Interesting Plane

MIssing link *LINK*

David Miller from Iowa

>link


link

Re: Interesting Plane

Todd Hughes

>These side rabbets were normaly sold in pairs, left and right and were used in cleaning up dadoes or rabbets. Not real common but not exactly rare though think I have only ever found two matching pairs over the years....Kind of a neat plane and always imagined they would work well.....Todd

Re: standard

paul womack

>They're not common. mainly because they don't work terribly well. They were wiped out by the metal side rebates. IIRC Dunbar describes them,

BugBear

Working

Jim Reed @Tallahassee

>Hard to beat a set of #98/99 Stanleys. I have been working on a set of blades for a pair of woodies I have and tend to agree that they probably do not work well. There is no way to make major adjustments to the blade. Nice eye candy for the collector's shelf.

Re: Wooden side rebates *LINK*

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>Sure, have a couple or three. The thing to watch for is such a worn blade that it no longer extends past the slot. At that point (one of mine is), I think the solution is to plane the wood. The main problem is that, by necessity, the bottom of the plane is a little thicker than you'd want for trimming dados and/or sliding dovetails, so it's tough to get down to the bottom.

Japanese versions are still made and used.

Pam


Narrow side cutting plane

Re: Working

paul womack

>Hard to beat a set of #98/99 Stanleys.

I'm not in a position to compare, but I've never found a scenario where my #79 doesn't get the job done easily.

Joel has put together some fine information on these tools

Do the Japanese tool fans have a variation of this tool, or do they always cut their grooves the right size first time :-)

BugBear

Stanley #79 vs #98/99

Jim Reed @Tallahassee

>This is a topic for further study. I like the #98/99 pair so much that I have yet to use the #79 and compare. It is certainly worth a Sat afternoon once I get them out of their storage boxes. Just offhand, I think it would be hard to beat the hand appeal of 98/99. Of course, the #79 does have that neat thumb rest...

Re: Stanley #79 vs #98/99

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>Sometimes you get grain reversal in a rabbet. It is really convenient to just swap planes instead of retracting one blade and extending the other.

But, if you think the Stanley #98 /#99 are hard to beat, you really need to check out the versions made by Lie-Nielsen, in bronze, with A2 steel blaces, and other subtle improvements. To my way of thinking, there is no comparison.

Re: Stanley #79 vs #98/99

paul womack

>The 2 in 1 designs do provide a clear benefit; you always know where the "other" tool is!

BugBear (who can lose things in shavings real easy)

Re: Wooden side rebates *LINK*

Andreas Winkler

>These side rabbet planes are completely unknown in traditonal German woodworking.

For the side rabbet�s purpose in Germany (don�t know in continental Europe ?) a special plane called "Wangenhobel" is used. It is a normal rabbet plane with a wider metal (in former times of course wooden) sole and an iron that is wide as the sole.

Laying the plane on its side, you can enlarge or clean up grooves.

Andreas from Germany


Wangenhobel

Re: Stanley #79 vs #98/99

paul womack

>retracting one blade and extending the other.

I just leave both my #79 blades extended. The "trailing" blade doesn't appear to be damaged, and certainly doesn't cut.

If this weren't the case the #79 would be a pain in the proverbial.

Of course, the Preston/Record design addresses this issue in yet a different way.

BugBear

Re: Stanley #79 vs #98/99

William Duffield, on the Cohansey

>Yabbut, I catch heck for not lifting the plane on the return stroke, on "general principles." Since other people might also be criticized for this laziness, I figured it was worth mentioning. No sense getting someone in trouble with the Neandercops.

Also, regarding not losing pieces, if you have to take off the nose to complete a cut in a stopped groove, you can still lose it, and then there is the fence and its thumbwheel. :^)

Re: Wooden side rebates

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>Cool, have wondered about the purpose of those planes, beyond the obvious rebate tasks, never knew the reason for the metal plate. Is the bottom plate adjustable? Or are you limited to the dado depth you can trim?

Thanks,

Pam

Re: Working

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>Yes, the Japanese have a variation, see my message below. And yes, there's a tendency to cut grooves right the first time, so we don't have to buy them. :)

I was so convinced by Joel's article that a couple or three years ago I bought one of the Preston "highest gizmosity ever" 1369s from Andy or Tony. It was a beauty; but when I took a closer look at the tool budget, such as it was, it began to seem very extravagent, so I sold it to a local old tools friend. The other thing that convinced me to sell it was I realized it was probably a lot easier to trim the male piece to fit.

But I still lust after the LN 98/99, what eye candy.

Pam

Forgot to mention

Jim Reed @Tallahassee

>that my #98/99s have my blades, of course. The originals were in pretty bad shape. My new ones are much harder and have never needed resharpening.

Plus...

Peter Berglund in Denver

>The #79 works for me. Another advantage is that, fitted with a 10-degree maple fence, it's excellent for turning a dado into a sliding dovetail.

Clever idea

Jim Reed @Tallahassee

>Does it work as good as a dedicated plane would? The #79 does not look like it would be easy to hold for a long time???

Re: Forgot to mention

paul womack

>never needed resharpening.

I have no doubt your blades are excellent. but I've never (one I'd tuned it) had to sharpen my #79 (Stanley) blades either.

Altering groove widths is an infrequent and gentle task; a coupla' shavings at most. Hadly taxing on even a soft blade :-)

BugBear

Re: Wooden side rebates and differences in woodwor

Andreas Winkler

>Yes, you are right. The bootom plate is not adjustable, so the depth of the groove is limited to the distance between the end of the plate and the plane�s body. The body of that plane is 21 mm wide, plate and iron 48 mm. So the maximum depth of the groove can be 12 to 13 mm (1/2").

In good-old-handtool-times these planes were also offerd with a curved sole and as a "stop-version" for enlarging grooves that ended in the middle of a board.

The differences of tools and techniques in our countries are very interssting to me.

Another example: dadoe-planes were and are almost unknown in German woodworking. Here in Germany, dadoes were pre-cut with a saw and then planed with a "Grundhobel". I think router-plane in English. Routers in Germany are looking different from their wooden English and American counterparts.

Or the use of frame saws. As far as I know, the only frame saw in America is a bow saw, whereas in Germany ripping, crosscutting, tenon making and even making dovetails was done with frame saws. Your handsaws were not common.

Or making sliding dovetails. Here in Germany the dovtail part ("Grat" in German) of the joint was done with a special plane, called "Grathobel". The groove of that joint is again made with a saw and the "Grundhobel".

As far as I know, the dovetail part in the US is made with chisel and saw.

Or the use of wooden and metal planes. Or the horned planes, that may be seldom in the USA but standard in Germany.

I have included some interessting links from Wolfgang Jordans fabulous woodworking sites.

Wangenhobel:

http://www.holzwerken.de/werkzeug/wangenhobel.phtml

Grundhobel:

http://www.holzwerken.de/werkzeug/grundhobel.phtml

Grathobel:

http://www.holzwerken.de/werkzeug/grathobel.phtml

Old tool catalog:

http://www.holzwerken.de/museum/hersteller/kataloge/ott2_18.phtml

Greetings and Frohe Weihnachten from Germany, Andreas

Re: standard

steve knight

>I have worked out a design for a wooden side rabbet. mine uses a L or T shaped blade and the plane says on it's side cutting into the slot.

Re: Wooden side rebates and differences in woodwor

Derek

>Andreas,

Thenks so much for sharng this with us! Your posts are very interesting to me!

Derek

Re: Wooden side rebates and differences in woodwor

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>It is very interesting. I own a Primus Jointer (701P) and like it a lot. I've also used the Primus 711 reform smoother, think it's a great plane.

A lot of techniques are shared. For example, I still cut dados and sliding dovetails with saws, then route with chisel and ultimately a 071 Stanley router. Basically, in the case of dados I think too many planes are required to purchase one or two. Plus, I don't always get the exact width planned on a shelf, so it's better to be able to tailor the dado to the situation.

Also, many here rip with frame saws, as well as cut veneer. The US is a pretty cool place to be these days when purchasing/using hand tools, I love the ability to easily mix European, US, and Japanese tools on a given job.

Pam