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tapping out

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tapping out

#1

tapping out

Tom Sontag - St. Louis

>I actually remembered a thread by this title from the old BP days, but my BP Archives disk did not answer the very question I have. I do not own any special hammers or even much of an anvil (I have a piece of RR track though). I understand the task of dealing with the hollow in the back of my japanese chisel as I regrind it shorter: tap the hollow out with a hammer on an anvil. But tapping is not working. I have no blacksmithing experience. If I need to hit it a lot harder, then maybe it should be called "whacking out" or "pounding very hard out". Frankly it seems a little weird hitting this steel chisel near the bevel with a steel hammer (I used a ball pein). Is it going to break if I really lay into it? What is the secret to tapping out? If I need to chant some gibberish and turn around three times or something, well, let me know.

Re: tapping out

#2

Re: tapping out

Thomas Skaggs, Foothills of Mount Level

>Hi Tom,

Hey, if those are good quality chisels have you considered sending them off to be done professionally? Murphy's law in my shop would cause me to botch the job of course. ;-)

Good luck.

Tommy

Re: tapping out

#3

no

Tom Sontag - St. Louis

>If I let Murphy's Law in my shop dictate what I tackle myself, I'd only, um, let's see, what WOULD I get to do?

Besides, this is only using a hammer and there is no nail to bend, so it might fall within my the narrow orbit of my "talent".

Re: tapping out

#4

Re: tapping out *LINK*

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>It is possible to wreck an edge, say if the blade splits, so I don't think you want to whack. Also, no gibberish required.

I've only done this once, and on a new plane blade of all things. There was a tiny depression close to the edge on the side. My alternative was to grind it for a few hours, so I chose tapping; however, I had two experts helping - Harrelson and Inamoto-san. Harrelson was amazed when Inamoto-san suggested it. Not sure what that says. The tapping in this case was from bevel to back, which wasn't hard at all, then some sharpening to line things up.

It may be that your ball pein is simply not the right tool. The hammer they used has a pointy pein, and they discussed using a cross-pein instead. There was an anvil.

I strongly suggest you go to the Hiraide forum at the link below and ask your question, probably in the Tool Sharpening section. Don't worry about logging in, go as guest, the log in functions were broken. Pay a lot of attention to whatever Dave Burnard has to say.

Pam


Hiraide forum

Re: tapping out

#5

Don't tap out a chisel, except....

Wiley Horne--Glendora, CA

>Tom,

The hollow on a chisel is not as deep as on a plane blade. Whenever you sharpen the chisel, give the back a set also, using your finest stone, or last two stones according to need. This practice will maintain the flat, and in normal operation you'll never need to tap out a chisel. EXCEPT in one situation: Where you have a chip out of the edge, and have to grind the blade well back into the hollow to clear the chip. In that case, consult Hiraide as Pam said. But if no chip, don't tap, just work the back.

Wiley

Re: tapping out

#6

Re: not for chisels

ThomD

>As a general principle, one doesn't tap out chisels. Just plane/wide blades. Odate says this about taping out chisels "Unless chisels are over 2" wide their flats are not usualy taped out". For one thing, consider that a 3/8" chisel can have the same profile as a plane blade almost 3" wide. What is the chance of deflecting the 8 x narrower chisel. Think also of multi hollow backs.

As Pam's experience points out, any time one thinks it will work I suppose one can give it a wack and see what happens. Be aware of the shape of the hardened metal in your blade it has deep section, and narrow sections. Taping out depends on deflecting both the iron and the hardened steel. So wack away, but be aware of what you are trying to deflect if it is an area with a deep rib (say the sides of some chisels where they are wrapped up) you are asking for nothing to happen, or a crack.

I have tapped out plane blades and It takes some force, certainly nothing like sinking a 16d, but one is deflecting metal, the wacking leaves marks on the blade. You don't need a anvil, but you do need a means of supporting the blade just a little behind where you are hitting. Odate is pictured using the beveled edge of a post, I have the "proper" anvil which is in fact made out of railway track, or was made in that shape. One end has a bevel on it so that one can hold the blade on it at an appropriate clearance angle.

You only get experience of this stuff by doing it. Unless you can't hit a mark with a hammer I don't see the harm in trying. Do not hit the hard steel, hit about midway on the bevel. The blade may crack, but that can happen even to experienced people. The impact position is with the near edge of your hammer hitting the middle of the bevel, leaves little smile marks.

Re: tapping out

#7

Wiley's got it...

Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA

>When sharpening Japanese chislels you need to do the back of the blade as well as the bevel. I do this and have never needed to tap one out, nor would I want to for that matter. The Japan woodworker can tap them out for you also.

Re: tapping out

#8

Re: Wiley's got it...

ThomD

>"The Japan woodworker can tap them out for you also."

They can sharpen them too, maybe they know someone who could just do the woodwork while we wait.

Re: tapping out

#10

Re: What can I say

ThomD

>I'm not sure what that " ;^)" means, but if it means unecesarily snide, I would have to agree. Sorry.

I guess I'm thinking back to all those store jobs I did in my youth where the guy stretching out the hiking boots or installing your ski bindings was, well me, 25 years ago. I do not defer to that guy any more. Now if a person just prefers to pay for something to be done, time management or whatever, not my business.

Re: tapping out

#11

Hey Thom...

Scott Burr in Ben Lomond CA

>Sorry if I offended you. It's a smile agreeing with you. I had no intension of it be a snide remark.

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