The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia)
>The Lee Valley �Little Victor� reproduction Block Plane
Reviewed by Derek Cohen
The Lee Valley website states This little plane is a close copy of Leonard Bailey's 1877 "Little Victor" #51 block plane, which was once advertised as the "perfect tool, useful in house, shop, bank, office and especially in scroll saw work".
The �Little Victor� is the first reproduction plane made by Lee Valley. More will follow this one.
The plane reviewed here was sent to me by Lee Valley for feedback prior to release. I have essentially included below the comments I made to them. Prior to receiving it, I had only seen pictures of the Bailey �Little Victor� block plane. I was aware of their relative rarity and that collectors are willing to pay several hundred Dollars for one in good condition.
To my eye this looks an exact copy, but I was informed that it was fractionally larger than the original.
The other difference is the colour, burgundy, which was apparently chosen for its elegance and distinctiveness.
Features
The notable features of the Little Victor are
� A body 3-1/8" long by 1-1/4" wide, and weighing just under 5 oz.
� An �investment-cast steel body� with a lapped sole (another first for Lee Valley).
� A 45� bed angle and a fixed mouth.
� The blade is secured by cogwheel screw. It has a 30� bevel and is made from O1 tool steel, measuring 0.085" thick by 1" wide.
� Lee Valley state that both the sole of the plane and the working surface* of the blade are lapped to a flatness tolerance of �0.0002" or better.
To appreciate the size of this little pocket plane it is here viewed alongside a Stanley #65 Knucklejoint block plane. The Starrett combination square is 4� long.
This is indeed a tiny plane.
Using the Little Victor
I had not previously used a plane as small as this and my first efforts were somewhat clumsy. I found it difficult to sustain registration and the blade cut into my palm. The grip in the catalogue illustration appears to recommend a grip that involved a pincer grip with one hand and the use of the thumb of the other hand. Like so:
This works but is not as stable as what evolved as I experimented. While this plane is high mass for its size, it is still small and light and requires significant even down force to prevent it skipping.
The plane can be used by pushing or pulling.
The grip for the push begins with placement of a ring finger in the rear recess. Then one grips the sides with fore fingers. Finally the thumb is placed across the front recess.
The grip I preferred for the pull is identical but in the reverse position.
It can be seen that my palm is well clear of the blade in these illustrations. However, it strikes me that many will want to use this plane one-handed in a palmer grip, that is, the palm is wrapped low down around the plane. Lee Valley provide this illustration:
This would be what I would do, and what I see as the main use that the plane would be put to. Such as breaking edges (i.e. chamfering). When attempting this the blade cut into my palm. This is the one area that I feel is remiss in the construction � the top edge of the blade was a little sharp (no rough edges � just cleanly squared off). I dealt with this by chamfering them slightly.
This does make a significant difference but I felt that the blade could be slightly shorter as well.
Performance
The performance of the plane was surprisingly good. The blade was very well machined � flat - and, as a result, easy and quick to hone. I ran it freehand over a 1200 diamond stone and then over a leather strop loaded with Veritas green rouge. This was sufficient to shave arm hair. The O1 steel held a good edge.
The blade holding mechanism felt solid and worked well. There was no indication of the blade coming loose. I lay the sole on a sheet of glass, slid in the blade, and then tightened up the cogwheel. This was usually enough to set the depth of cut. Adjustments could be made with gentle taps from a hammer.
Shavings on long (edge) grain were easy (with the above grip). Here are some in Rock Maple.
Some serious full-width shavings can be taken!
Planing end grain was equally successful. Here is Rock Maple ..
.. a clean finish on hard Jarrah:
and on Tasmanian Oak:
More than simply a block plane
It struck me that the small footprint of the plane would be ideal for those occasions when one needed to remove small sections of tearout. Of course this is not the province of a 45-degree angle of attack. However, with the 30-degree bevel, by reversing the blade one gets a 75-degree angle of attack. Of course, the mouth is now gigantic, but this is irrelevant at this cutting angle.
The Little Victor worked very well as a high angle smoother/scraper. In the first picture, the Rock Maple has a section of tearout that I was not able to remove with a standard angle plane. The second picture shows the fine shavings that were taken and the now clean surface.
Here are a few more shavings in HA mode, first on Rock Maple �
�. And also in Jarrah:
Conclusions
Comparison with other small block planes is inevitable. The Little Victor reminds of the Lie Nielson bronze #102/103 insofar as that it is a high-mass-to-size plane. It feels substantial. At its size its closest rivals would be the Stanley #100 and #101, which are also around the 3 �� mark. These cannot compete with the Lee Valley�s solid construction, superior materials, and thicker blade.
I would not consider the Little Victor to be a substitute for a �full sized� block plane. It lacks their registration and comfort in the hand. It is not a cheap alternative to one of the recognized users, such as a Stanley/LN #60 � or Veritas Standard and Apron block planes. Nevertheless, this little plane has a niche in the workshop or construction site.
Once an appropriate grip is mastered the Little Victor is quite comfortable and controllable.
The Little Victor is small enough to drop into a pocket � and one may even forget that it is there! Yet its performance is certainly much larger than that. Cute it may be, but it is not a toy. It is capable of big-plane performance on end grain and face grain. I see its biggest value as a �tweaking plane� (as Rob Lee termed it). Keep one just for a quick chamfer, breaking edges, and planing small sections.
Derek Cohen
Perth, March 2007
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#2Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plan
Paul Kierstead
>Good review, thanks for posting it! An interesting product. I wonder if a plane that cheap lets be sneak around my no-more-new-planes rule?
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#3Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plan
Rob Lee
>Paul -
Please.... it's "inexpensive".....not "cheap" :)
This plane is the first official product of a new brand....a number of products we just couldn't market as Veritas. In this case, it's a reproduction, which disqualifies it from being labelled Veritas...
There will be a bunch more badged this way, in addition to other tools besides planes. Veritas, too, will continue with new planes - the LH edge in a few weeks, and then the small router after that.
This is the first time we've lapped plane soles (in addition to the blades) - and are really pleased with the finish. It's certainly not the last one ....
Cheers -
Rob
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#4Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plan
Paul Kierstead
>Okok, inexpensive it is :) That is what I meant, of course.
Product line differentiation, all that, I understand quite well, but I see no evidence of a product badge at all. In fact, if the plane was handed to me, I would have to say it "Doesn't have a makers mark." At least from the pictures. Is the product line name embargoed till another date as well :D ? More business; I am guessing you are choosing something other then the "Lee Valley" line to facilitate resellers? Sorry, not trying to derail the product aspect of it....
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#5Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plan
Rob Lee
>Hi Paul -
Well - we do have the name filed, and are just finishing up the logos, and dotting the legal "i"'s etc.....
It's harder that most people think to register a trademark in multiple countries. I can tell you that it won't be "True North Design" (which we missed in one country), nor will it be "Artifex" - which a German tool company has for hand abrasives...
So for now - it's just the burgundy, to indicate that it's different from Veritas in some way...
The next products will likely be marked...somehow...
Cheers -
Rob
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#6Thanks, Derek and Rob
Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX
>Great review of a nice little tool, Derek, you tried a couple of things that aren't obvious to all plane users, such as flipping the blade and chamfering the blade's top edges. And thanks to Rob et al for starting this line, it will be very interesting. I love it that the blade is regular o1 (at least that's my assumption when the replacement blade is o1).
Rob, can't wait to see the tiny router. With tiny blades? o1, too?
Pam
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#7How about a skew bladed anything?
jim reed @ tallahassee
>Very cute little plane which should be quite handy in the shop. How about reproducing some skew blade planes? HARDLY ANY on the market and skew blades cut BETTER. Easier to use, less tearout, and the spiral shavings are WAY COOL.
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#8Re: How about a skew bladed anything?
Rob Lee
>Hi Jim -
Veritas is finishing up the R and L skew rabbet planes now...
The reason some of these take longer is the complexity/cost of the tooling, and the expected sales... one can only sink so much capital into tooling at a time...not to mention the patent work...it takes a bit of time to recharge the financial batteries....
Cheers -
Rob
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#9Re: Thanks, Derek and Rob
Rob Lee
>Hi Pam -
That's the plan...still doing destructive testing on the blades (everything else is set). We have a round shaft on our blade, threaded and brazed...
It's amazing how much force these blades have to hold up to...
Cheers -
Rob
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#10Kidnapped!
Paul Kierstead
>Who is the guy telling all and what have you done with Rob?
Skew rebates. Small router. Sheesh, I can hear it now ... "Another plane? Why do you need another plane?"
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#11Start your collection now!
Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA
>That way you'll have type 1's and 2's...
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#12Kewl Skews! I can feel the cash...
Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA
>falling out of my wallet, and my credit card is feeling very warm too...
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#13Nice review Derek...
Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA
>You answered question in the post below, thanks!
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#14Great news
Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX
>I've got a 271 and some spare blades, couple of which I can grind down to 1/16-1/8" for inlay, but I'd really like to have a couple or three routers so I can set them up and maintain for the job duration. Will your round shafts fit in the 271? And vice versa? Will they be slottled?
I bet it is hard to strengthen the blades. That's why we pay you the big bucks. :)
Pam
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#15Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plan
HC Sakman
>How about "LVR" ?
Lee Valley Reproductions
I bet nobody has this name anywhere.
Chico...
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#16Kind of like your "Classic Reprint" books, yes?
Bill Houghton, Sebastopol, CA
>My first reaction to the plane was disappointment - LV's hallmark is rethinking designs, and this is a straight copy, with what looks to me like a rather odd bedding - pivoting around those central "tabs."
But if you're getting into reproductions, that's a different matter; 'twill be interesting to watch.
Where do you guys get your energy? Or is it the long dark winters, with lots of time to hatch ideas?
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#17Goodie ! Goodie ! Goodie!
Jim Reed @ Tallahassee
>My mouth is watering. Now if you guys could just develop a SKEW BLADE ADJUSTABLE CHAMFER PLANE. That would be just impressive. Kinda like a #289 with one fixed and one adjustable bottom guide.
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#18Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plan
dave brown
>Why not just label them with Lee Valley or LV?
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#19Thanks for taking the time...
Dave Thompson
>Nice review Derek. Just the photos of it look much more attractive to use than a Stanley 100. It's been a while, but I seem to recall the short blade on a stanley 100 could be a little tricky to use a honing jig on. This LV LV blade looks tall enough to not have any issue at all.
enjoy,
Dave
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#20Re: Thanks for taking the time...
Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia)
>Hi Dave
I did not try the blade in a jig, but I cannot see that there should be any difficulties with either Eclipse- (side clamp) or LV (face/back clamp) types.
I should have mentioned that it comes with a fine hollow grind. While it is possibly useable out of the box (no, I did not show that either!), it is not something that I give much credence to, and so the first thing I do is hone the blade. And since I prefer a hollow grind on blades used bevel down, I just swiped it over a diamond stone and a leather hone. In this regard, it was long enough to hold securely.
Regards from Perth
Derek
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#21Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plan
Angus Barclay, in New Zealand
>Hello Derek,
thanks for posting the review. If I hadn't already found the joys of card scrapers for dealing with small areas of tearout I would be pestering our Canadian cousins for one of these and finding a couple of cubic inches spare space in the hand-tool cabinet.
cheers
Angus Barclay
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#22Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plan
Rob Lee
>Hi Dave -
That's what one does for a house brand - sorta saying "this is someone else's product, that we stand behind". Nothing wrong with that, but our new brand will represent products that we had a hand in manufacturing (somehow)... could be design only, could be manufacture only, or, a combination of both...
Cheers -
Rob
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#23Re: Kind of like your "Classic Reprint" books, yes
Rob Lee
>Hi Bill -
Good analogy.. it is kind of like the Classic Reprints.... but we won't be making exclusively reproductions...
The best definition of what we'll be doing is: things that Veritas isn't doing, or can't do....
This activity will complement what's going on at Veritas, not replace it.
Cheers -
Rob
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#24Re: Great news
Rob Lee
>Hi Pam -
They won't be slotted, and I'm not sure they'll fit in a 271 - will check...
Our blade lock-up is different on this one too...
Cheers -
Rob
Re: The LV "Little Victor" reproduction block plane
#25Re: blade shanks
Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX
>Hmmm, seems that round shanks should have a flat or slot or something to keep them from turning. Maybe plain old metal friction would work so the blade could be held without deforming the shank?
It would be great if the blades were interchangeable, for all kinds of reasons, but can't say it's a requirement.
Thanks for checking,
Pam