Roubo bench

Re: Roubo bench

Joe Rogers, Northern Virginia

>The leg vise will angle in use if the pivot isn't adjustable to maintain parallelism (wish I had spell check here).The multi hole board allows the bottom of the vise to approximate the thickness of the workpiece.JR

To approach it another way, *LINK*

Bill Houghton, Sebastopol, CA

>the leg vise is a third-class lever, in which the effort (the vise screw) is between the fulcrum (the board with the holes in it) and the resistance (what you're clamping) - see discussion at the link. The holes allow you to set the fulcrum to optimize the fit of the jaws to the thing clamped.

You also avoid having the screw cocked so far off 90 degrees to the jaw that it binds in the hole (though you do need some slop in the leg vise hole for the screw, as objects don't come in just the thicknesses that the holes seem to allow).


All the way from Britain, about levers

Re: To approach it another way,

VTAndy

>Thanks -- nice link!

So, you remove the peg, and the pegboard moves through a slot at the bottom of the leg. When the vise is parallel to the leg with the clamped object in it (not too tight), then you put the peg in, and tighten the vise; the vise remains parallel rather than losing its grip on the top of the clamped object and overtightening on the bottom of it.

Is that correct?

Re: To approach it another way,

Scott in Douglassville, PA

>That's pretty much it. The trick's in (a) getting the holes spaced adequately without weakening the beam but allowing the most versatility, and (b) getting the beam fit so that it slides easily in the mortise without binding too much.

Re: To approach it another way,

Paul Erickson

>Lovely piece of work. Would you mind commenting on the reasons you extended the vise above the bench top? I am in the process of trying to design a bench where size constrains are intense, and would appreciate hearing your thoughs on what the extension allows you to do that you might not be able to do with one where the top of the vise is flush with the bench top.

cheers, Paul

Yes. You get it!

Joe Rogers, Northern Virginia

>

I'm not Scott...Wait a minute...

Scott Burr windy and raining in Ben Lomond,CA

>I am Scott. The reasoning behind Scott's leg vise is to hold chair seats for the most part. What your looking at there is a chairmakers bench.

Re: Roubo bench *LINK*

mikew

>I don't know if you read Chris' blog, but the link should go to his entry on the Roubo-style bench after had the benefit of using it.

Perhaps Chris can chime in here as well...

Take care, Mike


Roubo Revisited

Bench materials

Adam Cherubini, NJ

>You probably can't buy POPLAR in VT Mr. Shop teacher! Just exactly what you teaching those kids anyway? The TULIP you buy will probably move way too much and too often for a workbench. I think you should try to find oak if you can. Maple or beech would be preferable. I saw a lot of standing beech on my last trip to New England. What, do "you people" burn it up there or something? Beech should be hoarded, not burned.

Before switch from SYP to some other softwood, I'd check the movment calculator. Hem Fir might be okay if you can get it. When you are starting out, its always best to have something you can trust. You simply can't trust tulip.

Adam

Those doggone homesick brits misnamed all sorts of things over here. Like Robins, and Poplars- it makes everything so confusing. Too bad we can't blame the British for "Indians"!

Re: Roubo bench

Adam Cherubini, NJ

>One thing I noticed was that Chris' stop was pretty far in from the front edge of the bench (last picture). That may have been the way Roubo had it, but it causes at least one of the problems mentioned. I think the stop should be not much more than 1" in from the front. Also, you don't need an end stop wonder anything when plowing or molding. Just clamp the right rear corner down with a holdfast. I advise restraint in adding additional features. You can do everything you need to on that bench. I would start there, then add fancy stuff later. (you won't because you won't need too)

A practical alternative to the French bench is the English Nicholson bench. I wouldn't hesistate to make a Nicholson bench out of 2x12's from your local home center. Just be sure to spring the joints. Nicholson's bench isn't quite as nice as Roubo's. You can't clamp to it which is a major pain. Otherwise, its nice because its light and easy to build.

Adam

Re: Bench materials

mikew

>My only reservation regarding materials such as Fir, Larch or Hemlock would be the splintery nature.

Myself, I would use Ash first. Fairly resilient. Takes a good bashing. But I would prefer Beech if I could get it as easy.

Maple I don't like because it can be so darn slick.

Take care, Mike

Re: Bench materials

VTAndy

>Hi Adam,

Thanks for your response.

Just for clarification, I am not the woodworking/practical arts teacher -- I teach humanities and German! -- and my friend, who is the woodworking teacher, is actually not American, so of course it makes sense that what he called poplar is what is listed by our VT wood suppliers as "tulip poplar," or "yellow poplar" and it was my mistake not to write it that way.

His projects during his 3 years with the kids here in VT exclusively involve cherry, walnut, and maple, so I assume that he never bought or even looked at "poplar" in the U.S. to know that it isn't what he calls poplar.

We will probably also be able to get oak, however, even though I have zero aesthetic expectations for the workbench, I can't stand oak. I also considered birch. I would like to ask, are you certain that the movement of tulip would matter that much, given Chris' design was executed using wet SYP, and the design seemed to account for movement?

Regarding burning beech, I don't know about that because I don't burn wood. I do know that a movement is underway to encourage architects to re-think the types of wood and the "grading" of wood typically being used as flooring, using mixed hardwoods of the approximate percentages in which they are found in the forests here, and in "lower" grades than what is usually "acceptable" for flooring. The equation includes beech, IIRC.

Well, back to thinking about the bench. Perhaps I'll go with purpleheart.

-Andy

P.S. I've been home with a cold, and while recovering, have been reading the archives of this forum. Found the posts about your challenge a couple years back. Is there a website with pics of the participants' work, or writings about their experiences? What a cool idea.

BTW just kidding

VTAndy

>

Sure you're Scott...

Scott in Douglassville, PA

>Like that other Scott says, it's mainly a chairmaking bench, and the proud leg vise helps allow access without bumping the top for some operations (drawknifing spindle blanks) and, since the top's at something like 34", it raises clamped seat blanks to a perfect height for adzing.

Greg Betit has his set up the same way, and has much more experience doing traditional operations (planing, sawing, etc) with it. Maybe he'll chime in here.

What's wrong with POPLAR?

Denis Ch�nard, Orl�ans, Ont.

>Be it tulip ("yellow poplar"), or real poplar?

I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I believe that maple, oak, and especially beech move a lot more than poplar, real or fake.

Just think at how much beech planes shrink during the winter. I have an antique one that the blade gets jammed solid in it during the winter, yet is loose in the summer...

DC

Poplar is OK - Challenge site *LINK*

Alan Bierbaum, near Denver, CO

>Yellow poplar has less shrinkage than does sugar maple (on of the "traditional" bench top materials). It is very soft in comparison though. I used poplar for the base of my bench; did not even consider it for the top. I would use Ash, Maple, Oak, Beech, Cherry or Walnut before using poplar for a bench top. Poplar is just as stable as any of the above, though.

The following link is to my web site for Adam's challenge project. You can search the archives (menu at left) for additional information.

Alan


Challenge web pages

Re: Poplar is OK - Challenge site

VTAndy

>Hi Alan,

Thanks for the link -- neat!

I did search the archives. However, it is tedious, since whenever I would pull up one relevant post, it would not allow me to select other messages from the "tree" at the bottom. I did read the messages pertaining to the beginning of the challenge. However, I didn't have the wearwithall to find the follow-ups, which I suppose must have been scattered over the next year or so.

Andy

Hey Homey check your email ASAP, please...

Scott Burr windy and raining in Ben Lomond,CA

>

Can too!

Greg Betit, Vergennes, VT.

>Last year I got a nice 2" X 20" X 17' plank of tulip poplar from Johnson's in Bristol VT. I wanted to try something different than pine- and the poplar was cheaper, even though it doesn't grow up this way.

Greg

Re: Can too!

VTAndy

>Hey Greg,

I'm actually headed to Bristol to get the wood, but to the other place, not Johnson's. Can't remember the name.

-Andy

Re: To approach it another way,

Greg Betit, Vergennes, VT.

>My leg vise came with my bench, a 19th century undertaker/coffin/cabinet maker's bench. If it didn't show up intact on the bench I would have never thought that having a leg vise proud on the bench was a good idea. For 20 years I have found it useful for-

Cross cutting boards- on both sides of the vise! (because it's up above the bench.)

Edge joining boards- along with the accompanying sliding X board jack.

Dovetailing - holds the piece just the right height (bench height seems too low for my helicopter pilot's back)

Mortising - you can pound, and the vise holds it steady.

Carving - again, it's at a great height

As a chair maker I've found it very useful for reefing down stubborn rivings to shaving horse sized pieces. I also like the way it holds the seat blanks vertically while I'm having at it with adze and scorp.

I have another bench with a patternmaker's vise, and it doesn't get nearly as much use.

Greg

Indeed, like Roubo

Christopher Schwarz

>I positioned the stop just like it was shown in Roubo's plate -- for better or for worse.

On the downside, I wish I had the extra bit of length when sticking long stock. On the upside of its location, I put planes and tools there that are in "the ready." I wouldn't want to give that feature up, actually. I'd sooner add a foot to the length of the bench first.

(By the way, we're going to build a Nicholson bench this year -- it's so material efficient it's a no-brainer. Look for it.)

Chris

Confused by plane stop placement comments

Wendell @ Murphy, TX

>Adam's comment :

"I think the stop should be not much more than 1" in from the front."

Adam seems to be talking about the position relative to the front on the bench i.e. the edge where the crochet is attached. Chris talks about wishing for more length. To me, this implies that the stop was placed too far from the end of the bench. Which one is it?

Wendell

Re: Confused by plane stop placement comments

Christopher Schwarz

>Wendell,

I'm talking about the planing stop, not the crochet. My stop is about a foot from the far end of the benchtop -- hence I wish my bench were 12" longer.

The crochet is at the very far end of the bench. I like where it is -- except I wish it were about 1" lower.

I hope this clears it up -- or at least doesn't make it worse!

Chris