Hammer silent power planner/thicknesser

Are they not...

Brian Roberts

four sided inserts?

Re: Hammer silent power planner/thicknesser

Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia)

Hi Sven

I have had a Hammer A3-31 for about 3 or 4 years and only recently turned the carbide inserts. I assume you have turned the inserts?!!!! Each has 4 sides. At my current rate, the inserts should last at least 10-12 years before replacement.

If you need to replace your inserts, I can recommend a fellow Aussie, who has been selling inserts and blades (and router bits) to fit a number of machines. I have purchased a number of items from him, including replacement inserts (for the future). Much cheaper than Felder, and the same quality, as far as I can tell. His website is: https://sje-tools.com/14-carbide-inserts

It is also worthwhile to get a preset torque driver to install the inserts. I have one, but I cannot recall from who I purchased it.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: Hammer silent power planner/thicknesser

Svante Nilsson

Hi,

Well, I am about to change to side 3 now - one each year (when I used high speed steel cutters it was 3 times a year). The first time with a fresh cutting edge is like honyemoon. You can plan any wood, even wild grain and knots without tearout. After a few months the tear-out on wild grain starts.

For people working with straight grain they probably last several years, but I plan mostly wide boards of ash and oak with irregular grain so when the tear-out starts to be severe I have no choice. I do am an entusiatic woodworker but my Hammer seldom works more than half an hour per day.

Anyhow, no thoughts if the inserts can be re-sharpen?

Regards,

Svante

Suspect

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In New Jersey

that the wood's grain is not your real problem, but rather embedded silica, sand, dirt, etc. Your inserts are carbide (?) and mere direction of the grain should not matter to their retention of an edge.

If, OTH, you're planning "wild" root ball and butt material (or hi-silica tropicals) which will have lots of abrasives incorporated, the rapid wear on your planer is to be expected and viewed as part of the cost of the material.

I thought about putting a Shellix [sp] head on my planer but since I can use my Performax as an abrasive planer on anything, the cost of the insert head didn't make sense for me.

Re: Hammer silent power planner/thicknesser

Derek Cohen (in Perth, Australia)

Anyhow, no thoughts if the inserts can be re-sharpen?

Hi Svante

It is possible to sharpen the inserts using a diamond plate. I think that a jig would be a must to create a repeatable angle.

My concern with doing so is that any discrepancy in the amount of steel removed may well transfer to the surface of the wood.

The carbide inserts from Steve at SJE Tools are cheap enough when considered over a 5+ year lifespan.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Re: Hammer silent power planner/thicknesser

Larry Clinton At Frankfort, (Central) Indiana

I am quite sure the inserts could be resharpened, but I would imagine the cost would exceed the cost of new inserts. To sharpen properly would require an accurate jig, as the inserts must be very accurate in height to work properly. Then it would require at least 4 setups to sharpen the four sides. I am really not sure how many times they could be sharpened as you could only remove the material from the outside edges of the inserts. As has been stated there are after market vendors that sell the inserts at much lower cost than the machine makers. I am 100% sure NO planer or joiner machine manufacturer produces these inserts so the aftermarket vendors probably are selling the identical inserts.

Re: Hammer silent power planner/thicknesser

John Foster

Not quite the same, but at work we had a Vecoplan chipper with very similar 4 sided inserts. We sharpened them onsite. we sharpened all sides at once with a custom shaped stone with a spherical face that matched the concave of the cutter. You would need a good drill press or vertical mill and a milling vise. The vise would be setup to accurately centre the cutter under the spindle and the vertical travel/depth stop would be set to just lightly hone the cutter. Might not be worth it for you, we had several sets of cutters on a two week rotation. Might be fun to rig something up if you are also a home shop machinist.

Re: A Dumb Question?

William Duffield

Why can't you sharpen the other surface of the cutting edges? Lay the cutter down flat on the diamond lapping plate and slide it back and forth under your finger, counting strokes. Do them all the same. Even if you only get one resharpening from them before you are down to the top of the bolt head, it has still halved the cost of the inserts. It is a technique that works for circular marking knife cutters.

Re: A Dumb Answer

Mark Mandell - Gone Round In New Jersey

Taking anything off the top of the cutter requires that you have to do that for each cutter on the planer head lest you get high-low lines running down the board. The high quality of these machine's surfaces depend on the uniform height of all the cutters.

Doesn't seem like they've been designed/made with resharpening in mind.

Re: A Dumb Question?

Svante Nilsson

Hi,

In two years, when all 4 sides of the inserts are dull - I will give this a try....

Smart Answer

Bill Tindall, E.Tn.

I presume these are carbide. Try sharpening one on a diamond plate. Report back how long it takes to remove 10 microns of carbide from one face of one insert. I predict hours based on my experienced trying to sharpen a carbide router bit.

The M42 steel knives in my planer last for hundreds of bd ft of lumber planed. I would think that a hobbyist woodworker would never wear out an insert planing clean wood.

Yes...I believe they could.....

Brian Roberts

be sharpened.

To attempt to sharpen the edges would compromise the way the inserts register to the cutter head.

However, with access to a surface grinder it would be quite simple to make a flat ground fixture to screw the inserts down to. (steel plate drilled and tapped with enough holes to hold the whole set of inserts....ground dead flat)

Then simply dust a thousandth or so (with a diamond wheel) from the top surface of the inserts ....all in one operation....so to speak.

But....not cost effective to do one set for one machine.

We routinely....

Brian Roberts

grind flats, by hand, on the shanks of solid carbide tooling to accept the set screw in an end mill holder.

We use a decent quality green wheel in a bench grinder.

Putting a 1/4" wide flat on a 3/4" diameter end mill takes less than 30 seconds.

Re: We routinely....

Bill Tindall, E.Tn.

I resharpen carbide lathe bits on a silicon carbide wheel. Misenheimer routinely grinds dull router bits good as new with a wheel in a few seconds (about $4 a bit). These facts provide no hint at how slow the hand lapping Mr. Duffield suggested might be. At least in my case I got nowhere with a coarse diamond plate in 30 min.

Re: We routinely....

Svante Nilsson

Hi,

I have sharpen my HSS planner cutters many times and although they were 460 mm (18 inch) it did not take more than half an hour for all three. Carbide is as you say another issue. I probably better forget that idea and prepare to make an investment in new inserts when they are dull.

I am still surprised that several of you can get good result with the same cutter edge for years.... After using the planner for a year I noticed the increased tearout on an oak board. I took board to the Felder both at a woodworking show and we tried it on their demo machine and the result was ofcourse perfect. I got the advice to rotate the inserts - so I did and to my surprise I got flawless result. The only way I can get acceptable surface quality is to make very shallow cuts at a very low feeding rate.

Anyhow thanks for all interesting comments.