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Gaming Table Advice Requested

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Gaming Table Advice Requested

#1

Gaming Table Advice Requested

Greg B�tit, Vergennes, VT.

>I�ve been working on two gaming tables (roughly modeled on one that Napoleon used while in exile on the Isle of St. Helena) for going on two years now. I have the top, legs and apron made and the joints dry fit. I haven�t made the drawer runners, the drawers or the gaming surfaces.

Below the table top is a shallow well that has a backgammon surface. I have purchased pre-made veneer backgammon surfaces for this feature. I�ve never done any veneering. I�ve got a series of questions that I would like for you folks to express your opinions upon:

Is pine a good substrate for this surface? Would you care to guess what the substrate for the original would have been? How thick (minimum)? I know the best may be plywood, and although I am not wholly inflexible, I would like to stay true to the original.

I�ve never used hide glue, but (due to the recent forum thread and the fact that this is probably what was used on the original) I would like to use hide glue both for the veneer and the assembly itself. I think I will be moving at least the veneering operation into the kitchen (That might be a domestic issue!). Should a rank first time veneering novice attempt this, or is a practice session essential? Is there any advice on the approach/method of work you might want to offer?

Any other comments or advice on this project would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Greg


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Re: Gaming Table Advice Requested

#2

Re: Gaming Table Advice Requested

Tony - Memphis

>Can't help you with an answer, but you might try the SAPFM web site forum. I do most all of my veneering with Unibond 800. Nowhere near historically correct! There was a short video on the web by Phil Lowe showing hammer veneering. It was associated with the Seymour exhibit at the museum in Salem. Its probably still out there. It was short, but worth a look. (If I find it, i'll post the url) I'd be afraid to use pine as a substrate, but I have no idea what would be proper. Let us know what you find out. Nice project. Hope you post a picture when you are done.

Tony

Re: Gaming Table Advice Requested

#3

here it is...

Tony - Memphis

>http://www.pem.org/luxury/furniture.html

Re: Gaming Table Advice Requested

#4

Re: Gaming Table Advice Requested

Wiley Horne--Glendora, CA

>Hi Greg,

First off, that is a beautiful project to have undertaken. I hope you will provide lots of photos showing the construction and ornamentation on it. I also agree with Tony that you will want to check with the folks at SAPFM on specific hide glue procedures and the choice of secondary wood. They may even know what the French practice might have been.

I'm a beginner myself at hide glue, but will share my early thoughts, based on experience so far:

Thought #1--It's Real Different: Hide glue is not just a little different from what you've been doing so far--it's about exactly the opposite. There is a different logic for glue-up using hide glue, and there is a different rhythm to how you go about it.

Thought #2--Practice: It's not so much a trial run on your particular project glue-up that you need; it's getting familiar and comfortable with using hide glue, considering that it's so different. IME, what you want to do is just put a pot of hot glue in your shop right now, and have it there, and as opportunities present themselves, use it. That's the only way to get a feel for it. I mean, part of getting used to hide glue is remembering to add water from time to time, and unplug it at night, etc etc.

Thought #3--Speed vs. Precision. With yellow glue or polyurethane (which I really hate), I'm thinking about how to make a neat job of it, in order to minimize clean up and squeeze out in hard-to-get-at places, like in drawer corners. But with hide glue, I'm thinking speed. It'll clean up easily, and very completely, so there's no worry if there's lots of squeeze out. It gets to a jelly-like consistency, and scrapes off. In fact, on small ornamental glue-ups--like husk-and-drop bellflowers, or banding--just plunge the whole piece into the soup and bring it out dripping and install it. And it cleans up without leaving a light unfinishable place on the work--so prefinishing becomes optional, not essential.

Thought #4--Pacing the Work: Think about a drawer. With yellow glue, in most cases my plan will be to glue up the whole drawer in one pass, i.e., the clamps go on when all four joints are together. So there's planning as to how the clamps will go, then get the joints together, then clamp, then go find something else to do for an hour. But with hide glue, it's more of a "rolling glue up". Go one joint at a time, but keep working. For a small drawer like on the gaming table, I might just stick the whole pin section into the glue, bring it out dripping and hammer it into the tails board, and put a clamp on that much. Then go get the rear board, plunge its pins into the glue, and hammer that into the same tails board. Then glue that much. The glue will come off one-two-nothing as it gels. In a few minutes, take those clamps off, go get the other drawer side, plunge its tails into the glue, and hammer it into place--replace the clamps. I have a furniture-maker friend who says what he loves about hide glue on drawers is that it gives the dovetails a 'growed together' look as the water swells the wood, but the drying glue pulls everything together.

Bottom line: If you want to give it shot, just get some glue flakes and something to heat it in, and do a few rub joints, etc etc, just to get a feel for it. Your gaming table project won't require any special practice, but rather more of a gut feel on your part of how to organize a glue up using hot hide glue.

Be sure and check with the SAPFM folks--they've been extremely helpful to me as a newbie in their area of expertise.

Wiley

Re: Gaming Table Advice Requested

#5

Re: Gaming Table Advice Requested

Greg B�tit, Crown Point NY

>Thanks so much Tony and Wiley. I know I have a lot to learn, but I'm starting to get excited about this stuff.

Greg

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