The other Tormek wheel

Re: The other Tormek wheel

David Galloway

>I have not had this problem. I am interested in the response. Thanks for posting.

Fine experiment!

David Charlesworth

>Sounds really interesting.

Looking forward to results,

best wishes,

David

Re: The other Tormek wheel

mikew

>Nice job, Bob.

I "trued" mine using a rasp while it was running and took X amount of leather off. Runs fairly well.

In the past, I thought of making an MDF replacement and now just may do it.

Take care, Mike

Re: The other Tormek wheel

John Aniano in NJ...

>Bob,

I had to true up the INNER friction wheel of an older (circa 1984) Tormek I resurrected. It was WAY out of round having sat for nearly 2 decades unused. I mounted the friction wheel on its arbor in the 3-jaw chuck of my lathe (hey, MY 1947 Southbend looks a lot like your Southbend!...). However, since the rubber belt on the friction wheel was so soft and compliant, it would not respond to the usual compound rest-mounted cutting bits, no matter how I changed the cutting angle. The rubber simply moved out of the way without cutting. Thus, I finally used chalk and determined the high spots while it rotated. I then turned off the lathe and used a random-orbital sander with 60 grit paper to take off the high spots. I repeated this "chalk mark/sand off high spot" routine until the friction wheel ran true.

Someday, I'll post the pictures of this rescued Tormek. Oh, and by the way, and sorry for the drive by gloat, I now own (2) Tormeks!

Over and out,

John

What about plastic

Jim in Bulington On

>I don't own a tormek but what about acrylic. Heat it up in the oven and bend it to the wheel glue in place after cooling. Then turn it smooth. You might be able to have some success getting diamond compound to adhere to it. PSA micro abrasive paper might also work out.

Other methods

Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia)

>I do not own a Tormek, but have related experience and observations that may help.

Strops - both motorized and stationary - are an important part of my honing strategies.

A few years ago I described here how I had developed a jig to grind blades on a belt sander. Part of this included using the disk sander as a motorized strop. Using a velcro-backed sanding disk, I created a flat leather surface out of chamois leather (available from auto stores). Simply rub on Veritas green rouge and hold the bevel against the spinning surface. This work extremely well.

I have also used bits of leather glued to hardwood and simply stroked a bevel back across it. The harder the leather the better - soft leather dubs an edge. A piece of MDF works better since it absorbs the rouge but remains flat. Cheap too.

More recently I began experimenting with other forms. A leather wheel (chucked in the drill press), a hard felt wheel on the high speed grinder, a hard/dense leather horsebutt strop from Joel at Tools for Working Wood, and building a leather wheel on a spare lathe.

Of all of these, I like the horsebutt strop the best. The leather is not akin to MDF (i.e. it does have a little give) but it leaves a polished surface that does not easily dub.

I find using the various wheels far less easy and productive than the flat disk. It is easier to dub an edge on a wheel - perhaps this is just my experience as I have only been at it a few months. The method I use is to place the blade against the wheel in the middle of the bevel, then slowly rotate the angle it until the edge touches the wheel. I can see where it leaves a microbevel.

The leather wheel I made came from three layers of 1/2" MDF glued together and sanded to a circle using a disk sander jig. I then glued on an old leather belt (rough side outward). The join was made by cutting one end at 45 degrees, then gluing the other end over this, and sanding both flush. Actually, I preferred this set up to the hard felt wheel. Later I removed the belt, sanded back the glue, and used it as an MDF wheel. This was terrible. Perhaps it was the glue, but I found the wheel extremely hard and this magnified any lack of trueness in the wheel (the blade bounced a lot). For reference, I used the tool holder to aid in presenting the blades.

In summary, the best is the horsebutt strop along with the modified disk sander/motorized leather disk.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: The other Tormek wheel

Bill Lowrance in Geneva

>Naively: Any chance that a hardwood disk would serve, either as-turned-smooth or with some buffing compound on it?

The conclusion

woodburnbob

>Thanks for all the comments, ideas and encouragement.

I spent a little time trying to source an endless belt on the internet without much luck. McMaster-Car had a urethane belt for $0.90 per inch, which would translate to about $25 plus shipping.

I was doing more basement housekeeping this morning and found a leather belt, it'd skived and laced to try out on the SouthBend a couple years ago. So I impulsively sprayed the coarse side of the belt with #77 adhesive, wrapped it on the wheel and pushed a sharp plane blade into the overlap at about 60 degrees to cut the joint. You might be able to see the joint in the photo at about 2 o'clock.

So far I've applied Tormek paste and honed an edge fresh from the grinding wheel. No floating up and down that I can perceive. None. I can feel a little slightly perceptible click as the edge comes to the joint. I don't think this could have turned out better, which is a peculiarly unusual outcome for my little experiments.

Bob, this is an exceptionally fine

Wiley Horne

>thread on solving a real problem. Thank you very much for sharing this thing from the beginning--before you knew the answer!

Wiley

belt strop alternative *LINK*

Dave Thompson

>I recently picked up one of these from LeeValley. They sell a nice leather 1"x42" belt for it. The seem that joins the two ends is pretty smooth.... far smoother than the tormek scarf joint. I haven't charged it up and actually used this one, though have run the belt uncharged just to see the vibrations. It looks promising.

enjoy,

Dave


leather strop

Several words of caution

woodburnbob

>I appreciate your kind words, Wiley. I suspect (hope) your compliment is about format or process of the post, and not necessarily specific content.

Rather than using the title "The conclusion", I should have said "Getting a belt on".

I definitely hope no one does what I've done.

Here's why. Stropping is at least controversial. Take a look at this thread and especially take a trip to the link for Brent's experiments. He clearly shows that stropping an edge that has already been given a 0.5 micron hone degrades the edge substantially...given his process, which is pretty standard.

You'll notice in reading this OldTools thread talk about soft leather and hard leather. The leather I put down was soft leather, and after trying a couple more blades, there's no question I'm dubbing good blades dull by doing what I'm doing now. I'm going to fool around with the jigged and fixed approach angle a bit more, but I don't expect to be gratified. Still, who knows.

I think there a still a few issues I'd like to resolve for myself before I give up and accept Brent's conclusion (who used a maple strop and CrO abrasive) and totally do away with the idea that abrasive stropping on leather might have some value for me.

What keeps me thinking about this is that woodcarvers swear by stropping (with and without abrasive); so do plenty of WC journeymen.

I have a bunch of old barber strops (my dad and grandpa were barbers). They all have thin, very hard, smooth leather. Much harder than even shoe leather. I suspect that one morning I'll tear down what I've done, slice a strop and glue it down. Indeed, I may turn up a new wheel of MDF or even maple, and experiment further.

So to everyone: don't tear off your Tormek wheel and expect anything good to happen on my word. I'm mostly a goof ball and the stuff I do is seldom practical and nearly never works out for very long.

Bob, the good thing about this thread

Wiley Horne

>is that it is about real stuff. A real problem. Followed by attempts to solve said problem with everything except duct tape and chicken wire--how did those get left out? Everybody jumped in with their version of how to put a new tyre on a Tormek. It's great, and still going on....

Now in regard to stropping....Some carvers do strop, and use motorized strops. I take it Chris Pye does not from what he says in his book, but some do. The wheel I'm familiar with is a very firm composite of some kind, has a leathery feel to it, but it's firm to the touch. Comes with a European compound which liquefies at a magic temperature. I don't suppose those carvers using motorized strops are dulling their gouges. An experiment that proved that stropping cannot work, would be like proving that the bumblebee can't fly. It's possible to dub blades, and it's possible not to, and it's possible to create deeper scratches than 0.5micron if the stropping compound abrasive is coarser than 0.5micron.

I'm going on too long here trying to get to one main thing I've learned over the past several years: There is no limit to what an experienced craftsperson can do with simple tools, hand- and eye-based methods, skill, and years of doing it.

So I wouldn't give up on stropping at all. I have a wheel which is about 1 inch wide, and has a 12mm arbor hole through, that I have reamed out to be 1/2". Plus some compound. Would this do you any good?

Wiley

Thanks for the tips

Jim Reed @ Tallahassee

>I have used the right hand side of my Tormek for years and have not gotten around to the left side. Your posts bring up an interesting point about the wheel being out of round. That may be the reason that some users sing praises about the strop wheel and others never use it more than once. The trueness of the wheel may be directly related to its effectiveness.