I thought I would post a new message as to your rejection from the show.
You are one of the most creative woodturners that I have ever known. I realize that it seems to be all about the slides, but your pics look great to me.
I am not sure what the problem with the jurors was. Is it all about photoshop and pro photos? Or is it about talented and creative wood artists?
I do believe they missed the boat on your work.
I realize that they ony have a few seconds to judge someones work from the slides. But why? Are they that pressed for time that they cannot take the time to see see a true creative person at work.
I know that this has been the norm forever, but I see a need for a change. Would it kill them to take a minute to see the work for what it is, instead of rushing toward the exit as fast as they can.
Sorry to vent, but I hate to see a talented person get left out of a good show because of... "thats the way we do things"
Please keep going on the quest, I love the work you are doing.
Judges do tend to go with the flow. Molly's work is unique and they probably overlooked the artistry and beauty of the turnings because they haven't seen or displayed cave drawings YET.
Molly, I'll wager your work will become known and recognized and you can send those people a letter saying you'll submit work as a favor to them! wouldn't that be a hoot?!?
Seriously, judges are just people with opinions and they don't always reflect the opinions of judges at other juried shows.
Molly, you found your voice now go find your audience.
I know your response is sincere and felt by all artists submitting slides. Me too. I have been a juror a few times and the Bruce Baker workshop showed me that my experience was similar to most juries. Here's the reality of the situation.
I'm pulling these numbers from the Tennessee Association of Craft Artists show which is one of the biggest in Tennessse but certainly not like the big shows. We had around 500 artists vying for about 100 slots. (the show has 180 artists but many get juried in the previous year so don't have to reapply) We view 5 slides from each artist. We view all 5 at once.
Here's the process and my understanding is that it's similar to this throughout the jury sytsem. We view all the slides about 5 seconds each. This is to get a feel for the quality of the work so you don't start off with too high a score at the beginning and you have some standard. Then we go back and view each group of slides. They read the artists statement about thier work and we give them a score. 1 through 5 and you can't give a 3. This takes about 30 seconds or less depending on how long it takes to read the statement. I ran projectors for them the last time and it took about 20 seconds per group. This seems short but it takes quite a while to run through them. I'm told that in larger shows the jurors take a break.
It's harder than it looks and every juror that I've met takes this very seriously. We also try to ignore the photography but the truth is you can't. When you have 2 artists work and the quality is similar but one group has knock your socks of slides the the other has mediocre it's very hard not to give the good slides a slightly higher score. Like I said you have 20 seconds to make up your mind and it's hard to remember exactly how the last dozen or so slides compare to this one so make a judgement.
At TACA we go back afterwords and talk about the process and how we felt about the slides and work. Since I'm a photographer of art work I always ask the same question you ask. Does the photography affect your judgement. The answer is always just what I stated. You try really hard to ignore the quality of the slide and look at the work but the truth is you can't always.
Molly's slides were good. Not great. They were good clean photos, non obtrusive backgrounds, sharp focus. These would have kicked butt 10 years ago. I'm ignoring the quality of her work for now which I think is excellent also. Artists are now realizing that the slides do affect the judging and many artists have hired skilled art photographers and send it really nice slides with backgrounds that although plain are much more dramatic. The lighting is more dramatic and the photo is generally snappier. This makes it really hard to judge artwork on the quality of the work solely. Especially when you are judging a necklace against a wooden vessel against a woven dress. It's tough.
Everyone agrees that we should see the work and not just use slides. That's why TACA does an onsight jurying the day of the show. The artists with the highests scores are invited back for next year so they don't have to endure the jury process and thier work is in fact judged face to face.
It's not a perfect process and really sucks when your in the shoes Molly is in right now. I know she'll find other shows, here work is too good. Still it sucks. She may get in the same show next year with the same slides simply because the jurors have changed and one or two of the 5 or so jurors may give her a higher score.
I hope this clears up the jury process for some of you. It's not great but it is what happens so we have to learn to live with it. That's why good slides are worth the effort. If it costs you a thousand dollars but you get in a show that has averages daily sales of a thousand dollars more than your previous shows, then the photography pays for itself.
>Well you are rigth in every way ,I have been that route too many times before,here it does not matter if you are good just by being a foreigner is plenty any person/artist from abroad will get max,exposure and command big fees for his work never mind is is any good or just a begginer,once I share a show (80s)with a guy from wales,Eng he just started making bowls ,plates and had no Idea how to make vessels
but he was getting 20 times de prices because he was from wales peaple told me ooohh,he must be god wow, and his things were lousy and badly finnish but they sold out,after that I lost all hope in peru and now still the same way here,but Im doing fine sales wise just because a company from Costa rica saw my turnings and they know abouth this ,funny now than they are buying big from me peruvians are realizing they miss the boat and want to get on it jajaja,well that is life no?
>Oh my goodness I'm blushing. Can I hire you as my PR man Dave? Thank you for your support and indignation, it's touching. Boy, I was just blowing a little steam, and what a response I got. I love the friends I have here! Ruth, you ROCK!
>John, thank you for that great peek in the window. I really had no idea how the jury really works. It helps to hear what the jurors have to go through to get a better perspective on the whole process. It makes me a little less myopic. It's also easier to not take rejection personally (although I really didn't before). Thanks for shedding more light on this subject.
>Hi Molly, thanks for sharing your disappointment..it really started a great topic.
Many people responded that the jury process wasn't fair, and maybe it's not. However, as John pointed out, this is an extremely competitive field, in an even more competitive world. Sometimes, just the smallest detail, such as slide quality can make all difference between failure and success.
If you don't mind a critique of sorts, you have much to be excited about....Molly, your forms are wonderful; in fact, in my classes I talk about design elements such as unity, movement, balance and flow, your pieces display all of those qualities. You are putting a little bit of yourself in each piece you produce, and it shows. That's why the rejection hurts so much.
As the turning moderator, I feel it is my job to inspire those who frequent this great place. So I will tell you.....don't let one little rejection get you down: believe in yourself, and shoot for the stars! You cannot lose..I guarantee it!
>Yes thanks Molly. It is hard when you want something and it doesn't workout. The problem with some of our work is a picture doesn't give the best impression of the detail.
Molly I didn't really care to much for the stuff you were doing UNTIL I was able to see it and pick it up in Vancouver. Now I know what I am looking at and have a way better understanding of what the piece looks like.
This has happened to me a couple of times now. Andi's work I felt the same way about until I sat beside a table full of her work she takes to her demo's.
I now very much enjoy the pictures of your work and Andi's and I am sure I wouldn't if I had not seen them in person. I guess what I am saying is as you are "Out There" more and more I think others will understand your work better.
This was a very good thread that you started Molly and I thank you again. I also look forward to your next posts!
Thanks for the informative post. I have been juried into a few shows, so I do know the pressure that they are under.
I guess I was just wondering if it is indeed the best way to get the best work into a show? I know that is the way things are in the process.
I once found the jury cards from a show that I applied for. At the time I was making Shaker chairs with an oil finish. As I was reading the comments, I found one juror that said... "I would never accept a piece of work that did not have a finish on it" It really blew my mind that someone would judge my work with so little idea of what I was doing. And she saw this in person :) I guess I should have stained it. :)
But I do have great respect for most jurors, It is a tough job to see a photo for a few seconds and make a judgement.
I guess I was just venting at their loss. And sticking up for a friend.
