Help on plowing a groove

What I would do

Jim Reed @ Tallahassee

>Mark the stopped end and chisel out about 1" of the end. Don't go all the way to the bottom. This will give you something to aim at. Then take your #45 with a 1/8" blade and define the sides of your groove. Get as close to your aiming hole as possible. When the sides are done, use your 1/2" blade to take out the 1/4" remaining in the middle. Use chisel and your #71 to clean out the waste and open up your aiming hole. Good luck.

Re: Help on plowing a groove

Wiley Horne--Glendora, CA

>If this cut is going to be made in an appearance location, I would suggest knifing in the outline of the cut before ploughing, in order to keep from having torn grain at the surface of the cut. I do this with a mortise gauge that has cutting knives (not pins). Could also be done using two settings of a cutting gauge.

Wiley

Re: What I would do

Richard A.Gillespie, Jr.

>Jim;

I used both of my 45's for the first time yesterday and today, cutting dado's in wood panels for a box. What I don't understand is how you can use a 1/8" blade when with the two skates closed tight, a 1/4" is the narrowest blade that fits.

I admit that I'm self taught and my teacher is dumb as a box of rocks but I just don't see a 1/8" blade working unless you turn the skates inside out.

I would like to comment that I've heard, in the past, horror stories on how hard the 45 is to use. I can't agree with that now. With a sharp blade, sharp scoring blades and proper set up, my 45's worked very well, cutting dado's in both Pine and Ash.

To redirect my comments to Bob, you didn't specify what species wood you are using. If it was me, I'd sharpen the 1/2" blade and have a go at it. I was using a 3/8" blade cutting 3/16" deep in ash with no real problems. With a 45, you are suppose to start the cut at the end and work your way back-wards. Not knowing any better, I'd be tempted to fiddle with the front depth gauge and get the last part of the dado to my desired depth and then continue to work back-wards.

Now I must admit that I was faced with the same problems on the project I was working on and decided that worrying about stopped dado's wasn't worth it. I'll fill in the small amount of missing wood when I finish the box.

Re: Help on plowing a groove

Adam Cherubini

>I need to plow a 1/2" groove in a stile that is about 3/4" in. thick. The groove needs to be about 3/8" deep.What is a good technique? (I am pretty green). I have a stanley #45 and a #71 router plane. Can I just go straight to a 1/2 in. blade in the #45 and plow away or should I start by making 1/4 in. groove first, then 1/2?

If a groove is stopped, what is the best way to use a plow plane? I assume the section of the groove that is nearest the stop must be taken out with a chisel. That is necessary because if you attempt to plow to the stop, the runners are lifted at the end left unplowed and this ramp lifts the plane blade from the groove.In a stopped groove or dado, do you always begin at the far end of the groove and work the plane back toward the other end (closer to your body)?

Thanks for your help,

Bob

First, I think 1/2" is too wide for 3/4" thick stock. Next, I've never seen an example of a stopped groove in a stile. I'd look to redesign instead of making this difficult. We;\'ve had this conversation before- I always say that IO never seen stopped dadoes or long sliding dovetails- both features guys struggle with. Now I would take you to the purism discussion- You may be attempting to recreate a feature traditionally machined. Hand tools belong within a certain context or inside a certain box. I think you are outside the box.

Adam

Re: Help on plowing a groove

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>What are you building, chichi? As Adam says, probably 1/2" is too big a groove for a 3/4" thickness. You might want to limit it to 3/8".

Pam

Simple solution...

Jim Reed@Tallahassee

>take the center skate off! It is only necessary when blade size is 5/16 or greater. Try this stripped down version of your 45 and you will love it.

Really?????

Dave (Arlington, VA)

>Hi Jim -

I have a #45 but haven't made much use of it yet. I don't have a 1/8 inch blade, but thanks to Joe Rogers I do have a 3/16th now along with 12 or so other blades (assortment of plow, reeding, T&G, etc). I assume everything you say for the 1/8th would work for a 3/16th, yes?

My question is: by removing the center skate won't you get tear-out on the left hand part of groove?

Is is safe to assume that you use the center skate when you plow dados? If so, do you have the same problem Richard refers to above (i.e. the skates won't "close" enough for anything smaller than a 1/4" blade) or do you have another work-around?

Thanks and regards -

Dave

Re: Help on plowing a groove

Jack Guzman from Maine

>Wiley,I would love to have a mortise gauge capable of doing this.Both examples I have use a sliding brass bar with two pins.The best of them is an old one that I got cheap because of a stripped set screw. I repaired it by inserting a threaded insert and putting in a larger screw of another broken gauge.After filing the pins it works beautifully for me.It won't close to even a 1/4" though,so it's limited.The other is a cheap new store bought copy that is almost useless.Do you have a picture of yours or a link to an example?---thanks---Jack

Gauge

Bob Hackett

>One of the best for the money I`ve seen so far has been the Japanese gauge from LV.There`s a link to it floating around here somewhere.

If I was smarter I`d be able to supply a link myself.

MB

Tearout

Jim Reed @ Tallahassee

>I like to use the 1/8 blade because tearout seems to be less. Also, the nickers seem to be more trouble than they are worth, so I usually scribe a line with a razor knife. Once you get into the cut, tearout is not a problem. I think the center skate of #45/46 is highly overrated and rarely use it on my plane.

Here's one from Hida Tool *LINK*

Wiley Horne--Glendora, CA

>Jack,

A Japanese kama kebiki will knife in a mortise for you--get the large one. There is also a heavier duty cutting gauge, called a wari kebiki--see bottom of page on the link below.

Now for cutting lengths of stringing off a sheet of veneer, I am finding the English cutting gauge to be better than a kebiki, because the thinner cutter doesn't bevel the string as much as a kebiki. But this is getting afield.

Wiley


Japanese marking/cutting gauges

Re: Help on plowing a groove

chichi

>Thanks for responding. I am building a Stickley style bookcase and the stile is for the side panels. I am going to take Adam's advice and redesign. I will go at it with a 3/8 blade on the 45.

Regards,

Bob