Hand Tools Archive

Subject:
Japanese steel and PM V11 *LINK*
Response To:
Re: Inside Joke / story ()

Kees
I have just rerad Derek´s test of some chisels, a year ago. He tested several PM steels and some old fashioned carbon steel ones. The strong point of his test is how he tested the amount of wear. Instead of looking at micro photographs, which don´t really tell you much, he tested the sharpness through paring end grain pine. That´s a real sharpness test, just like how Kawai-Kato test sharpness with force transducers in their planing machine. Dereks test is a lot cheaper of coarse!

His conclusion was that the PM chisels where a bear to sharpen and needed diamonds. On the chopping test they really didn´t outclass the Japanese chisel, which was easy to sharpen to a very sharp edge and kept on to that edge for a very long time.

I have similar experience with chopping a lot of dovetails in Jatoba. My older Berg chisels needed to be resharpened after every pin, the Koyamaichi's easilly hold up for a drawerside. I polished the edges after each side just to prevent catastrophic failure of the edge, but they sure were still reasonably sharp.

There is another test on Dereks page about the paring/planing ability of these steels. The Japanese one again took a very sharp edge early on on the test, but didn´t hold it quite as long as the others.

In other words, the Japanese really manage to create some very good chisels with simple tool steels. They are easy to sharpen, get freakingly sharp and hold an edge for a long time. The ability of PM steels to hold an edge for longer time seems especially aparent in a paring/planig situation, not so much when chopping.

The new PM V11 stuff from LV looks promissing. If it really lives up to the testdata from LV in their sales brochure on the web, it´s going to be a succes. I agree with Bill that the planing data with MDF and almost zero clearance angle looks a bit suspicious. I am very curious how this stuff will hold up in real life. I´ve never liked the idea of the PM steels, because they seemingly need a new sharpening regime with diamonds. So now LV comes with a PM steel that's reasonably easy to sharpen, they might have a winner.

Messages In This Thread

Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Re: Inside Joke / story
Japanese steel and PM V11 *LINK*
more picking on Kees
Re: more picking on Kees
Re: more picking on Kees
Re: PM V11 and LV sharpening mastery + the truth
Where were all you sages back then.....?
Re: Where were all you sages back then.....?
Finck
comparing apples and oranges
Re: comparing apples and oranges
Modern steel
Re: Modern steel
Proposed amendment to Kee`s post
Re: Proposed amendment to Kee`s post
Re: Proposed amendment to Kee`s post
data to disagree with your conclusion *PIC*
Drawing a conclusion
minor corrections
Re: minor corrections
A purveyor of CPM 3V chisels
Re: minor corrections
working porperties of 3V
Some people`s reasoning stumps me
Re: Some people`s reasoning stumps me
that was the conclusion I came to
Re: Some people`s reasoning stumps me
Re: data to disagree with your conclusion
Chisels don't quietly wear away.
Re: Chisels don't quietly wear away.
Flaw in Woodcentral Web site/PIC added *PIC*
Re: Flaw in Woodcentral Web site/PIC added
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Swiss steel?
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Shut your festering gob, you nit!
Re: Shut your festering gob, you nit!
Re: Shut your festering gob, you nit! *LINK*
the brass weight..
can you believe that there are people
Re: can you believe that there are people
Re: If you have a stake..
Re: Shut your festering gob, you nit!
Don't read too much into that, Curt
Steel and Tools
Re: Steel and Tools
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: When you throw out the holteys...
Of course...
Re: Of course...
I did not sneer
Re: I did not sneer
Re: I did not sneer
Re: I did not sneer
Re: I did not sneer
Re: I did not sneer
Well..
Re: Well..
Re: Well..
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: Might as well start the LV PM-V11 Thread
Re: The News
Excellent analysis *NM*
Re: Not me, dude...
Re: Not me, dude...
Missing the point
Re: I was going to wait a while..
I too subscribe to your rule
Re: I too subscribe to your rule
It's new !! so what
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