hinge installation, when all else fails

Re: hinge installation, when all else fails

Barry Irby

Looks great. When I work on the houses I flip I carry a bag of plugs cut from wood similar to the door jambs. Any damaged screw holes get drilled and plugged. The grain in the plugs is in the same orientation as the jam so the screws get a good grip and they expand the plugs extra tight in the holes.

Re: hinge installation, when all else fails

John McGaw

I just sharpen a dowel in the shop pencil sharpener. I used to have a tapered drill bit that pretty much matched that angle but somehow it disappeared but just tapping the tapered plug into the glued hole seems to work about as well. Besides, it will wind up invisible anyway.

Re: hinge installation, when all else fails

Mark Nowicki

A couple of toothpicks or bamboo skewers would have worked.

^^^This.  Never could whittle^^^

Re: hinge installation, when all else fails

Bill Houghton, Sebastopol, CA

Like Barry, I use plugs oriented so the grain is the same as the grain I'm plugging. I cut them with the kind of plug cutters used to cover screws. It's my belief that this makes for a stronger screw connection than one into end grain.

I can't count how many times I've had to do this due to botching the location for the screw. It's also useful for older work, where the screw has worn out its welcome in the original wood.

Re: hinge installation, when all else fails

John McGaw

Yeah, forgot that. Round toothpicks (I always have them in the shop to make pegs for Shaker boxes) make excellent plugs for tiny screw holes although I've never used more than one in the same hole.

question for flat grain plug users

Bill Tindall, E.Tn.

When I read about using flat grain plugs it seemed reasonable to accept that screws would hold better in flat grain. But I could not figure out how one whittled a tapered plug with flat grain orientation to fill the tapered screw hole, and I still don't.

Then I got to thinking, why should a screw hold better in a hole plugged with flat grain vs long grain? Then I got to thinking some more, there are two failure modes, maybe three. The screw could loosen by whatever magic screws use to loosen, they could pull out or they could wiggle and enlarge their hole. I think I have seen all but the pull out in house hinges, so pull out is maybe rare failure for a furniture hinge screw? Thinking some more I don't think fixing a loose screw in a 5/8" thick pine door frame has much to do with relocating a screw hole for a hinge in a hardwood cabinet.

It is easy to saw a square plug the size of the screw hole maximum diameter and whittle it round and tapered. I don't know how to make a tapered flat grain plug. Unless someone has data to show that screws behave substantially better in flat grain coupled with a means of plugging a tapered #4 or #6 screw hole I'll stick with what I have been doing.

Re: question for flat grain plug users

Don Stephan

When driven, a screw is making a series of shallow parallel cuts into the surrounding wood. Working strictly from memory, these cuts may be less than 1/16" apart for a #10 wood screw. When driven into end (long?) grain, the result is a lot of short wood grain, less than 1/16" long. Overdrive the screw enough and it would seem possible for these short end grain fibers to pull free from the adjoining wood.

that is a convincing argument

Re: that is a convincing argument

Barry Irby

I have a cheap General Brand set of plug cutters. Pretty sure I got them at Lowe's. 1/2", 3/8" & 1/4". The plugs they cut are very slightly tapered. With care you can cut plugs for a similar species of wood, flat grain. You can choose grain that matches the surrounding wood if the plug will be visible, flat sawn or quarter sawn or whatever. Then you drill a matching hole, slather in a little glue, insert the plug and tamp it home and trim the plug flush with a chisel or one of those flush cutting saws. and you are don with the repair.

When I set up to make them I make a few extra and keep them in a baggy. If I get a loose screw or sloppy hole, I have a few utility plugs on hand. I have used hundreds of them in old worn out door jambs. The flat grain ones work great, as good as new. I have also made a few repairs with whittled slivers and tooth picks. Don't have much confidence in those, just not as good. Have also tried dowels. Also not as good.

Just checked the Lowe's site and they have Milescraft ones similar to mine for under $20.

How

Bill Tindall, E.Tn.

So you have a wallowed out screw hole in a door jam. How do you drill a hole for the plug. The center is missing so an accurate hole can not be make with a brad point. A twist drill in pine is bad news. And finally, why is the plug needed for anything more than accurately locating the pilot hole. The screw should/could go through the flimsy jam and into the framing anyway. I have to believe the makers of doors don't really expect a screw in 5/8" soft pine is going to hold a 100# entry door. However, the "carpenters" that install them must for I have fixed many while visiting. Nothing makes a house guest more welcome that fixing a door that has not properly latched in XX years!

Re: How

David Yoho

How do you drill a hole for the plug. The center is missing so an accurate hole can not be make with a brad point.

A forstner bit is the solution since it doesn't need the center hole to be accurate. It's the bit I use anytime I'm installing tapered plugs because it cuts a cleaner hole than other bits.

Re: How

Barry Irby

You and David are both correct.

On interior doors that fit the opening I remove the remaining screws, move the hinge out of the way and drill the wallowed out hole out with a 3/8" split point twist drill, dab in a little glue, the plug, trim the plug and put the hinge back, drilling the new hole with a Vix Bit, which I encourage a tiny amount toward the stop. That way the screw tend to put the hinge as deep as possible into the mortise. I have done hundreds of these and the bag of plugs is standard kit when flipping a house with pre-hung doors.

It may be a bit crude, but on exterior doors I use 3" deck screws. They may be green, but the heads fit nicely into the countersink in the hinges. I usually replace the screws nearest the stop. Those tow will drive solidly into the framing whereas the the two nearest the knuckle will often drive between the drywall and the framing, doing nothing good. Those two hole are repaired as above with plugs if necessary. I generally install the long screws in the upper and middle hinge because those screws are in tension. The screws in the bottom hinge are in compression. Generally the exterior door are much heavier than interior doors. With these longer screws you can pull the door jamb back at the top, lifting the door on the strike side. Often you can take out the sag, improve the fit across the top and bottom and realign the strike. An impact driver is the tool of choice for this. It's a small miracle. I have used brass screws, but I find many hinges accept No. 9 (Deck) screws better than No. 10's and the brass screws are much more likely to snap off under the influence of the impact driver. The people buying these houses have never noticed the deck screws or don't give a rat's rump. The tenants in my eight rentals don't care either.

On the second house I built I hired some carpenters to hang solid core slab doors. Even almost fifty years ago I was amazed they were willing to hang them for $7 each. I stopped by while they were working and saw them drive the hinge screws in with a hammer. No predrilling a hole, just drive them in like a nail. I was stunned, they said, "Hammer is for putting them in, screwdriver is for taking them out."