building a new fence

Re: building a new fence-post footings

Tom dunlap

When I built a fence I was enlightened to a way of setting post footings in pea gravel not cement. It was a bead slapper! I know that wood lasts a long time when it is either dry or saturated Decay microorganisms thrive in between. Damp is their fav. Read up on it if you're not familiar.

Tom

Re: building a new fence-post footings

Kneale Brownson

I worked with some guys that used to build house foundations from pressure-treated wood products. Pea gravel was the footing material instead of concrete. It was in the building code.

Here's a link to PT wood fastener codes http://www.mhpublicworks.us/files/2013/12/Fasters-to-use-with-Treated-Wood-Product.pdf

Re: building a new fence

Pete in Holland MI

Treated lumber for burried ground contact has a higher level of treatment than the garden variety of treated lumber. Houses with wood foundations need a different material. If you are looking into a for ever fence, y you might look into this.

Garden variety treated posts around SW Michigan, I have seen those types of 6x6 posts eaten thru 50% after 10 years of service......always at the ground level location of the post.

Re: building a new fence

Jack Guzman from Maine

Ceramic coated deck screws. They come in many different lengths and either have star head or combo square/phillips head drive options. Any hardware store or lumberyard should have them.---Jack

what I do

John K Jordan

I put a lot of posts in the ground around the farm. I like to put gravel in the bottom of the hole, align the post, add more gravel and tamp around the post, then add a collar of concrete at at the top. This protects the wood at the surface but lets moisture drain out the bottom. I sometimes make a little square form of 2x lumber, set it an inch or so into the ground and fill it with concrete when pouring the collar. This insures water and dirt can't keep the wood wet at the surface.

If the post is significantly load bearing I like to pour a reinforced concrete "punch pad" deep in the bottom of the hole, over some compacted gravel, then with thin layer of gravel between the pad and the bottom of the post.

I've also experimented with finishes over various woods. If well dried, a generous coat of BLO seems to soak well into the wood and protect the surface on wood I use for siding, wood doors, trailers, and tool handles. When applied to just test areas I can see a difference for at least 3-4 years then it needs another application. Non-PT wood on barn doors where I applied this soon after sawing (and drying) still looks new after a bunch of years.

I've bought PT wood from the lumber yards and the lable stated "not for direct burial." Some of these boards, for example a couple of 2x12s I put directly on ground under cans for chicken feed, are almost totally destroyed by rot and insects after about 10 years.

On the other hand, I've bought bundles of 6-7" round PT fence post directly from the treatment companies. I forget the numbers but these were specially treated for direct burial. I drove them 3' into the ground with a hydraulic fence post driver and after over a dozen years I see no sign of deterioration, even where they enter the ground.

For an above-ground wood fence without significant loads I wouldn't be afraid of setting 6" PT posts from the big box into gravel.

I use the ceramic coated deck screws for nearly all construction, fences and otherwise (except for the time I found 5lb boxes of stainless steel deck screws at a salvage place for $5 a box. I bought every box they had.)

JKJ

Ceramic coated deck screws for the pickets,

Keith Newton

If you don't have a collated screw gun, this may be the job to buy one for, unless you have a friend to loan you one.

I've quit using screws for most joist situations that will be under a shear load. While the ceramic coating may not be a problem on screws, I'm finding too many broken screws to have any confidence in them. I'd rather drive a hot dip 16d nail for that situation.

Stainless steel nails

john in lutz

In Florida we use a lot PT or cypress pickets. If you have a nail gun you can use stainless steel nails. A lot easier than screws and while expensive for nails they are about the cost of screws.

Re: what I do

Barry Irby

You have gotten a lot of good information. Read it carefully and soak it up.

Let me reinforce a few things. I live in a house with a Treated wood foundation/basement. Almost forty years. Did the research back in the day.

My grandfather said, "Only a city slicker would set a post in concrete." The advice about setting the posts in pea gravel is correct. Don't use little rounded river stones for this. Use broken stone that is angular and free of sand or "fines". Put several inches into the bottom of the hole and pound it tight with either the post of a manageable piece of 4 x 4. Stand the post on it and get it into the correct position and brace it Plumb. Set the corner posts first and then use a string to line up the intermediate posts. Once you have all the posts standing in their holes and lined up, maybe even after installing the horizontal rails tamp the remaining fravel into the holes. The reason for the angular stone is it will "lock up" and hold the posts. Rounded river pebbles will not lock up and don't hold the posts nearly as well.

There are three grades of treated wood, (maybe more). That for above ground use, that for direct burial, and that for marine use. Unless you live near the coast or a major river you may never see the Marine version. If you can find it, it would make excellent posts. At the very least use that rated for direct burial.

Pine, Southern Yellow Pine, is the only variety I know that is treated on a commercial scale. It has and open internal structure that will accept the treatment. Examine the pieces you buy and try not to buy any that have "Heart Wood". The reddish color will be the giveaway. While pine heartwood is naturally decay resistant, it will not accept treatment and will rot much faster than properly treated wood.

Stainless steel screws or nails are desirable if they are not the low grade stainless. Search out higher grade stainless. The lower grade stuff is not as durable as ceramic screws. Stainless can bring an element of "Bling" and be distracting.

This is the tip of the iceberg. I could go on forever.