How do you cut sliding dovetails...

Re: How do you cut sliding dovetails...

Christopher Fitch @ Memphis

>Oh yeah... I know about the Stanley #444

Are there any other planes that might be used?

Perhaps a Side Rebate plane Stanley 98/99 or a Record 2506 to undercut a groove?

Re: How do you cut sliding dovetails...

Dan clermont in Burnaby

>Hi Christopher.

I use a block of wood with a 1:8 taper. Made it specifically for

To cut the female I take that block of wood with my crosscut backsaw and then saw to the depth I want. Flip the blosck around and cut the other side. Now chisel and remove all the waste in between.

For the male part I cut the shoulders and then using the same 1:8 tapered bolck of wood I rest my LN 60 1/2R or any other shoulder plane on the taper and then plane away. It doesn't take very long and you can sneak right up to the perfect fit.

Dan Clermont in Burnaby

Re: How do you cut sliding dovetails...

Frank Mutchler

>Hi Chris. Just between you & I, I use a WoodRat to cut sliding DTs...please don't let anyone here know ;>) Two much more galootish methods are pictured on pg. 35 of Jim Tolpin's "The Toolbox Book". One shows Mr. Konovaloff freehanding a dado into a sliding DT groove using a Stanley #79 side rabbet (rebate) plane. The other shows Mr. Tolpin (I think) using an Ulmia DT plane to cut the DT.

Re: How do you cut sliding dovetails...

Alice Frampton, UK

>Frank,

Same here. Oh, the shame... I keeping meaning to try doing it by hand one day, just to say I have, but it's just too darn easy with the Rodent :~(

Cheers, Alf

Re: How do you cut sliding dovetails... *LINK*

Don Thompson, Cutler Ridge, South of Miami FL

>One might try one of these, from Knight-Toolworks:


Knight Dovetail Plane

Re: How do you cut sliding dovetails...

Adam Cherubini, NJ

>Chris,

The full length sliding dovetail is rarely found in pre-industrial furniture (furniture made with hand tools exclusively). The joint simply isn't that useful. Whatever you are using it for, there is a probably better and easier way to get what you want. Sometimes the solution is a different cut of wood.

Now shorty sliding dovetails are very common. We see them often where a drawer divider meets a carcass side. Some assume these were full length. They weren't. Some believe that they would be better were they full length. That's debatable .

Sliders this short can be easily cut from the end with a sharp chisel. They really don't need to be more than 3" anyway. No special tools, no screwing around.

Even if you don't like 18th century furniture, Jeff Greene's book "American Furniture of the 18th century" would be helpful. It shows pictures of basic joinery for a variety of furniture forms. I just quickly breezed through it and saw only one long SDT on the William and Mary chest on chest. Coincidentally, I just finished a nearly identical piece! I copied the joinery from the original which had no sliding dovetails.

I think we sometimes make stuff up and add arbitrary requirements that make woodworking with hand tools more difficult than it should be. Sliding dovetails are an example of this. In my opinion, every hand tool woodworker benefits from a thorough familiarity of 18th century joinery and techniques to help sort out the baloney.

Adam

One more tip

Ted Owen, Pittsburgh

>If you do make long SDT's, consider using a slight taper on the female piece. Cut to fit such that during assembly the pieces slide together fairly easily until the last couple inches. Then pound them home.

Remember that the glue will add some lubrication during assembly--making it easier. Warm hide glue can be a good choice. But if assembly is performed too slowly, moisture in the glue will cause fibers to expand--making it more difficult.

Best, Ted

Re: Short sliding dovetails...

Pam Niedermayer - Austin, TX

>Adam, are you saying that on bombe chests, for example, most of the divider-to-carcass joinery is done with a regular dado with only the first 3" or so sliding dovetail? If so, in that case, are the dados glued and/or screwed? Are the dividers taller than the dado (I would say tenoned, but not sure that's the correct term)?

Thanks,

Pam

A Pal For Lonnie??

Frank Mutchler

>I'm surprised that Will (in KC) & Lonnie don't fess up to using one of the Rodents ;>)!!

Adam, are you.....

Jeff Schmidt

>...going to add some pictures of the chest-on-chest to your website? Love to see some.

Jeff

Re: How do you cut sliding dovetails... *LINK*

Jeff Schmidt (KY)

>Here is a link to Chris Swingley's website that more or less shows what Dan describes, though Chris' is a stopped dado. He also tapered it as Ted suggested.


Sliding Dovetail

Re: A Pal For Lonnie??

Lonnie in K.C.

>Frank,

Will uses this loud obnoxious tool to make sliding dovetails. Please, don't tell him I told you.

"Squeek"

Lonnie

Ratting on him, eh? ;~)

Alice Frampton, UK

>

good one : ^)

Lonnie in K.C.

>

Re: How do you ... The Eurepean way

Christof Hartge

>Hello Christopher,

the classic European way is shown on Wolfgang Jordans website: http://www.holzwerken.de/techniken/gratverbindung.phtml

The male part is made with a dovetail plane. (Recommendation: Ulmia). The female part is done with a special saw called Grats�ge ("Staircase-saw" ?) chisel and router plane. This a fast and effective way of making this joint.

Greetings, Christof.

Re: How do you cut sliding dovetails...

Christof Hartge

>Hello Adam,

"The full length sliding dovetail is rarely found in pre-industrial furniture (furniture made with hand tools exclusively). The joint simply isn't that useful."

Can't concur with you on that. The sliding dovetail is a most usefull joint, whenever a T-shape is involved. So at least in Europe the sliding dovetail is very common at tables, stairs and all kinds of racks and kitchen cabinets. The sliding dovetails is nowadays exclusively found on handmade furniture.

Greetings, Christof.

Re: How do you cut sliding dovetails...

Adam Cherubini, NJ

>Gruss Gott Christof!

Sorry to be such a snob.

In truth the only examples of full length sliding dovetails I recall are on Pennsylvania Dutch furniture. Coincidence?

We should more accurately say, sliding dovetails are rare or, at least, atypical on Anglo-American furniture.

Aufwiederhoren!

Adam

You need that book!

Adam Cherubini, NJ

>Pam,

You need that book, Pam! I found it at LV for $13. Shop around.

My sliders are the depth of the dado and glued in place. Everything from there back floats (The drawer blade tenons are glued into the front divider).

One other note- The period I am working in always covers the carcass front with single or double arch moldings, so you'll have to take my word for my use of sliding dovetails! You can't see them on the finished piece. Whew!

In Greene's book, he shows the sliders both ways on the Bomb'e chest (how do you say that by the way? Bombay? Bomb?). All are shorties. Some are deeper than the dado, others are the same depth.

Gordon Bennett! No fasteners for this! Just a wee bit of 'ide glew!

Adam

trying to be more sensitive to my European friends and family

OT: Digital Camera

Adam Cherubini, NJ

>Jeff,

I'm a lazy slacker! I haven't taken a single picture of this case. Not a one. Stupid really. When I'm in the shop, I'm working. When I'm out, I'm playing with the kids. I could have done a better job recording the build process. I'm not entirely stupid though. I've saved offcuts of all the moldings and made a template of the front.

One disadvantage of doing things the old way is there are no plans.

Can you (or anybody else out there) recommend a digital camera? None seem as nice as a 35mm camera. The exposure doesn't seem great and the lenses are so short everything is in focus. Any recommendations/opinions would be appreciated.

Arigato go zai mashishta!

Adam

Re: OT: Digital Camera

Jeff Schmidt (KY)

>Sorry to say that I know nothing about digital cameras. Must be my Luddite tendencies. :-)

Re: You need that book!

Bill Houghton, Sebastopol, CA

>Bom-bay.

Since the word is French, properly spelled, it's got an accent aigu (sp?) on the "e," the one that leans to the right.

Bill, demonstrating that (a) he took French in high school and (b) high school was a LONG time ago.

Re: Short sliding dovetails...

Don Thompson, Cutler Ridge, South of Miami FL

>Although not very inexpensive, it is a very good book, Pam. I do not know what types of furniture you like and want to build, but it has many, many drawings of the joinery techniques used in the illustrated furniture. (I bought it the last time that Adam mentioned it)

Web site?

Don Thompson, Cutler Ridge, South of Miami FL

>

bombay

Jack from Maine

>I saw an ad for cheap furniture in the suday paper that advertised a "Bombay chest" It was a curved front dresser.