Hand Tools Archive

Subject:
The Beach Comparison...

David Weaver
http://www3.telus.net/BrentBeach/Sharpen/bladetest.html

At some point, I may take metallurgical microscope pictures of edges - I have a better scope than beach used, but you can see the same thing I can see (and this scope is what allowed me to see why the washita and A2 don't seem to ever get the sharpness you're looking for, no matter how long you work A2 on a washita or how light of a touch you want to have).

I have this scope to sell razors and to grade stones and what they do on razors. You can't really do it without a decent metallurgical scope - either one.

So, I would like to compare the LN A2 iron as I tested irons at one point on maple, and the A2 irons at that time were the best in edge uniformity. It isn't just cryo treatment that made them better as I had an IBC double iron pair that woodcraft sent me and they didn't test as well as the LN iron - I stroke tested them, counted. A real pain in the arse.

What I found with A2 is that the more uniformly an edge failed, the longer the plane would stay in the cut. I didn't know at the time what I saw except that more edge uniformity meant more longevity.

I think Brent's LN testing information is not very useful, so compare the Knight iron pictures to the LV A2 (let alone the shepherd - I had a shepherd kit, which may have had the worst quality iron that I've ever seen, an the cap iron was an afterthought - like tinfoil on top of a piece of bar stock).

http://www3.telus.net/BrentBeach/Sharpen/Knighttest.html

http://www3.telus.net/BrentBeach/Sharpen/LVA2test.html

Beach is fascinated with wear bevel length, but I don't think he grasps edge thickness where the wear bevel occurs.

Knight's iron has a similar wear bevel length to the LV A2, but perhaps it's uniformly more established over its length. However, what I've seen in my own irons (with being able to see visible wear bevels on irons that are still cutting well - visible to the naked eye), suggests that the Knight iron provides better results and better perceived sharpness relative to fresh off of the stone through the cycle to the point shown here and will probably stay in the cut longer with a double iron (last longer - as in, a case where an O1 iron lasts longer than one in a2).

LN's pictures do look similar to this.

Hock's iron doesn't far as well in this photo, and at one point, I got a couple of hock replacement irons in A2 and O1 and the O1 irons lasted about 2/3rds as long planing panels in my first all-hand-tool project (a piece of case work) and I concluded at the time that they just couldn't last as long from a technical standpoint as O1. I suspect the issue now is that the Hock irons aren't on par with better O1 irons.

Messages In This Thread

Few more years of experience gives question for lv
Hock irons
Re: Hock irons
Bull
Re: Bull
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
super hard - and George's opinion
Unfortunately, I don't know George...
Re: Unfortunately, I don't know George...
Re: Unfortunately, I don't know George...
Here's the thing...
If you like A2, you'll find them..
Fender custom shop guitars ..
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
One more contrary to the beach page...
The Beach Comparison...
Re: to be clear...
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
Fallacy
No
Still
How LV designs tools
I may do the test...
Re: How LV designs tools
Even with a milling machine...
Re: Even with a milling machine...
Re: Even with a milling machine...
agreed
the setup and measurement..
Re: the setup and measurement..
Re: Even with a milling machine...
Re: Still
Bill turned the wheel
Agree, mostly...
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
Steve Knight’s irons
Re: Steve Knight’s irons
CPM-3V Elliott irons
Re: CPM-3V Elliott irons *PIC*
Re: CPM-3V Elliott irons
From Brent Beach's tests...
Standing on the point of a pin.
Re: Standing on the point of a pin.
Re: Steve Knight’s irons
Re: Few more years of experience gives question fo
Totally paranoid. I agree.
Re: Totally paranoid. I agree.
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