Epoxy-Which brand?

Re: Epoxy-Which brand?

Hank Knight

Haven't used T88, but I've used West Systems for years. It has been totally reliable and easy to use. I have no complaints.

Re: Epoxy-Which brand?

Dick Coers

If you get the West System pumps, it's an easy accurate mix.

Re: Epoxy-Which brand?

Brian Anderson

Not that it is T88 nor West but being a gunsmith, I have extensive use of Brownells ACRAGLAS product line. It has two major consistencies one like maple syrup a 4 to 1 mix AND one that is a one to one mix that has a consistency like peanut butter. Eat neither. The maple syrup works well for stock repair ie splits etc. While the peanut butter works for glass bedding and handles. There is a mold release spray as well.

Re: Epoxy-Which brand?

Steve Elliott

I've used both T-88 and West System and like them both. The T-88 has a thicker consistency which is an advantage in some situations.

A couple of months ago I needed the very strongest bond I could get and tried to find good technical information for different brands. I finally gave up and used T-88. It's hard to know for sure whether there's a significant difference between brands.

Re: Epoxy

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In New Jersey

I've used System Three for a number of years. Since I'm generally using small batches, I use a gram scale and mix 100 / 44 by weight ratio. I tint with TransTint concentrates and use microballoons to adjust viscosity. For a larger pour, it's 2 / 1 mix by volume. If I need better penetration into a hairline crack I'll use Mirror Coat. I also use the bottle pumps, but I don't rely on them for the mix ratio.

Re: Epoxy

Tom Norton

Mark, thanks for your reply. I thought that T88 was a 1-1 ratio mix.

Re: Epoxy-Which brand?

Philip Duffy

Excellent comments and spot on. P.

Re: Epoxy

Steve Elliott

Epoxy resin and hardener have different densities. A 2:1 ratio by volume is the same as 100:44 by weight.

I prefer types that have a 1:1 ratio just because it eliminates a possible screw-up but like Mark I use a gram scale even for larger batches. It's quicker and more accurate.

Re: Epoxy

Tom Norton

In the past I have used West System. And actually have a bit left. But the pumps seem to get sticky and not return after being pumped.

Thought I would explore other brands but may just buy a new set up. Found a good $ at West Marine. I think I bought fiberglass cloth there years ago for a project.

Re: Epoxy

John b

My favorite is Raka epoxy. Good product, good service ,good price. Johnb.

Pumped

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In New Jersey

The pump on my resin bottle tends to clog with hardened resin. Clearing it (actually re-melting the resin) involves a FoodSaver vacuum bag and hot (160) water for an hour or two. A P.I.A.

Mold Release

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In New Jersey

Used to use PVA when casting resin, buy a bit of AnchorSeal does quite well and is cheap as well.

Re: Epoxy

William Duffield

In the case of West System, different hardeners have different densities. You can mix 205 or 206 hardeners in the same ratio to resin by volume, but the ratio is a bit different if you mix by weight. This is spelled out clearly in their documentation.

The main reason I prefer West System is their extensive research and documentation into practical uses for their products.

Re: Not interchangeable.

TomD

It is a meaningless question if you don't specify the use.

WEST is the best overall product in the wood, and obviously wooden boat arena. There are thousands of epoxies out there, some with different certified uses, and higher characteristics in certain areas than WEST, based on use.

There are 4 issues with WEST:

1) More people are allergic to the (hardener), than seem to have problems with other brands. This can be easily dealt with if you work clean, which few people do. It is also the case a lot of people are violently allergic to other brands, or the gloves, or use barrier cream under the gloves which is bad news.

2) it is a 1-5 mix with a 3% error ratio, which it has in common with other 1-5 brands. Normally unless a product is 1-5 it won't have full properties, it is a compromise product, however, some of the 1-2 brands like RAKA are very good, if you aren't pushing the materials you probably don't need the higher performance. Unless you use an appropriete level product you won't get the right performance, so I use it with carbon, and in beams and spars, highly loaded fillets, musical applications where a harder product is perceived to be more transparent to sound. WEST staked out the hard epoxy market as a result of their original research with Dupont. So when other epoxies entered the field, they largely criticized hardness and promulgated myths. Don't listen to that stuff, however, you don't normally need to take it that far either.

3) WEST is more viscous that some others, which I don't prefer for glassing, particular plain glass cloth. Once you get into linears and knits, you can probably benefit, if the structure actually required those products, for that mater. So with boats, ideally one glasses every exposed surface, it is a lot easier to use a wet process than a dry one, easier to use rollers than spreaders. But as I say it may be a benefit to use WEST if you need it.

4) West is kinda expensive. If you can get a builder's account or pick up at the factory, it can actually be cheaper. But for retail it is expensive, though the number it sells for is still very near the number it sold for when I first bought it in the late 70s. And you are getting a superior product. It is also a 5 star company with unexcelled commitment, experience, and technical support.

WEST epoxy has also been criticized for blush and UV sensitivity. Again, ti comes down to do you need WEST as these are manageable problems. However, at this point I think they sell their own products that deal with those "problems".

T-88 is a higher viscosity product, so there is little overlap with WEST. One thing that people use it for is spot welded constructions where something like a strand touches down, and you need to secure it. You can modify WEST with fillers, and that is something one really needs, and t-88 is not as versatile by a long shot. But it has a primary working viscosity that is just right for a lot of things. If you have ever seen how they make aircraft by stapling together various components, with light tough pressure, you would know where T-88 is often used.

The only thing I use it for it pressing bows. There you want a material that won't flow under uniform pressure, right out to the point where it is all gone. It has the right viscosity to press to a thin, but still existent glue lie. You are putting on 25 psis, and whatever you use can't just flow lou of the joint at that pressure. It is somewhat arbitrary that t-88 happens to meet that need. However most everyone uses Smooth On for that, and I think it has a glass transition temp more appropriate to hot pressing. I have successfully used west for these functions. You can use WEST for most things, if you know what you are about. At least locally you can't get huge amounts of T-88, and the cost is high.

At the moment I am mostly using RAKA, would prefer to use WEST, but am OK about it for most things. I will get some for specific uses.

I also have in the shop: WEST 5 minute in 2 4 oz squeeze bottles, WEST G-Flex in same quantity; Golfsmith shafting epoxy; T-88 in a 32 oz kit. I also have some epoxy finishes.

One thing you will hear a lot is that all epoxies come from the same few manufacturers and have the same properties. Not true at all.