#3 Stanley Sweetheart Bench Plane

Re: #3 Stanley Sweetheart Bench Plane

Todd O. Cronkhite Maine Native now in Jax Fl.


>Of coarse the Type # would have to be taken into consideration, but even the early types don'y bring all that much $$$ I'd say btween $30-$60 tops would be about it. For $15 you did fairly well. I feel, and it's only my speculation that #3's will eventually be the next #1, as #2's are climbing rapidly in value and are getting harder and harder to find. Right now they are pretty much pushing the $300 mark. #3's are for the moment still relatively affordable, but I bet within the next 10 years they won't be.

Todd O.

Comparative shopping *PICS*

woodburnbob


>ChicagoBob, formerly TennesseeBob, I think you may be family, so I spent a little extra time on my response. But I apologize I didn't, until just now, realize you were asking specifically about Sweetheart era #3s. According to John Walter's book, I guess that era is 1920-1935 encompassing type 12 through 15 and some 16s. I hope someone steps in to correct this.

But your basic question was what can one expect to pay for a #3SW and I negligently offer illustrations of current #3s, SW or not. I do stress I'm not trying to say what I think a #3 is worth today or 10 years from now. I've been waiting years to unload my little cache, but prices seem flat to me.

Here's a nice type 11 on Bob Kaune's site for $179.95

Or, heres a later model on Jon Zimmer's site marked sold at $100.

If you move away from the traditional online dealers and instead look at the Ebay market, there are some pretty dazzling price comparisons, such as this potential diamond in the rough sold with no cleanup and bad photos on ebay for $9.99

Or, this for $10.50

Or, this for $14.50

But the guys on Ebay will bid up some of the #3s, such as this handsome type 9 or so that closed at $88.23

Or this Ebay winner ending at $90.95

Oh, I forgot to mention...

woodburnbob


>I actually have no sense of the value of anything.

As a grade school boy, I paid 25 cents to see movies at the local theatre. At 16, with my first hot rod (a '35 Ford pickup), I bought gas for 33 cents a gallon. Starting college, my wardrobe consisted of jeans (new at $5 a pair) and Arrow pinstripe shirts ($5 each). In state college tuition was $100 a term. In state medical school tuition five years later was $330 a term. So on and so forth.

Now, when I buy a can of olives for $2 or a loaf of bread for $3, I get nauseous and dizzy, and often just put them back. I'm too fat anyway.

Re: #3 Stanley Sweetheart Bench Plane

Todd Hughes


>Don't think you can compare no.1 and no. 2 Stanleys with a no. 3 as the 1 and 2s have always been rare and uncommon while no. 3's are probably one of Stanleys most common planes...and always will be. Next to the no. 4 and maybe no.5s I see more no. 3s then any other size plane....and they are probably pretty close to as common the no. 5.

While I do think that tools are undervauled today and that in the long run they will rise I don't see no. 3's climbing any faster over simular common planes.If you want to "invest" in planes much better I would think to go with nice 5 1/2s, 4 1/2s, 8s as well as any nice Bedrocks.For real tool investments personaly I think early power tools is where it will be at.

Ebay is really what affects the tool market now and while things come and go in price On the whole I don't see any steady rise on average in plane prices. While Todd C. says that no. 2's are pushing $300 can't prove it by me as I just sold a few weeks ago a rather nice older 1900s one on ebay for $200....I think if I had parted it out I could have maybe doubled that...my mistake. When I started on ebay over 7 years ago I sold a very rusted one for $275 and I got as high as $350 for nice ones

...At $15 the no 3 in question was probably priced at around top price of most I see in the wild. Even in the old tool hell I live in I have bought many many for $10 or less too. Occasionaly I might see one priced as high as $25 but in my experance kind of uncommon. With only 80% jappaning I would probably consider this to be a Parts Plane and worth more for parts then a whole plane ....Todd

OT: One of my theories

Bill Houghton, Sebastopol, CA


>is that we reach an economic set point somewhere between 20 and 25 years of age, and compare prices forever to that.

Brand new BMW R50s or VW bugs were $1900 when I was that age (and BMWs were expensive mo'cycles - just think: two fewer cylinders, two fewer seats, and lots less trunk space, but still the same price as a VW), and I find the idea of $10,000 motorcycles that aren't made of gold flat laughable. Same thing with a "cheap" car being $15,000.

Yes, that's my problem: premature calibration

woodburnbob

And the Dow was what, 650-700?

Joe Rogers, Northern Virginia

Re: OT: One of my theories

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX


>Even I gasped at an ad the other day, a BMW off road bike (used to be called GS80) for a mere $16,000. Looks like the boys can afford more expensive toys these days. Or they're just willing to borrow more for fun?

Pam

Low interest rates

Dan Clermont


>Credit man!

Large ticket items like cars and homes have gotten very expensive over the years.

Don't know about where you live but house prices in my area have almost doubled in 7 years. The average house price in the Vancouver area is now around $650K compared to around $350K 7 years ago.

Absolutely nuts and I have no idea how people do it.

If only the same were true for hand tools ;)

Dan Clermont

THANKS!

Chicago Bob


>As always, thanks for your input and many view points. I never buy tools to resale, just to add to my small but growing collection. Rarely do I buy I an "old" tool that I do not intend to restore and attempt to use. It is kind of fun to imagine what type of craftsman may have owned it and how it was used 50 to 75 years ago!

Cheers,

Chicago Bob

Well Pam...

Scott Burr in Ben Lomond, CA


>My former VP in charge of design at... Sorry cannot say it anymore... Designed that bike. I would recommend watching "The road home" an English reality show... A documentary actually. That bike was slammed, twisted, welded by people you would probably never trust and it went around the world. At 18K, it�s not your mom's bike...Neither is mini or a wrx so to speak. Their warmer and just as much fun IMHO.

Re: Well Pam...

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX


>OK, I've only got two BMW's, a '76 R90S and an '84 318i with about 200k miles on it. I love them both. So I don't understand your point. That BMW's last? Yep. That the new GS80 is a stalwart? Yep. But would I pay $16k or more for what most will use as a toy? Nope. Imagine all the newer BMW's that have automatic transmissions! Yuck.

Pam

Uhhh Pam, Uhhh well...

Derek


>I am certainly a guy and I have never owned a bike nor has anyone in my immediate family except my second daughter... in fact she has a really nice (second) bike that her boyfriend's MOTHER gave her when the MOTHER got a new one!!!

Don't you thing that was an awfully sexist remark? :>)

**** Disclaimer: ****

PLEASE NOTE THE " :>) ". I'm ONLY KIDDING (about the sexist thing, not the daughter & bikes)! HONEST!!!

Toys? I don't think so...

Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA


>I would hardly call them toys. These bikes are state of the art. Design Werks in LA is a spectacular design studio; people there know quality design and engineering.

The people I know that own them are hard-core riders and would not think about them as mere toys.

Re: Uhhh Pam, Uhhh well...

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX


>You know, Derek, when I was riding a lot, as in for my main transportation, didn't even own a car (we were living in downtown DC where owning a car was more hassle than convenient), I kept waiting to see more women driving rather than riding. It just didn't happen. I guess I finally gave up.

Around here I see a lot of women on bicycles and scooters, but very, very few on full blown street bikes.

But you're correct, it was a sexist thing to say, even in jest.

Pam

LOL!

Joe Rogers, Northern Virginia

Re: Toys? I don't think so...

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX


>Well, where do these hard core riders go on them? And for what reason? Just because they're taken seriously doesn't mean they aren't toys.

I don't consider my Japanese tools toys, either, but the fact is they are on a certain level.

And BMW is certainly happy that there are those who play on their bikes. The handfull who seriously NEED these things couldn't support their development.

Pam

Just to clarify

Derek


>I should have been more clear and said "motorcycle" instead of "bike" since that is what I was talking about and that was what I read in your post.

Of course I taught all 4 of my kids to ride bicycles (yes, I ran along side them and caught them when they fell over until they got the hang of it) and still ride one of those. In fact, I used to ride one to work for a long time until I was almost killed twice. Then I realized it was stupid to risk my life riding a bicycle during rush-hour (actually it is 3-4 hours long mornig & night) when I had a family to support and raise.

Oh, I was not offended by your comment. I knew you were only joking.

No need, we're in synch.

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

Re: #3 Stanley Sweetheart Bench Plane

Slav Jelesijevich


>Hey Bob welcome to Chicago, we have a tool club called CATS, Chicago Aritzens and Trades Society. We meet at my shop by the united center every 2nd wednesday of the month at 7pm.

Slav

I dunno

James Watriss


>There are a LOT of #3s out there. I have 2 old sweethearts myself. There are a lot of em out there, and for good reason... they're a good, manageable size. 2 is a wee bit small and 1 is impractical for anything but a paperweight, since block planes are about the same size. 3 is a good all around smoother, a lot of people use them, and if I'm not mistaken, they were in wider production, for a lot longer, and for just that reason.

For $15, I can't see it being a serious collectible. On the other hand, it's a reassuring number for a novice/intermediate woodworker. As a student at North Bennet Street, and a tool salesman at a local Woodworking tool store, I tell a lot of people who can't afford Lie-Nielsen the same thing. $20-30 on ebay will buy you a decent old sweetheart 3 or 4. $20 for the first charlesworth book, which has the plane tuning article in it. A few hours of tweaking, tuning, and sharpening, and IMHO, the old sweethearts are almost as good as a L-N.

The machining on those old ones was really nice, the parts fit each other very well. I have an old sweetheart #4 that got a replacement A2 blade, and even using both planes on a regular basis, I honestly can't tell much difference, performance wise, from a L-N #4. The L-N feels a little bit different, since it's bronze, and has a 50 degree frog, but they work equally well.

The old sweetheart 3's are some of my favorite planes. Hands down.

Re: I dunno

David Churnega


>I like them all but if I had my druthers it would be the WWII era Stanleys that are my favorite. The heavy castings make these guys considerably heavier or much more like the pricier ones out there now.