grinding a camber, anyone?

No camber

Andrew F in Australia

>Hi Dano/All

Good to see you here, Dano.

We are trained (trade cabinetmaker)to grind all blades flat and relieve the corners of a smoother only - to clean up a board with an edge in wind, I just use the plane so the corner of the blade is running down the centreline of the edge - that way, you can physically only cut the 'high' half off the edge.

When the edge appears out of wind, set the blade to take a reasonable shaving, take a full-width shaving off the edge to knock off the plane ridges, and the job is finished - on to the next one.

I've got a few old scrub planes and they're the only ones that I put a camber onto the blade of.

Cheers,

Andrew

Another long thread frank

Kevin French, Antrim NH

>I thought you were working on a Bow Saw?

Re: gotcha

ThomD

>What is the correct sequence? Or what is the correct term?

Any time I don't contradict myself at least once in a post I put it down to an oversight.

Re: grinding a camber, anyone?

Marc in Luxembourg

>TomD,

I know my english is at its worse, BUT PLEASE try the method Alice , sorry Alf, explained. It has one decisive advantage: You always keep the habit to align your plane parallel to the board, i.e. square to the bench. You have another method possible: You play with the lateral iron plane lever thing... Sorry, my mother got 65 this evening and the italian red wine (sicilian of 1999) was a little too much ... so the iron edge protude at one corner.

Once you tried, you will see, it's very easy and pleasurable.

Marc

Try/Jointer

Dean J in MN

>Warren --

The method you use- putting the boards face to face and planing together does avoid problems of wind etc., but you must plane each board's face flat first and then plane the whole again after glue up. That's three times trying the face. This takes more time and I doubt it is a historical method

I just count two times trying the face when I match plane. :) And actually only one most times. Post glue up can just be a smoother pass. Which I assume you do after you try the panel, so no extra work there. A lot depends on the final use of that glued up panel.

As for taking more time, I assert it is faster to try a face, slap the boards together and let the jointer plane make the joint, even if I have to touch up the panel after glueup. At least it is for me, I've done joints both ways; with a long try plane adjusting the edge and match planing with a jointer, it always took me far longer when I had to get the edges to match up as seperate boards. I'm always looking for ways to allow the tool to require less skill from me, and match planing lets me work faster, and with less skill. I just push the jointer, I don't have to move the apex of the camber over to the ever wandering high edge of the board, check the edge, repeat until square, for each board. I do use a try plane if I need a square edge somewhere, but in my work that turns out to be less often than I thought, and often close is fine. So, I think a long plane with a cambered blade is a must -- I just call it a try plane, not a jointer.

Having said that, I don't think match planing is the only way to make a edge to edge joint. If your method works for you, I see no reason to change.

Cheers!

-Dean

will do, my friend!

frank shic (walnut ck, ca)

>

you're not going to believe this...

frank shic (walnut ck, ca)

>a very KIND, manny hernandez, saw my postings a while ago and decided to help me out of my misery... by selling me a virtually BRAND NEW one that i told myself i'll use mainly as a pattern for another one in the near future :) he also sold me an EXCELLENT ulmia frame saw with a japanese blade as well as the original rip blade!

thanks again manny!!!

Re: grinding a camber, anyone?

paul womack

>As I recollect the discussion, Mr. Charlesworth explained that one pass is done on each side with the plane offset from the center. The resultant "hump" in the center of the edge is easily seen for the final stroke down the center. Thereby leaving, a flat edge, as I believe someone pointed out here.

Hmm. If that's what he said, he's certainly moved on. His recent articles on edge preparation simply cover (with his ususal thoroughness) the "classic" take-a-tapered shaving approach.

As seen in many old books, and on the web

Charlesworth did introduce a new (AFAIK) idea in measurement/marking for this process, which some will find fussy and intrusive, and some helpful.

BugBear

Re: thanks ALF

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>Finally, a voice of reason in this discussion! I agree completely. Match planing, with zero camber, is the most foolproof method to joint two boards, with no gaps and no visible glue line. (It's also a good excuse to go get a #8, or equivalent woodie.) There's absolutely no worry about getting both edges precisely perpendicular to the faces, as long as you can get one final, full width, full length shaving. There's not even any worry about accidentally getting some twist in the edges (if you're cross-eyed or have a gimp leg), because any twist just cancels out. Such a joint even works with aliphatic resin glues, whose high clamping pressure will not tolerate the mating of two excessivelyconcave edges (which might easily result from an overly exuberent cambering). Making a spring joint is also easy. You just count strokes, and then take the final pass. If your wood is overly unstable in relation to the length of your jointer, just skew the plane a bit on the final pass to effectively shorten it.

Y'all can tell when you've gotten that final full width, full length shaving, don't you? (Rhetorical question)

Sure, wood's flexible, and one can compensate for a less than perfect panel by making the table's aprons or the panel's frame thicker and more robust, and use a few more screws, and just force it to be flat. I'd much rather have a piece designed and built by Sheraton or Hepplewhite than one by Stickley or a Shaker brother, despite the latters' professions of honest construction.

Re: thanks ALF

Alice Frampton, UK

>Now this has always bothered me, and now seems like a good time to ask. 'Tis a genuine inquiry, not trying to prove a point or anything. I was jointing up some nominal 2" thick beech the other day and I don't believe many folks have planes with a 4" wide iron to match plane such thickness. I just carried on as usual and jointed each edge individually, but I'm curious what you do if you rely on match planing all your jointed edges and find yourself in a similar situation? Treat both edges together like a board face?

Cheers, Alf

Re: thanks ALF

Marc in Luxembourg

>First I joint each edge separately coarsely in order to have both edges on the same "level". Then I clamp them together with a third smaller board. I make overlapping passes going from left to right. After that I pick up a bevel up smoother (rounded edges on iron)and make diagonal passes twice in different directions. The way I'd do with a scrub plane. The smaller board avoids breakout on the second edge. After that I return to the jointer and take a few passes.

Could I put the question, related to this one, how you joint long edges. Last month or so I had to joint three 10 feet boards and first I was a little bothered by the fact, that I couldn't do that quite exact enough. I always had a gap of 1 mm or more. I resolved the problem, but on a complicated manner and I'd be glad to read how you do.

Marc

Re: thanks ALF

Alice Frampton, UK

>Marc, thanks for that. Think I'll stick to my cambering ;~)

How do I joint 10ft boards? Answer is I don't. So far I haven't had any call to joint long boards, and all being well I won't have to in the future. My workshop's optimised for working boards 6ft and less really, and even then I'm struggling a bit for clamping space. Sorry, not a helpful answer, but the only one I'm qualified to give :~) What did you end up doing?

Cheers, Alf

Re: thanks ALF

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>I'm afraid I don't have an answer for you, Alf. I don't often glue up panels from stock that thick. The method you suggest makes sense. I think the method you suggest makes sense. If I were to do it, instead of a cambered blade, I think I would use a jointer blade prepared the same way as I prepare a smoother blade, not with a very large radius camber, but as flat as I can make it, and then just the corners eased. Note that with care, tracks wouldn't show, unless you accidentally crossed the edge of the joint with the corner of the blade.

I know you are not being argumentative. Hopefully no one who reads this exchange will make the mistake of dismissing match planing just because they can't use it in all real or imagined edge jointing cases.

Re: thanks ALF

Alice Frampton, UK

>Just in case there's a danger of anyone thinking it was an imagined rather than real situation, this instance wasn't for a panel, no, but rather a small workbench top. Judging by posts on this forum alone, not an entirely unknown activity :~)

Cheers, Alf

Re: thanks ALF

Marc in Luxembourg

>Alice,

I clamped the board with to al. battens 5 mm below the final "level" of the board. I fitted a cheap woodie with two small battens, so as someone told me, I'd be planing on rails.

The joint didn't allow any inexactitude, it was a mitered rabbet j. So that's why I put in all that energy.

Marc,

PS: Sorry, that you had to wait for an answer, didn't see your post

Ingenious solution; thanks, Marc

Alice Frampton, UK

>

Hey Marc...

Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA

>Insteresting use of a 95 as a chamfer plane. Great idea, if I'm seeing it correctly.

Re:

Marc in Luxembourg

>Nope Scott, I used it as a fenced mitering plane on a mitered rabbet joint. (If you could name it like this) So it planed a 45� bevel on the rabbets edge. On this pic you see better, how the fence functions, and the joint.

Marc, in frozen Luxembourg waiting for the #8 and the hot dog

Cool...

Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA

>Nifty idea none the less. A LN 8 and a hotdog eh? YOU SUCK MARC!

That No.8 will get your blood moving and warm you up really fast;^)