Turning Red Oak?

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Mark Kauder, Phenix City, AL

>I have done several bowl in Red Oak, both segemented bowls from kiln dried lumber and bowls from green wood.

When Green, the wood can have a tendency to split of wood along the grain, but when done carefully, is works OK.

All the Red Oak that I have worked with distorts drastically when drying and is more subject to cracking than most. I have gone to leaving roughed out wall thickness greater than the normal 10% of diameter guideline.

Dry, it turns just fine, a little dustier than most woods when cutting. Finishes fine, thought the large open grain can be frustrating if you are trying to fill the grain.

Mark

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Brad Vietje

>Hi Doug,

I have posted some red Oak bowls, goblets and vases, though it isn't my favorite turning wood. It can be very attractive, but in my experience, it requires a bit more care than other, finer-grained woods.

Red Oak is a bit stringy, and has a coarse texture. A thin piece of Red Oak end grain will pass light through the pores -- you can breathe through a 6" long spindle piece !

To get a good finish, I've sanded a little more, and have used a cellulose sanding sealer to fill up the large pores on a few pieces. Bowls that will be used for liquids need additional coats of a penetrating finish to plug the pores, else the Italian dressing could end up all over the tablecloth !

Safe spinning,

Brad Vietje

Thetford, VT

Here's Another 

Brad Vietje

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'Nuther One 

Brad Vietje

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Re: Turning Red Oak?

Brad Vietje

>I've turned most of my Oak green, and would echo what Mark reports. The end grain seems to cut very well, but fibers can tear out of the side grain when the wood is green, especially on any sapwood areas. Not only does it distort quite a bit, but it takes much longer to do so -- which surprised me, given the porous nature of the wood. The bound moisture takes 1.5 to 2 times as long to air dry as other hardwoods, like Hard Maple, Black Cherry, Yellow Birch, etc...

Safe Spinning,

Brad Vietje

Thetford, VT

Beautiful!

Ron in Drums PA

>

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Richard Allen

>Hi Doug

A Red Oak tree fell on my house a year and a half ago. I made a few things out of that "windfall". The wood works okay. It cored okay. I drive by Red Oak if I see it on the side of the road. I will often stop and select a piece of Maple when I see it.

Re: Turning Red Oak Crotch

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In Jersey

>About 10 x 6, finish: rubbed-out poly

Re: My 1236's limit

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In Jersey

>If I remember right, this was about 11-1/2 x 7. Second (dry) turning on this stuff gets tough. A water spry bottle helps loads!

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Mike Schwing from Md.

>Red oak is extremely plentiful in these parts. However, one of its nicknames is "piss oak" and its not for the color. It can stink horribly when wet. My wife won't allow me to bring it into the house. A pile full of wet shavings can make the whole house smell like a cat peed in every room. Sometimes, in addition to the pee smell, it can also remind one of fresh vomit.

Brad's work makes me want to wear a vapor mask and turn it regardless of the smell.

Re: Turning Red Oak?

John K Jordan

>>It can stink horribly when wet.

Do you if this is for a particular kind of "red" oak? When I sold logs to the sawmill I found they called a bunch of different types of tree "red oak".

JKJ in East TN

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Mark Kauder, Phenix City, AL

>It is my understanding that there a many species of both Red or White Oak.

I am told, the if the leaves have pointed ends on them = Red Oak. Rounded ends = White Oak. The totally non-politially correct way to remember it, is Pointed leaves = Arrow Point = American Indian = Red Skin = Red Oak.

I mean no offense by the nemonic.

Here are the common North American Red Oaks.

Red Oak Group (Erythrobalanus)

Quercus coccinea-bastard oak, black oak, buck oak, red oak, scarlet oak, Spanish oak, spotted oak

Quercus falcata-American red oak, bottomland red oak, cherrybark oak, Elliott oak, red oak, Spanish oak, southern red oak, swamp red oak, swamp spanish oak, turkeyfoot oak, water oak

Quercus kelloggii-black oak, California black oak, Kellogg oak, mountain black oak

Quercus laurifolia-Darlington oak, diamond-leaf oak, laurel oak, laurel-leaf oak, swamp laurel oak, water oak, obtusa oak

Quercus nigra-American red oak, blackjack, pin oak, possum oak, punk oak, red oak, spotted oak, water oak

Quercus nuttallii-nuttall oak, pin oak, red oak, red river oak, striped oak

Quercus palustris-pin oak, red oak, Spanish oak, Spanish swamp oak, Spanish water oak, swamp oak, swamp Spanish oak, water oak

Quercus phellos-black oak, laurel oak, peach oak, pin oak, red oak, swamp willow oak, water oak, willow oak, willow swamp oak

Quercus rubra-American red oak, black oak, buck oak, Canadian red oak, common red oak, gray oak, eastern red oak, leopard oak, Maine red oak, mountain red oak, northern red oak, red oak, Spanish oak, spotted oak, southern red oak, swamp red oak, water oak, West Virginia soft red oak

Quercus shumardii-American red oak, Schneck oak, Schneck red oak, shumard oak, Shumard red oak, southern red oak, spotted bark, spotted oak, swamp red oak, Texas oak, Texas red oak

Quercus velutina-American red oak, blackjack, black oak, dyer oak, jack oak, quercitron, quercitron oak, redbush, red oak, smoothbark oak, spotted oak, tanbark oak, yellowbark, yellow oak, yellowbark oak

Mark

Re: 'Nuther One

Ruth Niles

>Hi Brad,

I really love what you do with the foot on these bowls, that little ring is so attractive.

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Gary Evans, Tallassee, TN

>Mark is correct as far as the different species which are referred to as red oak.

By my understanding, the harsh smell is primarily due to bacterial infestation. Not all red oaks smell bad. I use red oak quite a bit for fire wood and I really like the smell. I haven't taken much for sale at the shows because there doesn't seem to be much interest among turners, but I am taking some crotches to Southern Style to see how they do. Both red and white oak crotch wood is amongst the prettiest of the crotch woods.

Gary

Re: Turning Red Oak?

John K Jordan

>Gary,

I'll bet it would sell if buyers could see some of the pieces shown here!

The very first bowl I turned was red oak. After buying a lathe just to make one special shaft, I looking around my shop for something to turn and glued up some 4/4 stock and made a bowl. I thought it was great and have been puzzled since every time I heard that "nobody turns oak".

I didn't make it to the meeting due to illness. I do want to meet up with you sometime soon and see what wood you have for sale.

JKJ in East TN

Re: Turning Red Oak?

keith tompkins

>Brad, these are great! Who says red oak isn't a good turning wood!

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Capt Skip

>Doug good question and I am happy to see your responses.

A big thank you to Brad for those pictures. I was invited to collect some wood yesterday. I ended up with a nice collection of wood including some red and white oak. So I am thankful they look so nice especially those natural edge bowls. I was looking for cherry but these logs looked too nice.

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Gary Evans, Tallassee, TN

>Hi John,

I didn't make it either. I got to Gatlinburg late and ran into the bumper-to-bumber at the bypass so I decided to bag it and go on up to Engish Mtn., where I was going afterwards anyway.

I brought home some 14" pieces of cherry, so I can't complain. I would have liked to see Ray Key, though.

I'll e-mail you and we'll figure out a way to get together.

Gary

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Doug

>Thank you for the great response. Yes who said it wasn't fit to turn.

Brad AWESOME really like the natural edges.

Capt thats a nice haul.

Nice one !

Brad Vietje

>

Re: 'Nuther One

Brad Vietje

>Hey Ruth,

I shamelessly copied this foot design from Robert Chapman. A shorter, wider version of what he uses for his footed natural-edge bowls, like the one on the cover of his book: Woodturning: A Fresh Approach. The ring isn't really a bead, but a pretty sharp-edged sorta thing -- flares up and out from the base, then a slightly curved, less than 90 degree angle to the body of the bowl -- doesn't show real well in the pic's.

Safe Spinning,

Brad Vietje

Thetford, VT

Re: Turning Red Oak?

Brad Vietje

>Thanks Doug (and Mike too),

The second one I posted (Another One) has more distinct Medullary rays than usual for Red Oak, and you might notice the pores are rather dark... all due to a common problem with the Oaks you might want to know about.

If you turn it green with a freshly sharpened tool (as always, right) you can leave tiny flecks of iron behind, and the wood will develop blue/black spots. If you then try to wet sand them away while the wood is still wet, the entire bowl will take on a muddy look, and after about an hour, the entire sanded surface can look awful. If you have some lime or lemon wedges around, you can rub them into the wood and let the juice neutralize the staining, leaving dark-stained pores behind...

Or, you can wipe your tools off with a bit of mineral oil, dry and sand as usual, and use black shoe polish or patinating wax to acheive the same look with a world less worry and work !

Safe Spinning,

Brad Vietje

Thetford, VT

Re: Nice one ?

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In Jersey

>Thanks Brad,

I had tried one with a bark edge, but most of it warped/split off during drying. How do YOU get the bark to stay on so well?

Mark

Re: Nice one ?

Brad Vietje

>Hi Mark,

I have the best luck with fresh, winter cut wood. Otherwise, I soak the bark with thin CA (both sides) when its near final thickness, then take the finishing cuts. I usually apply this carefully with a q-tip so I don't discolor the wood below the bark.

This includes wood that WAS fresh and winter cut, but has been sitting around a while. I do the same with fresh, green wood if there's a lot of moisture in the cambium, as the interface of bark and sapwood gets real slippery, and is prone to separate.

Sometimes you can even re-attach a small chunk of bark if you lose it, but you have to have a much cleaner shop than mine -- I don't think I could find a flying piece of bark these days !

Safe spinning,

Brad Vietje

Thetford, VT