New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

Re: New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

Ed Wozniak-Buffalo, NY

Normally 10 AWG wire is required for a 30 Amp circuit breaker. 20 Amp circuit breakers usually have 12 AWG wire associated with them. I would see how the saw works with the 20 Amp breaker before upgrading the wiring.

Re: New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

JL

Ditto.

10 AWG with a 30 amp breaker.

That's what I have w/ my 5 HP saw (not a SawStop).

Re: New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

Bruce, a MN Galoot

Is that on a 220v circuit?

Re: New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

Grant Smith

Hi Doug,

Here's how I would think about this:

The breaker is there to prevent the wire between the breaker and plug from overheating, and therefore prevent a fire. Don't install a larger breaker on existing wire unless you are sure it meets code and is safe.

In most cases, a 20A breaker will have 12 AWG wire between it and the load. Know, however, that there are many caveats, exceptions, and limitations that come in to play in the electrical code. I am no electrician.

To keep it simple, DON'T install a 30A breaker on 12AWG wire.

Now, some comparisons to help you decide if you need to upgrade to 30A circuit:

When I set up shop, I installed a dozen or so 20A twist lock receptacles (L6-20R). That was nine years ago, and I have the following machines plugged in to those receptacles on 20A breakers (L6-20P). Some even share breakers if I don't expect simultaneous use.

Unisaw 3HP

Delta 15" planer 3HP

Oneida 3HP Dust Gorilla cyclone

Delta 1.5HP Drill press

Delta 1.5HP jointer

Rolair 5 HP 60 gallon air compressor (Leeson US made motor)

The Rolair compressor is a two stage 150 psi unit, and it kicks on when the pressure drops to 125 or so. If anything starts under load, it is an air compressor or dust collector. I was pretty sure I would have to install a 30A breaker when I brought it home. I decided to try it on a 20A breaker and sure enough, works fine on 55' of 12 AWG wire in conduit...with a 20A square D breaker.

Your mileage may vary, and given the sawstop's penchant to trip when there are power fluctuations, you might consider just adding the 30A circuit (with #10 wire, if it is a reasonably short run). The cost of upgrading in terms of materials is about equivalent to one trip due to a power issue.

I would add that I have a 3HP saw, cut lots of thick 2" plus slabs and similar materials and have never once thought the saw was under powered. No bogging down, no loss of power. I'd love to have a Sawstop for the peace of mind, but not sure I would go 5HP as a hobbyist. Do what makes sense for you though.

FWIW,

Grant in Iowa

Edit: The above is all on 220VAC single phase.

Re: New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

Doug Reynolds

Yes, a 220 v circuit. Single phase.

Agree on the 5HP

Bill Tindall, E.Tn.

I have a 1.5 HP on my Delta Unisaw and have never seen any need for a larger motor. I work almost entirely hardwood lumber. Short of production ripping of thick hardwood I can't imagine a reason to put a 5 HP motor on a table saw. If anyone is slowing a 3 HP motor ripping 8/4 hardwood they are using the wrong blade or a dull one.

A little different take,

Keith Newton

Doug, I have to ask, How many times did you choke your PM 66 with the 3hp down?

I suspect the answer is never, so why not order the new Sawstop with a 3 hp motor, and keep the 1000 - 2000$ not to mention the wiring cost. Better yet, send me half what you saved, and we'll both be very happy. Since your retired, I'm sure 3hp is more than enough power for your needs. If it seems like you need more power, your probably not using the right blade for the task.

Agree

Bruce, a MN Galoot

I have the 1.75 hp Sawstop and routinely cut 2“ thick maple. No need for more power. Although I have 220 in the garage, I run the saw on 110 and have never tripped the breaker.

Re: Agree on the 5HP

Brian Holcombe

I have no horse in this race, but I wanted to comment that big HP saws are usually powering large blades. So the HP might not be so outrageous if the blades it can handle are larger or if it accepts a moulder head.

Re: A little different take,

Doug Reynolds

I use sharp and clean Forrest blades. As I do more research I am agreeing the 5hp motor is probably overkill.

It may be easier to resale but, given I'll probably dead, not sure I'll care how much the kids get for the saw.

I can use the savings to upgrade my dust collection.

P.S. Don't mean to sound morbid or anything. My woodworking club gets donations from some widows who say, "Just get this s--t out of here".

Re: A little different take,

Virgil Johnson

Another satisfied 3 HP saw owner. I've been using my saw for well over 25 years and have never needed more power.

Re: New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

Jim Dillon

Doug, given your needs, yet another vote for staying with a 3-hp saw - whatever the brand. That would avoid any electrical issues as well. If you are hot to buy something, then I would give serious consideration to the 3-hp Saw Stop for its safety technology. However, is there something your Powermatic 3-hp won't do? While I have been very satisfied with my 3-hp TS for 22 years, if I were buying today, I would buy the Saw Stop. Jim

Re: New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

Ken Krawford

"a single phase 5hp Saw Stop which (per the brochure) draws 19.7 volts."

I assume you mean 19.7 amps, not volts.

Ditto what Bruce said.

Re: New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

Doug Reynolds

Jim: My upgrade is motivated by three things:

1. Safety. I degloved (peeled all the skin and meat off the palm side of) my dominate hand thumb on a drum sander not, a table saw. Docs were able to sew everything back in the right place and it looks normal but, it is still mostly numb. I read, understood but, forgot to follow the instructions that came with my power tools. Just making a slight adjustment and didn't think I needed to turn the machine off. I know.

2. Dust collection. The Powermatic 66 just dumps the saw dust to the bottom of the cabinet and spews it all over the table top.

3. A large sliding table. I've made crosscut sleds but, have been able to use a slider and they are very nice.

I'm going with the 3hp single phase.

Thanks for all the comments, Doug

Re: A little different take,

William Duffield

Why do you think a 5 hp SawStop would be easier to sell than a 3 hp? Whoever bought it would probably have the same cost and installation issues with the power supply as you are facing.

I've never bogged down my 3 hp Industrial SawStop (single phase 220 v.).

SawStop doesn't make a 12" tablesaw, so the heaviest load you might regularly put on it is with a wide (about 1") 8" dado stack. If you once-in-a-while rip reaction wood and pinch the blade, even a 7.5 hp 3 phase motor could come to a screeching stop (Use a wedge).

Re: New saw purchase requires electrical upgrade

Jim Dillon

Doug, thanks for replying and good luck with that thumb! I now have a better understanding of your thinking. Dust collection on my TS is also poor and I wish it was better. Happy shopping for that new TS!! Jim