the gouge not convex or concave - The gouge when viewed from the rear of the tool (where the grind is) should look like a fingernail if not a slight bit more pointy but not actually pointy. Once you get 2/3 of the way on to the bowl this gouge will be starting to hit the rim of the bowl (as long as the bevel is in contact with the bowl) - this gouge is now not suited to the last 1/3 of the bowl. Size 1/2" bar size (sometimes sold as a 3/8" bowl gouge).

The last third of the bowl - this is where most of the curvature is the grain will change and as you come round the corner the gouge needs to be completly changed. This should be cut with a gouge with a cutting angle of 50-70 degrees - the closer you are to 50 degrees the better but if the bowl is narrow or tall the gouge will hit the rim of the bowl before you get to the center. This gouge in general needs to be bigger in dia. as it overhangs further than the first and usually 5/8 dia. actual bar size (some times sold as 1/2" gouge) usually works. The wings of this gouge need to be almost vertical with almost no swept back at all. This gouge grind is only suitable for the last 1/3 of the inside of the bowl and will not work either on the outside or down the side walls of the bowl.

He had said he will send me a drawing of the grind he is using in the bottom section of the bowl. I will be happy to post it once it arrives.

Don

Re: Stuart Batty Gouge Grind?

Don O.

>If possible would you post a picture of this grind?

Don

Re: Stuart Batty Gouge Grind?

Brad Vietje

>Don,

I'd be interested to see this grind.

Just like there is more than one way to skin a cat (never realized what an awful image that brings up...), there's more than one way to make a bowl, and mor'n one way to use a particular gouge.

I've never seen a bowl gouge that was good on the inside, but would not work on the outside of a bowl. I do have a "bent" gouge made for finish cuts in the bottom of deep bowls, and while that would be awkward on the outside of the bowl due to its bent shaft, it WILL work with care.

My point is that I don't like to see entrenched dogma where creative and smart people like woodturners are involved -- hey, you never know !

Safe Spinning,

Brad Vietje

Thetford, VT

Re: Stuart Batty Gouge Grind? *LINK*

Joe Fleming - SD

>All,

If you go to the San Diego Woodturner's website, and then go to the tips section, you will find a grinding handout that explains how to achieve Stuart's grind. There are illustrations too. Joe


San Diego Woodturners

Re: Stuart Batty Gouge Grind?

Mark Kauder, Phenix City, AL

>David,

I will see if I can get you a PIC. I have been out of town on vacation and am coming to the tread late.

Like John Lucas, I attended Stuart's demo (twice) on sharpening and the push cut in Gainesville, GA. I came home and converted 1/2 of my bowl gouges to the 40 deg grind to test it out (I have two of each size - go figure).

The long and the short of the sharpening is:

1) Adjust the grinding tool rest to approx 40 deg to the face of the wheel. Test grind and adjust until you get 40 degrees on the face of the gouge.

2) Etch a mark on the tool rest 40 degrees right and left of the centerline of grinding wheel.

3) Now, lay the gouge along the left or right etched mark with the flute facing toward the grinding wheel (shaft of the gouge flat on the tool rest). Grind that wing, and then roll the gouge through the 80 degree arc so that the flute is straight up in the middle of the arc and on the opposite wing with the flute facing the wheel when you get to the opposite end of the arc. The resulting wings will be straight, unlike the fingernail ground wings.

I hope this helps.

I am still undecided about it's usefulness to me. Stuart told me it might me less usefull for me since I do mosly segmented (100% face grain) turning and it's real advantage is that it cuts side and end grain equally well.

It is funny, you would think that the somewhat thicker angle of 40 degrees would give a good, long lasting edge, but I find that for it to cut easily, I have to sharpen it more often. Since you can do it quickly, this is no real problem. I just don't seem to have to sharpen my fingernail grind as often to get acceptable cutting. The Batty grind seems to either cut great or not at all.

The Jury is still out for me on this grind. I do really like it for the inside of some of my vases (when I do them in two halves). I can cut top to bottom with this grind w/o danger of catches, and it leaves a great finish.

Mark