Home Articles Forums Gallery Marketplace Videos

WoodCentral Forums

Knowledge You Can Build On — Est. 1998

This $39 jig will make you a WOODWORKING GOD!

Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

Posts

Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#1

Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

Arch

>In another thread, I mentioned that most bottles of wine are consumed when opened and not stoppered to enjoy later. Therefore our wine stoppers are mostly for show. I prefer beer and don't save any in cans or bottles so I confused grapes with hops.

Now I see why steel (stainless of course) is better than cork for the second time around.

Stoppers like my friend Ruth Niles' stainless beauties are much more handsome than cork stoppers, but there is another reason to prefer steel and that's the reason why wine that tastes like compost and smells like a wet dog is said to be "corked".

While you wine people, who know from fruity bouquet and sprightly finish, gag and hold your noses, I'll try to explain the little I know about 'corked' to you beer folks who know about adding a pinch of salt or sinking a boilermaker in your brew.

Corks are punched out of the thick bark peeled from cork oaks that are at least 25 years old. They are a quercus, like other oaks and share a chemical that smells bad and covers up that nice fruity bouquet. It's that awful TCA or trichloroanisole (sp?) that does it. TCA is obnoxious but not toxic, at least that's what my search engine said.

Why then does a single malt (whisky, without the 'e') that's aged in _oak casks not taste and smell moldy? Maybe we should char those wine bottle corks or drink beer... or remain teetotal. :)

Here's to you, Arch

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#2

Re: Wine & . . . .

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In Jersey

>But what about the ROSES? He said it was about roses too!

Aw geez, no Roses . . . . .

[Exit, stage left, Henry Mancini]

|;-}

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#3

A Bloomin' Rose

Ed Thomas, Leaside (Toronto) Ontario

>This is from a couple of years ago. John Cabot just came into bloom this week here. For scale that's my head on the right and I'm about 6 feet tall.


img

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#4

Re: A Bloomin' Rose WOW!

Ruth Niles

>Ed, that is one beautiful rose bush.

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#5

Re: Wine & roses, beer ....me, too

Ruth Niles

>Hi Arch,

I'm with you, give me a beer. My brother is a wino, no not really, I just don't know how to spell connisour, connousur (don't feel like looking it up)! Anyway he and his wife keep 3 bottles of wine opened, with stoppers, at all times. But they're successful so I guess that's what successful people do.

I'm just delighted that now turners can make a stainless steel bottle stopper for successful people to own! Warms my heart.

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#6

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

GaryG in MD

>TCA is the common abbreviation for the chemical compound 2,4,6-trichloroanisole. Other chloroanisole contaminants of wine may include 2,3,4,6-tetrachloroanisole (TeCA) and pentachloroanisole (PCA). Scientists in Bordeaux, France, using gas chromatography and mass spectrometry, have recently isolated another compound, 2,4,6-tribromoanisole (TBA), that similarly ruins wine aromas. As little as one or two nanograms per liter suppresses positive fruit aroma character in wine by as much as 50%.

The level of TCA in clean, natural cork is very small and not troublesome. The problem is chlorine. TCA results from a chlorine reaction with bacteria. Infected wines are said to be "corked" or "corky". Chlorine (or some combination of chlorine and something else) has long been the traditional cleaning solution for corks. There are many other possible sources besides corks for its presence in wine. Many wineries routinely began using chlorine bleach as a disinfectant in the 1960s, as did cork producers. Ironically, cork producers discovered the chlorine connection as one source of TCA in cork more than 15 years ago and began using a peroxide solution instead. Napa's Beaulieu Vineyards identified the source of its problem in one single humidifier. Sonoma's Hanzell isolated it to the sanitizing use of chlorine on the floors and drains in the cellar, then spread by the rubber hoses.

It has been learned that the problem is global and environmental, not case-specific to cork production, and that a wine even in a taint-free screw-cap finished bottle may still be "corked," or contaminated with TCA. Regardless of the source or chemical identity, Cork Taint imparts a very unpleasant smell that, depending upon its severity, tends to dominate all other aroma characteristics of any wine it contaminates. Damage to the wine industry annually from Cork Taint is estimated to be $10 billion worldwide.

I confess; I used to write a wine column.

Sante,

Gary

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#7

Re: Wine & . . . .

Gary Evans, Tallassee, TN

>Mark,

Before Ed posted his beautiful rose bush, I was going to tell about a gay bar that used to be in Nashville called the Juicy Rose...

Well, at least it had a connection to alcohol. 8^]

Gary

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#8

No Kidding!

Jim Shaver - Oakville, Ontario

>Now who says it's always winter up here....

Nice to see your smiling face there Ed,

:-)

take care,

Jim

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#9

Gary, question.........

Ruth Niles

>Hi Gary,

Since you are so familiar with the wine industry, corks and "corked", do you think wineries will approve of my stainless steel stoppers? My sister and husband live in Napa country (CA) and go to a lot of wineries, they said "nothing but cork is acceptable to fine wineries". Is this true?

Just curious. I can believe it, not that that will stop people from buying glass, chrome, stainless, even hardwood stoppers, just wonder what the industry maintains.

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#10

Re: Gary, question.........

Pascal Oudet

>Ruth, I'll let Gary answer better than me, but your stopper is suited for a bottle that has been opened, and is used for just a few days before drinking it completely (longer, and the wine will turn to vinegar).

Cork stoppers are placed on bottles to stay here for years or even centuries. that's not the same goal. the advantage of cork is that is allows some (limited) exchange with the external atmosphere. this is not possible with the steel stopper.

Gary, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Pascal

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#11

Re: Wine bottle stoppers & all that

Arch

>Thanks Gary & Pascal, for your informative posts. Good info for stopper turners to file away and remember when talking to customers or retailers. So often here, simple questions or erroneous comments (my speciality) pry up authoritative and usable info. Serendipity rules!

"Never cork your wine, use a Niles Stainless Stopper".

All best, Arch

Pascal, I won't attempt a greeting in French. My idioms don't always come off well, usually not at all what I meant and sometimes even insulting. :)

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#12

Re: Gary, question.........[Long]

GaryG in MD

>Hi Ruth,

Your question is a good one, and Pascal’s answer was concise. Mine tend to go on and on. ;-) Whole books can be written about the tradeoffs associated with wine bottle closures for storage/aging. It was long believed that cork was the only way to go for really fine wines. Many still believe this, but it is being seriously challenged. Viva la difference. I can’t get into that argument here. Let me give you the information that you are really interested in – the subject of stoppers for use after a wine has been opened.

What happens to a wine after it has been opened is very complex and depends on the wine, it’s age, how it has been handled and stored before opening, how much is left in the bottle, where you then store it, how you close it, and many other factors. The enemy is oxygen. The bottom line is that most wines begin to deteriorate as soon as you open them, and the goal is to slow that. This is not necessarily true with truly fine, young wines, say the top 5%, or whatever. These wines may improve for a period of time after being opened. In a wine tasting with young, or even middle-aged wines, it is necessary to watch the wines evolve in the glass over a period of up to an hour or so. This will give you a rough idea of how that particular wine (unopened) may evolve in a wine cellar. Really young wines may even be purposely aerated by a rough decantation prior to serving to try to activate them (with oxygen).

After 99.9% of wines have been opened, and a reasonable amount poured out of the bottle, the primary goal to maintain quality in storage is to remove the oxygen from the bottle. There are several ways to do this. Some people use a pressurized can of inert, heavy gas (nitrogen, CO2, argon, or whatever) to squirt a shot of gas into the bottle to displace the oxygen prior to sealing. Others use specially designed rubber stoppers with a simple little hand pump called a Vacu-vin (readily available in grocery and wine stores). These approaches are very effective, if there is a reasonable amount of wine left in the bottle, and will slow deterioration and maintain reasonable wine quality for a day or two with relatively young wines. The quality of older wines will deteriorate quickly under any circumstances. (The terms “young” and “old” cannot be defined simply by calendar years because it depends strongly on the type, origin, style, and quality of the specific wine. Some 15-year old wines are “younger” than many 5-year old wines.)

So, Ruth, how does this affect you? A stopper with a natural or artificial cork closure should be avoided because they cannot be properly washed and disinfected. As we have seen, the very act of disinfecting can introduce TCA. The ones made with multiple deep flanges of plastic or rubber can be cleaned, but it is hard, and most people won’t. You were very wise to avoid these. The stainless steel cones with rubber O-rings, like your current design, are by far the best because they are easy to keep clean and because more people will have a tendency to keep them shiny and clean.

The good news is that most casual wine drinkers will drink part of a bottle, stick your stopper in the top, and finish it the next day with pleasure and without knowing the difference. A more serious wine lover, with a worthy bottle of wine, will buy a can of gas, squirt it in, and SEAL it with your stopper. That’s what the rubber O-rings are for. With luck, the wine may maintain reasonable quality for a day or two.

If you include an “owner’s manual” with your stoppers, I would recommend that you recommend that the users limit storage of table wines to a day or two. After that, they are bound to lose a lot of quality. (Ports and Sherries can last a bit longer.) You could also recommend NOT storing opened red wines in the frig. Not only is that climate bad for your wood, it will ruin the wine (and who wants to drink cold red wine?). I don’t even put my opened whites in the frig – it kills them.

Sorry to be so long-winded.

In vino veritas,

Gary

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#13

What's the word? Thunder Bird!

tek-Brunswick, Ohio

>If I just CA glued a turning to the twist top on My Mad Dog 20/20 would that work? Maybe an old thread spool and some hot melt wood go better with Mogan David! Hmmm? And what goes with Wild Irish Rose?

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#14

Re: What Goes?

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In Jersey

>Chips, of course.

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#15

Re: Gary, wonderful answer......

Ruth Niles

>Well, Gary, that really was very interesting. I love it when I learn something new. Thanks.

Re: Wine & roses, beer & hops, scotch and peat

#16

LOL!!

Ruth Niles

>

× Share

Share on

✉ Email this page