Refurbish Planes?

Re: Refurbish Planes?

Steve Mackay

>Cant speak for others but when they come out of the dumpster they ain't pretty. From what I've learned right here keeping them " original " does'nt do much of anything for the value. Hey, if it feels good . . . . !

Re: Refurbish Planes?

Jack Guzman from Maine

>If you're planning on collecting or reselling antiques this is an issue.If you plan on using the tools just use sense when refurbishing.(don't clean off rust with a disc sander)My opinion---Jack

Re: Refurbish Planes?

Jim in Burlington On

>I never run across any planes that are in doubt. But if I did posting pics here would sort it out quick. Looking thru e-bay can be misleading and confusing.

Depends

Bill Houghton, cold and rainy in Sebastopol, CA

>If you're asking the "collector" question, the answer is you should learn lots more about planes to decide whether something is the VERY rare true collector's item. I suspect that, in most parts of the country and probably of the world, you might run across a true collector's item about once in your lifetime, if you spend every weekend trolling for planes to buy.

If you're asking when to spend time refurbishing vs. when to just use it, my answer is that for using, unless the plane is truly a bad one, cleaning it up, waxing the operating surfaces, and sharpening the iron (blade) is most of getting most planes working again for most woods.

But it does depend - if you're intent on planing exotic, gnarly woods, or you really want to learn to plane a surface in which you can see to comb your hair, you'll need to have a plane that's tuned to a truly high pitch. For softwoods or standard North American hardwoods (oak, birch, walnut, etc.), you don't need a Ferrari.

But sharpness - sharpness isn't all, but it's most.

Refurbish ?

Todd Hughes

>What do you mean by "refurbish"?

....I have seen lots of planes whose owners idea of "refurbish" seemed to be to clean the plane on a big wire wheel and spray paint it black...or Red or Green. Maybe not what you [or me] are thinking about when it comes to refurbishing a plane but I am sure the fellow that did it was proud of his work and thought he was doing fine. How about the fellow that wants his plane to be "Better then New"? and buffs it bright and paints it with some shiny black automotive paint that is "better" then jappaning. Is there that much difference between these two refurbishers....nope I don't think so, in both cases you end with a plane that looks like it never did originaly.

.....I think it is really a rare plane that even needs a refurbishing, remember we are just basicaly talking about cosmetics now. Your no. 5 with 40% jappaning will perform the same as one that has 100% finish. With this it is pretty funny because it is almost an exclusive User thing to be so worried about what thier tools look like that they go to the trouble to "refurbish" them. You would think because they are users they would just worry about how the tool performs rather then the % of it's finish, eh? Personaly I couldn't ever see me refurbishing any tool I own just so it would look better....hey who would I be fooling but myself.

...but in the end they are your tools to do with as you want in in the grand scheme of things probably doesn't make of a difference if you paint your planes or not. Just will cause the next owner to thank you or will cause them to say " What the f*** was that idiot thinking" when they pick your plane up......Todd

Re: Refurbish ?

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>I don't know, Todd, I get no joy from picking up a bundle of rust, whether it's on the sole or not. Maybe it's only for looks, avoiding that "yuck" factor, but that's certainly important to a user. And avoiding getting all that rust all over the wood, to say nothing of my hands, is certainly of value to this user.

Pam

Re: Refurbish ?

Todd Hughes

>I think there is a difference between cleaning a tool so that it is clean but still beliavable looking and what many people do to "refurbish" a plane when they buff, paint, redo etc. I clean up lots of tools and I think that proper cleaning does nothing but add to most tools desirabilty and vaule. I know I wouldn't want a dirty rusty tool over one that has been properly cleaned...I don't think this is what this is about though....Todd

OK OK Here's my thought

jeff

>I didn't mean to start a war.

I hate broken, rusty tools.

When I was in the radio repair business, when we refurbished a radio, it looked good and worked right.

I have a number of top quality Lie-Nielson planes that all I do is sharpen the blades to work well.

I have a bunch of Veritas that I sharpen and sometimes lap the bottom.

I have a bunch of Stanley planes that I've kept up with good lappings, sharpenings and a bit of tuning.

I have a bunch of old Stanley and Record planes, some very rusty and chipped and worn.

My thoughts are to clean the rust off and lap the sides and bottoms flat and true. The inner parts (screws, bolts, metal knobs, etc) will be cleaned (wire wheeled where necessary) de-rusted and lubed.

The handles (totes) and knobs will be fixed and buffed up where necessary.

I like my blades sharp, so they'll be cleaned and lapped.

Now the trouble begins.

Some of the planes are valuable (Like the 45's and such). Will they be less valuable after my clean-up to make them good users.

If so, should I just lap the soles and blades to use, and keep them rusty and dirty. Some people think the old petina makes them more valuable.

I can make an old Stanley shine as good a new (maybe better) but that's not what I do.

Ok, now the thoughts may begin

Jeff

Resale

Jim Reed @ Tallahassee

>If the plane is a true collector's item it should be in great condition and not need refurbishing. Almost any plane with a significant amount of rust is not a true $$$ collector's gem, so the amount of refurb should not matter. I personally like gently cleaned planes to use, but I have found that the repainted shiny ones bring better prices on ebay.

Re: Rust

Moses Yoder in White Pigeon, MI

>I think rust should be removed from user tools, and as much as possible done to prevent tools from rusting; it is just a craftsmanlike thing to do, take care of your tools. The extent to which a person removes rust is of course a personal decision. Beyond rust removal, I think handles should be smooth and comfortable on user tools. Beyond those two things and a sharp iron I think is mostly wasted time. I occasionally enjoy wasting some time, and have taken a $1 plane and done the whole shebang on it, and it still does not look new but looks pretty good in the case. After spending about 8 hours on it, is probably worth about $15 now.

Any plane that is not a collector plane is a user plane. Anything beyond minor rust and dirt removal on a collectable plane I think should be avoided. But there are no laws governing what a person can do with a tool, so long as it is not being used as a weapon. I like my tools to look used and well cared for.

Re: 45

Moses Yoder in White Pigeon, MI

>The number 45 is a very common plane and not worth much. A #85, #87, #9, or #43 and such are valuable and collectable planes. To refurbish a #45 and put some time into it and expect to make money on I think might be a mistake. You could try one and see what happens; sell a rusty as is version and a cleaned up and spit polished version and keep track of your time and see which one you make the most with your time. I have often thought you could make reasonably good money just buying things that are not well presented on the bay and resell them with a decent presentation and information about the tool.

Go ahead

Ron in Kokomo

>The tool is yours. In the rather unlikely event that you come upon a piece of our nation's cultural patrimony... you probably should consult an expert. I mean a real one... not just a bunch of guys who stayed at the Holiday Inn Express last night. I have come upon five or six tools like that in 20 years of pretty vigorous looking. There is ample resource info out here that will let you know if you have found a rare and valuable tool.

Most tools that we encounter have thousands like them somewhere in the US. So, you do no damage at all if you buff to shiny brilliance if that is your thing.

Re: OK OK Here's my thought

Todd Hughes

>I think Any Tool's vaule is increased if it is properly cleaned. I've been to many tool shows and auctions and have seen more then a few rare and vaualble planes at them and you know what? ...Don't think I have ever seen a dirty rusty one! Is there something about rare patented planes or Older Stanley no. 1's that they never got rusty or dirty? Don't think so...yup they have been cleaned. Of course there is a big different between a properly cleaned plane and one that has been shined up to "better then new". It is planes done like this that has given cleaning planes up a bad name.

A properly cleaned tool will out sell a dirty rusty uncleaned tool everytime. Actually if you sell tools you are asking for trouble to sell tools in rough as is condition because is hard to see damage etc.

...I think there is a limited market for what I call "Fantasy" restored tools...these are planes that are buffed and polished and painted with engine enamel etc. Sure some newbie guys might like something like that but most buyers with some tool experance avoid them. I would think the time and trouble taken to do them with most would make more sence to not go to the trouble. Now there is a catagory of true restored planes, ones like a busted no.1 that is welded and re jappaned etc. and done right. Most of these probaly get sold as not having work done to them and so do well ...Todd