Grinding a bevel?

Re: Grinding a bevel?

Dan Donaldson

>Does your grinder have any kind of a tool rest? I have done a couple of things. One is as someone else suggested, put a rare earth magnet on the blade to mark the extension, and then run this against the tool rest. Another is to use my finger as a guide along the rest to keep the extension constant. If you don't have any kind of a rest at all and are trying to do it totaly freehand, unless you are a lot better than I am, you are doomed to weird bevels ;-) You need at least some kind of a rest that is parallel to the face of the stone.

Re: Grinding a bevel?

Jeremy Osner

>Yes there is a tool rest. I think I was not using it properly and would love to see its use demonstrated... Or a written description of how to use it. It's a dinky little thing, are there after-market tool rests one can put on grinders? Or home-made?

You're in luck!

Adam Cherubini

>Hi Jeremy,

There's a special FREE sharpening seminar at Pennsbury manor this Sunday for visitors admitted to the museum! Museum tours will be offered (for a small fee) to significant others. Here's the course info in case you are interested:

FREE HAND SHARPENING 101 JUNE 5, 1-4pm

Learn to sharpen edge tools without the aid of jigs (or electricity). Students will learn to produce a razor edge on woodworking tools using a variety of sharpening media including rare antique slow cutting British whetstones, glazed black arkansas, and the latest 3m micro abrasive papers. (unfortunately waterstones will not be covered in this class).

Emphasis will be placed on developing free hand grinding and honing technique through excessive repetition.

Sharpening equipment, and special "practice" chisels will be provided. Heat treating and tempering services will be available upon request.

Students should wear clothing appropriate for warm weather and hard dirty work. Funny hats will be provided.

Students who finish their course work early may sit in on the MORTISE AND TENON JOINERY seminar that will be conducted at a nearby location simultaneoulsy.

It is my understanding that both of these classes still have some spots available and won't be offered again until August at the earliest.

Adam

Re: Grinding a bevel?

Todd Hughes

>I gring all mine by holding the edge vertical and NOT horizintaly like many do. This way you can look down and see that you are holding it at the right angle and i believe it is easier to keep from moving the chisel so you loose the angle. I use a big belt sander and never use a tool rest or a guide of course.Havn't really used a grinding wheel much and you may have to turn the edge at a slight angle to keep from wearing a groove in a stone but never a trouble with a belt sander.If I didn't have the big sander I made I would pick up a small one cheap to use for sharpening over a grindstone....Todd

Do me a favor Adam

Jeremy Osner

>Could ya sign me up for the August class? Thanks.

Re: Do me a favor Adam

Adam Cherubini

>I'll see if I can squeeze you in.

Re: Grinding a bevel?

Joel

>Stop by the store next week (I'm out sick today) and I 'll be happy to show you how to use a grinder. I consider a high speed grinder to be one of the most useful tools in the shop and it's my only power tool.

(it's not hard at all - there is some basic technique to learn (15 minutes) and some practice.)

Lee Valley makes one  *LINK*

Dan Donaldson

>


Grinder rest

Re: Grinding a bevel?

Jeremy Osner

>Thanks -- that would be great. I'll come by Monday or Tuesday afternoon.

Re: Grinding a bevel?

Joel

>sure - tuesdays are better - mondy is always a lot busier.

Re: Grinding a bevel?

mike recchione

>Jeremy,

I only recently started using a powered grinder. I really bought it for turning tools, which need to be ground constantly, but can be used direct from the wheel. My first attempts at doing plane irons on this thing were pretty sorry. It's funny that I never had that problem when I used a hand-cranked wheel - maybe because things are happening so much more slowly.

In any case, the technique that ulimately worked was to (1) make sure that the tool rest was parallel to the grinding surface of the wheel, (2) set the angle of the tool rest to the proper angle using the iron, (3) make sure the iron was resting fully on the rest before touching the wheel, (4) sliding it forward until it just touched the wheel, making sure to keep it (a) resting flat on the rest the whole time, and (b) perpendicular to the rest. You're right that you can't do the whole bevel at one shot without burning the steel (DAMHIKT), but if you make sure the angle is right, that you stay perpendicular and that you're just touching the wheel when you bring the iron forward, it should work. Any very slight faceting you get this way should come out quickly once you move to your stones.

Failing that, the very coarse (50 grit?) blue zirconia sanding belts on glass work very well and very fast if you don't insist on a hollow grind. I've been woodworking for a number of years now, always sharpening freehand, and never hollow ground anything. It may increase touch-up time not to hollow grind, but I can't say the annoyance factor has been too bad at all.

Re: Grinding a bevel?

Jack Guzman from Maine

>Jeremy,I got the Lee Valley tool rest kit and it's made all the difference for me for grinding bevels.I don't find too many tools with a good bevel on them so I'm doing alot of shaping of steel. ---Jack

Re: Grinding a bevel?

Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia)

>Hi Jeremy

If you plan to grind on a vertical wheel, then Joel's suggestion is definitely the way to go. Also, have a look at Rob Cosman's DVD. He does an excellent job of demonstrating techniques for the grinder.

But if you want the easiest (and safest way in my opinion) to grind a bevel from scratch, then a belt sander with a 80 grit belt is going to give you the coolest, quickest, and most accurate bevel. Do a search for my "Belt Sander Grinder" for a picture. Or look for "Grinding a Scrub Blade", which was a few days ago. At a recent sharpening workshop I ran, I ground a few scrub blades from scratch to a final hone in under 5 minutes each.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: Grinding a bevel?

Stephen in Ottawa

>Jeremy,

I tried freehand grinding, without a tool rest, and it isn't as hard as it seems, but needs some practice to get right. I made myself a very simple, fixed angle toolrest out of some pieces of scrap lumber and it works well to keep the tool at a fixed angle to the wheel. Maintaining the edge parallel to the axis of the wheel isn't that hard to do. In any case, I don't need to be very accurate in that regard, since I never grind right upto the cutting edge anyway. Always leave a little to hone on my water stones. That way I can use an ordinary coarse grinding wheel and get good results. There is an article on grinding on the C&W web site ( in the articles section ), which is very informative. As someone else mentioned, Rob Cosman's sharpening video has very good instruction on how to use an ordinary bench grinder.

- Stephen

Preparation for grinding

Jim Reed @ Tallahassee

>Grinding finished blades or chisels is easier if you have the proper equipment. Get rid of the gray wheels and get a pink or white wheels for your grinder. Get a diamond wheel dresser. As for technique, remove metal equally along the width of the blade--don't try to hog everything out at once. Use light passes. Dunk the blade in water to keep it cool. Inspect after every pass. Good luck.

Safety

Jim Reed @ Tallahassee

>I forgot to mention safety. Be sure you use hearing protectors and a mask. Grinding dust (especially when you dress the wheel) is bad for you. Wear an apron. Wear glasses and/or goggles. Remove watches, jewelry, & long sleeves. Do not stand directly in front of the wheel. There are a few more rules. BE SAFE. Poor safety techniques will get get you hurt quickly.

Re: length of a tool rest

Moses Yoder in White Pigeon, MI

>For those of us who are not much interested in torturing ourselves with extreme challenges, I suggest a tool rest that is wide enough that the tool will register at the same angle to the wheel every time. My shop made adjustable rest is about 2-1/2" wide, and I simply adjust it to the angle I want and the tool will then hit the wheel at the same place if I remove it to cool. A good rest is detailed in David Finck's book on plane making, and Lee Valley sells one that is tempting me to buy it just to make the adjusting a bit easier. Focus on keeping the sparks coming from the center of the wheel. Getting the grind that Krenov shows in his book on cabinetmaking takes some practice but is very achievable.

Re: Safety Quiz

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>Where might you find one of these?

A. Perth

B. Talahassee

C. Dead Horse Forge

D. Loxahatchee Toolworks

E. A Major Museum on Manhattan Island

F. None of the Above

BTW, except for the minor guarding issues, with practice, you really don't need anything more sophisticated. If you want a hollow grind, just bring your edge down to the lower wheel. And it works for skews, to boot!

C?

Dan Donaldson

>

D!

Don Thompson - Cutler Ridge, Florida

>

Oh It's C ...No doubt!

Joe Rogers, Northern Virginia

>

The answer is F

Bob Hackett

>You didn`t have"Any boatyard north of Conn." listed.So F it has to be.

Mainely,Bob-Who lives where they still use square head jointers and planers powered by ungaurded flat leather belts run from the overhead.

Re: The answer is F

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>In actuality, the answer is not "Suburbs of Price, MD" where this photo was taken. "C" is probably the correct answer, as I assume Todd immediately set it up at his new forge. It is beautiful in its simplicity and utility, but requires a bit of discipline to use safely.

For example, don't wear a necktie! Change clothes when you come home from your desk job before going out to do some real work the shop!

Reputation is Ruined!

Todd Hughes

>Geee whiz....Now everybody will see that I really have yelded to the temptation of High Tech Machinery !.....Thanks for the tip about the neck tie don't know how many times I have forgotten to take mine off befor doing some grinding.Same with my big Bling Bling Chain necklace. Guess I have just been lucky, eh?....Todd