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New handle for a Tyzack back saw

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New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#1

New handle for a Tyzack back saw

Skip in Falls Church

>I finally got around to making a handle for the 10" Tyzack back saw I got a little while back. The open handle on it had broken off at the spine so all I had was the part that attaches to the saw, no grip. It was a little trickier than the other handles I've made. In the past I've always had an entire handle - no matter how badly mangled, to work with. Here I was working from scratch. Next, I'd never made a handle for a split nut saw and I understand split nuts are not made to be removed or reused. Unfortunately I don't have a supply of new split nuts handy so I had to reuse the ones that came with the saw. Also I like my grip to be about 7/8 inch thick (I have fairly big hands so I like a thick grip.) while the previous saw handle had been about 3/4 inch thick.

One of the saw bolts was bent and it appeared that it may have been hammered to be flush with the handle. Is that how split nuts were set flush? In any case, I had to straighten it to use it. Fortunately I was able to straighten it without breaking it.

I decided to make the handle out of quartersawn American beech and chose beech because the original handle had been made from beech. I took the design of the grip from another English open handle saw I have. There was a difference between the two in the angle between the grip and the blade. At least that was the interpretation I made because the piece of the original handle I have made a tighter arc at the transition to the grip. I adjusted the angle of the grip to fit that arc.

To accommodate the grip size I like but still set the split nuts flush, I planed the stock down to 7/8 inch then marked the center line for the blade and, using my mortising gauge, marked the part of the handle the blade set in to 3/4 inch. (I set the mortising gauge from the center line of the handle I had to one side of that handle. Then I used the center line of the new handle to mark each side to width.) I then planed that part to the lines. I smoothed the transition with a scraper.

I used a fret saw and brace and bit to cut out the handle then used a microplane, rasp and scraper to shape the handle. The I used 220 grit sand paper to finish it off. I drilled the holes for the split nuts with a drill press. The heads of the saw nuts and bolts are flush with the sides, but the ends of the bolts are not quite flush. However, I'm happy with the end result.

I don't know if anyone would be interested in my doing an article about how I made this handle. I checked the article section and didn't see an article about making saw handles. I did take a lot of pictures during the process.

I've had some communications with Adam Cherubini about saw handles - he has asserted that modern saw handles aren't comfortable. I've been pursuing that line and making some observations. So far nothing that really bears on his point (at least I don't think so) but do have some interesting observations.

The reason this saw doesn't have a handle is that it was broken off. It would appear that the orientation of the grain contributed to that. The grain direction of the original handle was parallel to the spine of the saw leaving the neck susceptible to breaking where it did. I fixed that by changing the orientation of the grain in the new handle. However, I've seen some other English saws that had the same grain orientation.

I also noticed the other split nut back saw I have has the same grain orientation - but that one is American. OTOH that orientation would make sense for the American saw because it is a closed handle and has a nut through the spine. The "finger" that projects from the front of the handle to accommodate the nut would be very weak if the grain orientation were set at an angle to the blade.

Has anyone else noticed anything similar? Was there a difference in the grain orientation in handles between America and England? Or was this a peculiarity of Tyzack? Or was there a time when grain orientation switched from parallel to the spine to the present day orientation?

Skip (who's finishing up a bunch of projects that were almost done.)


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Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#2

The other side 

Skip in Falls Church

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Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#3

Another view 

Skip in Falls Church

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Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#4

Re: grain orientation

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>IMHO, the way you oriented the grain is the only way to do it if you are concerned about strength, which you should rightly be. Any saw manufacturer who oriented the grain parallel to the back is doing it for only one reason, to let them make the saw from narrower, and therefore cheaper, stock. And that's also why newer saw handles are made from plywood.

Well, I guess there is one other strategy you could adopt that would make an even better handle. Go find a piece of wood with drastically curved grain, for example, where the wood has curved around a branch, and cut the handle from that. Of course, appropriate pieces of wood are few and far between, so you have to search hard to find one. You can find more of it in log run lumber, and it gives you a good use for the otherwise junk parts of the board.

Here is an example, in mahogany. I drastically modified the photo's color curves to emphasize the grain pattern, especially the growth rings. Even if this blank were destined to be an open handle, it would be as close to indestructible as you could get. Sometimes you just get lucky when digging through the scrap heap. And, it's 15/16" thick, to boot.


Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#5

Nicely done Skip

Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia)

>Good one Skip. And yes, I think an article on saw handle making is a great idea - I have a yen to make up a backsaw for myself, and so would be interested.

Incidentally, why do you think that split nuts cannot be re-used?

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#6

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw *LINK*

MikeW

>Very nice job Skip.

Here are two I just did. Nothing better than a handle that fits the hand.

The saw in the link below cost either a quarter or fifty cents, can't remember. Made the handle from Sycamore.

The image below is a tenon saw I bought a year ago or so. Handle is Walnut, ugly, and uncomfortable--or it was. Doesn't take having a broken handle to make one more comfortable. Guess which was the original?


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Sycamore hand saw handle

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#7

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

Ernie Miller

>Nice work where is all the carving? how does it fit the hand?

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#8

Isn`t it nice...

Bob Hackett

>To have a saw that fits YOUR hand as opposed to a saw designed to fit most everybody elses hand.

Nice work.I think you`ll be amazed at how much of a difference it makes in your other work too.

Mainely,Bob

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#9

Re: grain orientation

Skip in Falls Church

>Hi William

Well that's what I thought about grain orientation - but Tyzack seemed to be a saw maker with a pretty good reputation. OTOH I have no idea how old the saw actually is and what the reputation was at the time.

Actually I was looking at a knot a little farther down the board that has some curved grain around it. I don't know if the grain is really good enough but when I get a chance I'll see if it'll work. It seems to me that even a little curve in the right direction would add a bit of strength.

That's a nice piece of saw handle stock you have there!

Skip

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#10

Re: Nicely done Skip

Skip in Falls Church

>Thanks Derek! And I'll see if I can put something together as an article. But it seems like there are several other people that could (maybe *should*) do an article as well. :)

I'm not sure where I heard that split nuts couldn't be reused - OTOH it didn't stop me. I actually found the split nuts easier to use than the modern saw nuts.

Skip

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#11

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

Skip in Falls Church

>Thanks Mike! It really is great to have a handle that *fits*! And it really does make sawing more comfortable.

Skip

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#12

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

Skip in Falls Church

>Hi Ernie,

I decided to keep the handle "in period" so to speak. Although I did consider doing the handle as a porpoise or a shark. But I decided to keep that idea for later. I ended up buying a 10 foot board - so I don't have a shortage of raw material.

I like the feel of it. I check the feel of a handle all the way through the process to make sure it's coming out the way that feels best. Of course I'm sure I'm still haven't achieved Adam's "comfortable" saw handle so this is more of a quest than an individual project. If I recall correctly at one point he said that modern saw handles make him feel like he's breaking his wrist.

Skip

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#13

Re: Isn`t it nice...

Skip in Falls Church

>Thanks Bob! Having a saw that fits my hand is one of the real benefits of making a handle. And making a handle really isn't hard. I'm surprised that more people don't make their own.

It's really a great feeling to pick up a saw that you've made a handle for. I don't know if it's because the handle fits my hand better or a figment of my imagination - but it does seem to make a difference when I use one of them.

Skip

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#14

Re: Nicely done Skip

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>Maybe you are thinking of comments Todd Hughes made about the difficulty of removing them without splitting out the wood of the handle. That is a real possibility due to the sharp top edges and tight fit. Other than that, the only issue is to make a screwdriver that is the right size to fit the slot and to miss the end of the bolt. If you get it too big, you mess up the wood. If you get it too small, you mess up the edges of the slot. Either is unsightly if you are attempting to restore and old, valuable saw, but if you are have to make a new handle anyhow, just do it.

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#15

Re: Hijack - split nut screwdriver

Ted Shuck, Centennial, CO

>I had a lot of frustration with split nut screwdrivers until I came up with a very simple solution. The ones I had made from regular flat tip screwdrivers had never worked well since the tips were always too narrow.

I took a 1 1/4" flat washer and filed a flat on one side. I then filed the edge of the flat to be just the thickness of the slot in the split nut. Using a triangular file, I made a slot in the middle. Then, using the edge of a flat file, filed the edges of the flat so that the screwdriver tip was just the width of the nut. I now have a "screwdriver" that fits exactly in the slot of my split nuts. If I have different split nuts, I can file another washer to fit.

It works much better than any other screwdriver that I have tried. The steel may be soft, but the brass of the split nut is much softer. The best thing is that it is an exact fit and I don't munge the nuts any longer.

Ted

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#16

Re: Hijack - split nut screwdriver

Skip in Falls Church

>Hi Ted,

That's a great idea. I'll have to make one. I had a split nut screw driver that I picked up as part of an ebay lot. It took me a while to figure out what the heck it was since I didn't have any saws with split nuts at the time. It works okay - but it does come out of the slot fairly easily unless you're really paying attention.

Skip

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#17

Jack Guzman from Maine

Re: Hijack - split nut screwdriver

Jack Guzman from Maine

>I made my split nut driver out of a stubby craftsman screwdiver that was the next size larger than the standard size.It fits the slots perfectly and is square all around so it doesn't slip.The saw I made it for is an english made turn of the century back saw.If the blade tapers it will tend to slip.---Jack

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#18

Re: Hijack - split nut screwdriver

Ted Shuck, Centennial, CO

>Thanks for posting the good advice about having the faces of the screwdriver tip parallel, not tapering to the tip. This is very important, and I filed my washer/screwdriver this way. I found it much easier to file a soft steel washer to the exact shape I needed rather than shape a hardened screwdriver tip.

The split saw nuts on my saws are at least 1/2" across. I was unable to find a regular screwdriver with a tip this wide. When I used a narrower screwdriver, I always seemed to dent the slots in the screws where the edges of the screwdriver blade ended.

Ted

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#19

Screwdriver grip tip

Bob Hackett

>A very small dab of valve grinding compound(Clover brand in the green can) on the tip of a screwdriver will greatly improve the grip and help eliminate the chance of munging up the screw head.

For those of you sharpening with diamond paste,yes that will work too.

Glad I could pass along this old gearhead tip.

Mainely,Bob

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#20

Re: Hijack - split nut screwdriver

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>Why didn't I think of that? I feel really stupid, now (again). I wish you had told me yesterday. After several false starts on the diamond wheel dresser, I had several threaded inserts embedded in scraps of wood, that I would have liked to recycle. The slots in these are quite similar to the slots in split nuts. I have a screwdriver I modified to fit the big ones, but nothing that comes close to the next size smaller. Rather than regrind and ruin an otherwise perfectly good screwdriver, I just tossed them in the trash. Being cheap, I'll probably dig them out and waste a perfectly good washer to salvage them, but then I'll have one of each for the next time I feel the need to invent a tool.

Thanks for the tips, guys.

Re: New handle for a Tyzack back saw

#21

Re: Screwdriver grip tip

Ted Shuck, Centennial, CO

>Great tip!

I am sure this will save me a lot of frustration in the future.

Assuming I can remember it when I need it of course...

Thanks,

Ted

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